What's with the "we don't deserve it"

[cantab]

We don't deserve to go to space because simply we can't and i am not talking about some Mars mission or other mission in our solar system. I guess "go to space" was meant to be colonize other planets. That's something that's not going to happen with things beeing like they are at the moment. Looking from this perspective we don't deserve it.

That's what I was thinking. Let's say some aliens just give us a cool spaceship that can fly us to Mars. We wouldn't deserve that, we wouldn't have done anything towards it. But when we design and build our own spaceship to get to Mars, then we - both humanity as a whole and whatever group has built the ship - will absolutely deserve it. We'll have earnt it.

[DJEN]

"Why not milk the Earth dry in a more efficient manner instead of going out to a place that no industry can be formed and sustained?"

This is my argument against space travel. I bet all of you will agree with me.

However, it is a fact that space does have enough resources for humans to survive and thrive. If technology advances and overcomes fundamental constraints, one would say: "Why not?"

Of course. This time, human nature will need to pace up with technology. For power without maturity will surely lead all to a pit of doom, created through apathy.

[rtxoff]

If all of us individually were to judge ourselves based on the worst that our race has to offer, we would all be committing suicide.

It's a thing judging yourself and another judging the rest of the world. You could come to different convictions. Also people tend not to be objective when judging themselves, it happens all the time in every aspect of your daily life.

For example girls with anorexia weighing 50kg with 1,70m body height thinking of themselves that they are fat when looking into the mirror. Also there is the exact opposite, fat girls seeing themselves as photo models when looking into the mirror.

I could write an endless list of such misjudgings happening in our society. When it comes to judging if someone deserves something or not, matters get very delicate, it is a very touchy subject to discuss and probably everyone has their own perspectives about this. For an example, a worker that worked all his life very hard physical work will have his doubt's about his boss deserving the amount of richness he has. The boss will have a totaly different view about this matter. People are loosing more and more the willingness or ability to open their eyes for different perspectives and views. We are becoming an society of egoists only looking after our own butts. I don't think this will develop into anything good, i think it is only a matter of time until the next ultimate MCA in a socioeconomic sense. We are getting distracted by many forms of entertainment but that won't help when people start starving and robbing walmarts because they don't have money for food and no way of earning some.

[DJEN]

So gpisic, what is your opinion regarding my statement?

[rtxoff]

So gpisic, what is your opinion regarding my statement?

Why i would like to discuss your statement i think it goes beyond the topic of this thread of humans deserving to go to space, also i fear that my opinion would generate unnecessary heat.

[Thomas988]

rant

I have read, on multiple occasions, comments on Facebook where people say "We can land a man on the moon but we can't find the plane in the Indian ocean?" or "We shouldn't go anywhere until we fix our problems here" or even "When we do go to Mars we'll pollute it and destroy the planet. We should stay on Earth."

Argument 1: Oceans are big. Oceans are deep. They're not kiddie pools.

Argument 2: Our problems will never be gone. And, as vger put it, what if the solution to our problems to go somewhere else?

Argument 3: My least favorite argument in the history of mankind. Why don't people realize how hard it is to put anything on another planet? By no means are we going to be seeing privatized trips to Mars within our lifetimes. And pollution? I'm sure there are international laws prohibiting us to contaminate other celestial bodies.

/rant

[SemiaCloud]

I believe we deserve to go to space. As long as every program develops all of its spacecraft on its own.

[Bill Phil]

We do deserve to explore space, since it's been done before civilization even began.

Earth is in space. And we explored it. We explored the sky, charting it, remembering it.

So, we do deserve it.

[Motokid600]

rant

I have read, on multiple occasions, comments on Facebook where people say "We can land a man on the moon but we can't find the plane in the Indian ocean?" or "We shouldn't go anywhere until we fix our problems here" or even "When we do go to Mars we'll pollute it and destroy the planet. We should stay on Earth."

Argument 1: Oceans are big. Oceans are deep. They're not kiddie pools.

Argument 2: Our problems will never be gone. And, as vger put it, what if the solution to our problems to go somewhere else?

Argument 3: My least favorite argument in the history of mankind. Why don't people realize how hard it is to put anything on another planet? By no means are we going to be seeing privatized trips to Mars within our lifetimes. And pollution? I'm sure there are international laws prohibiting us to contaminate other celestial bodies.

