Optimised PC for KSP

[Oafman]

I need to get a new PC, at a reasonable price, and could use some advice from the knowledgeable KSP community.

KSP is by far the most demanding thing I use a PC for. I play no other games which require anything serious, and will just use it for internet and downloads etc, so I can put together a PC specifically with KSP in mind.

I love playing with many mods, as they add so much to the game, so I guess I need a lot of RAM as a starting point. But having said that, I am under the impression that the game is limited to using 4GB RAM anyway. At least in 32 bit. So is there any reason to have a lot more than this?

I want this to be relatively future proofed, so with a less buggy 64 bit version an imminent possibility, will this enable the game to use more RAM? Should I be looking for 8GB RAM, or even 16GB?

And though I don't really understand what it is, I gather from other threads that a new version of Unity will also change the way the game runs. Will this enable the game to use more RAM? If so, how much am I likely to need?

Aside from RAM, what else should I look for? How good a processor should I look for? Any particular type? How important is the graphics card? I need the whole thing to be less than £500/$750, not including peripheral stuff like monitor which I already have. So I can't go for anything super expensive, but hopefully I don't really need to.

Is there anything else I should be looking for?

Any advice would be very welcome.

[briansun1]

Well for RAM the standared/bare minimum right now is 8GB. As for CPU with $750 you could probably get an i5. This question would be better asked over here though.

[Xaiier]

You'll want a powerful processor, likely an Intel i5/i7, prioritizing speed over number of cores. KSP does not need much of a GPU, and ram is cheap enough that you can pick that at your discretion.

This is a great comparison thread: http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/42877

[briansun1]

You'll want a powerful processor, likely an Intel i5/i7, prioritizing speed over number of cores. KSP does not need much of a GPU, and ram is cheap enough that you can pick that at your discretion.

This is a great comparison thread: http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/42877

He will probably want an i5 as i7's extra cores don't help much in KSP. And i5's a cheaper.

[Oafman]

Well for RAM the standared/bare minimum right now is 8GB. As for CPU with $750 you could probably get an i5. This question would be better asked over here though.

8GB? So I'm wrong about the game being limited to 4GB?

That thread is interesting, and somewhere I have never looked. But from a cursory glance it seems more about people constructing their own PCs. As in, buying separate components and putting them together themselves. Which I'm not about to try and do.

You'll want a powerful processor, likely an Intel i5/i7, prioritizing speed over number of cores. KSP does not need much of a GPU, and ram is cheap enough that you can pick that at your discretion.

This is a great comparison thread: http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/42877

So more processing power, but a higher number of cores is not important? That is useful, thanks

And, errr... is GPU the same thing as graphics card?

I'll read through that thread, looks like it could be very helpful

He will probably want an i5 as i7's extra cores don't help much in KSP. And i5's a cheaper.

Yeah, i7s seem to be quite pricey, so if I can get away with an i5 without significantly lower performance, that sounds like a better option

[briansun1]

8GB? So I'm wrong about the game being limited to 4GB?

It is limited to 4gb if you use the 32 bit version. However you need extra ram to run your computer. So for example you you only have 4 gb only 3 are used on your game

That thread is interesting, and somewhere I have never looked. But from a cursory glance it seems more about people constructing their own PCs. As in, buying separate components and putting them together themselves. Which I'm not about to try and do.

They still know a lot about computers and the computer people frequent there the most.

So more processing power, but a higher number of cores is not important? That is useful, thanks

Yes

And, errr... is GPU the same thing as graphics card?

Also yes

I'll read through that thread, looks like it could be very helpful

Yeah, i7s seem to be quite pricey, so if I can get away with an i5 without significantly lower performance, that sounds like a better option

You can. The only real benefit you will see when useing a i7 vs a i5 is in things like Photoshop and video editing.

[Alshain]

I wouldn't plan your computer for what the game is now. They will fix 64 bit eventually, and probably fairly soon. I wouldn't recommend less than 8GB for any computer being built today with the intent to be used for gaming.

The same for multi-core, when Unity 5 gets here they will be usefull however, an i5 is fine for a "budget gaming PC". (that's almost a contradiction really.. "budget" and "gaming")

Graphics is less important for KSP, and a card a few generations old can be cheap and budget friendly while still providing "enough". I have a EVGA 560Ti and I love it, it goes around $200 right now, but I have not done any price comparisons. If you can find better for the same price or close enough, take it. Nvidia's numbering system is a bit confusing (so is AMD, but I know nothing of them anymore) Good gaming cards generally have a x60 or higher as the last number. The x50's might do ok in a pinch. Don't go lower than that. The first number is the generation, so mine is generation 5 model 60, the generation is far less important, but if you can find something 1 or 2 generations ago, it will most likely be cheaper. So if given the choice of dropping the model number or the generation due to price, drop the generation get the higher model.

AMD Radeons are certainly cheaper. But it's a case of "you get what you pay for". I've never seen a Radeon I didn't hate.

Edited October 7, 2014 by Alshain

[briansun1]

I wouldn't plan your computer for what the game is now. They will fix 64 bit eventually, and probably fairly soon. I wouldn't recommend less than 8GB for any computer being built today with the intent to be used for gaming.