/rant

Also... Mars needs to be polluted in order to heat the planet up and trap gases. ( The right kind of pollution ) So there's also that.

I've heard people say the same.

I forget where I heard this, but I remember someone say.

"Spain had problems back in the 1400's. Spain today still has problems."

If people think we have to become a utopian society before exploring space then we're doomed. No.

We need to explore space in order to become a utopian society.

[tg626]

*shrugs* comparing Columbus' travel to going to Mars is pretty retarded anyway.

Given the technology of the time, navigation, ship construction, medicine, food preservation, etc. I'd say its a very apt comparison.

Anyone sailing that far out to sea in that time had a very real chance of never returning.

[xcorps]

Given the technology of the time, navigation, ship construction, medicine, food preservation, etc. I'd say its a very apt comparison.

Anyone sailing that far out to sea in that time had a very real chance of never returning.

It's a horrible comparison.

A) Columbus wasn't trying to find anything new. He was trying to prove that the distance to Japan from the Azores was only 3700km, based on his interpretation of the Biblical verse " "Upon the third day Thou didst command that the waters should be gathered in the seventh part of the earth; six parts hast Thou dried up and kept them, with the intent that some of these, being planted by God and tilled, might serve Thee. " from 2 Esrades. Clearly he was wrong, which is why he was turned down by Portugal, Portugal, Genoa, Venice, England, and Spain.

Columbus wasn't after scientific knowledge. He was after the title "Admiral of the Ocean Sea" and revenue from newly established trade routes.

C) Columbus didn't go where no man had gone before.

D) There is nobody on Mars to enslave.

Edited April 12, 2015 by xcorps

[Nibb31]

I believe we deserve to go to space. As long as every program develops all of its spacecraft on its own.

What's with the necro-posting just to post a one-liner like that?

There's nothing we "deserve". We are humans. We are hunter-gatherers. We follow the bison and we settle where there are resources. We migrate when it increases our comfort and safety and provides a better life for our children. Those are universal values that have always governed everything humans have done for thousands of years.

Going to space does nothing to increase our comfort or safety or to provide a better life. In fact, it's quite the opposite. There are no space bison. In the future, there might be a point where space travel becomes relevant, but for now, it's just exploration and science.

Edited April 12, 2015 by Nibb31

[tg626]

It's a horrible comparison.

A) Columbus wasn't trying to find anything new. He was trying to prove that the distance to Japan from the Azores was only 3700km, based on his interpretation of the Biblical verse " "Upon the third day Thou didst command that the waters should be gathered in the seventh part of the earth; six parts hast Thou dried up and kept them, with the intent that some of these, being planted by God and tilled, might serve Thee. " from 2 Esrades. Clearly he was wrong, which is why he was turned down by Portugal, Portugal, Genoa, Venice, England, and Spain.

Columbus wasn't after scientific knowledge. He was after the title "Admiral of the Ocean Sea" and revenue from newly established trade routes.

C) Columbus didn't go where no man had gone before.

D) There is nobody on Mars to enslave.

Fair points all, and lets not forget genocide in the name of god, but my focus was on the idea of setting out on such a journey not the result or motivation.

[m4v]

Given the technology of the time, navigation, ship construction, medicine, food preservation, etc. I'd say its a very apt comparison.

Anyone sailing that far out to sea in that time had a very real chance of never returning.

With that argument, then any suicidal enterprise is an apt comparison to going to space. Columbus was either too brave or too stupid, the least kind of person you want to have in a spaceship (except in KSP).

edit: And the technology of the time was capable of sending you to America (what Columbus did) but not for circumnavigate the globe without stops (what Columbus tried to do), so it doesn't change that is a bad comparison.

Edited April 15, 2015 by m4v

[CelticCossack51]

Mars is the destination that we deserve. But not the one we need...

Well, we do actually need Mars to restart and to leave humanity's fossil fuel addiction. Some people do not feel ready for Mars because it's another planet and it's a long trip there. They may say that we don't have the technology to do it and that a mission involves humans that may die on the voyage.

But I believe that we can do it, if we just believe. *starts worshiping a statue of Earth* Forget the believe part, we are just missing a few things like cryobeds. (and funds)