The same for multi-core, when Unity 5 gets here they will be usefull however, an i5 is fine for a "budget gaming PC". (that's almost a contradiction really.. "budget" and "gaming")

Honestly if your going to get an i7 you might as well just get a Xeon.

[Alshain]

Honestly if your going to get an i7 you might as well just get a Xeon.

I didn't tell him to get an i7 I don't even run an i7.

[briansun1]

I didn't tell him to get an i7 I don't even run an i7.

I hit reply with quote instead of reply. Sorry. That comment wasn't aimed at you.

As for GPU I have the HD 7870 and it works fine.

Edited October 7, 2014 by briansun1

[skeevy]

I think this page will help you a lot. Everything on it is within your budget and most of it will do well with KSP.

If you shop around, you could build a water cooled AMD 8350 based system with 8GB ram, motherboard, case, 650-700w PSU, GPU, and a 120GB SSD within your budget. Properly cooled, you can get that 8 core beast running in the 4.5-5.0ghz range safe and stable. They're cheap (in price, not quality) and a good all round CPU. 8350's are on sale at Newegg for $170 right now; water cooled, it'll be about $240.

Outside of KSP, you'd have a lot more use with an 8350 over an i5 with things like photo editing, transcoding videos, media server, emulation, virtual machines, compiling code, multitasking, watching movies, and having lots of browser tabs going. The i5 might be better with some quad-core games, but you can disable the 8350's secondary cores (make it a quad core) to get more performance for games like that. The 8350 might be better over the i5 for KSP if Unity 5 brings all the supposed multitasking enhancements we're all hoping for.

[Oafman]

OK, so, 8GB RAM, and a cheap GPU.

There seems to be a consensus towards i5, which is very good to know. But that still leaves me with a decision to make about dual or quad core.

We established that cores aren't necessary for current KSP, but it was mentioned that they might come into the equation with Unity 5. I do want this PC to be good for a couple of years at least, so if Unity 5 is in the not-too-distant future, and will work better with a quad core, is that what I should look for? Quad cores do not appear to be that much more expensive.

There are also a range of frequencies for different i5s. From 2.5Ghz to 3.5Ghz. Is this important?

And so, probably avoid Radeon

This is helping a lot; I know so little about this. Thank you all for your thoughts so far

[Alshain]

All i5 CPU's are quad core (unless they changed something, that would be silly though)

EDIT: They did change something, what the heck is Intel thinking these days anyway?

Well they are mostly quad core and you should be getting the quad core models. The 4570 would be as low as I would go of the current gen but comparing prices might as well get the 4590. If you can afford the extra ~$50, the 4690K is a really sweet deal and the K means it is unlocked for overclocking which will help KSP a lot.

Edited October 7, 2014 by Alshain

[skeevy]

OK, so, 8GB RAM, and a cheap GPU.

There seems to be a consensus towards i5, which is very good to know. But that still leaves me with a decision to make about dual or quad core.

We established that cores aren't necessary for current KSP, but it was mentioned that they might come into the equation with Unity 5. I do want this PC to be good for a couple of years at least, so if Unity 5 is in the not-too-distant future, and will work better with a quad core, is that what I should look for? Quad cores do not appear to be that much more expensive.

There are also a range of frequencies for different i5s. From 2.5Ghz to 3.5Ghz. Is this important?

And so, probably avoid Radeon

This is helping a lot; I know so little about this. Thank you all for your thoughts so far

From Intel, you want at least a quad core with hyperthreading, and from AMD, at least the 8 core 8320....I'd spend the extra money and get the 8350.

2.5- 3.5ghz is very important. That's how fast the cpu operates. The more the better. 3.5ghz for and i5 isn't the same as 3.5ghz with an i7 or an AMD 8350. For example, the 8350 running at 4.0ghz is comparable in computing power with an i5 running at 3.5ghz. An i7 running at 3.5 is like an i5 running at 3.7.

I have a Radeon and I'm happy with it. They're not the best for KSP right now (no telling how any GPU will be with U5), but they do work well with other games, and for the games that support it, Mantle isn't half bad either. They also cost less than their comparable Nvidia counterpart.

[Oafman]

OK here's an initial attempt, based on what we have discussed. Slightly more than I wanted to pay, but I might be able to stomach that I guess.

Case

COOLERMASTER ELITE 311 BLUE CASE

Processor (CPU)

Intel® Core™i5 Quad Core Processor i5-4590 (3.3GHz) 6MB Cache

Motherboard

ASUS® H81M-PLUS: Micro-ATX, LG1150, USB 3.0, SATA 6GBs

Memory (RAM)

8GB KINGSTON DUAL-DDR3 1600MHz (1 x 8GB)

Graphics Card

INTEGRATED GRAPHICS ACCELERATOR (GPU)

1^st Hard Disk

500GB 3.5" SATA-III 6GB/s HDD 7200RPM 16MB CACHE

1^st DVD/BLU-RAY Drive

24x DUAL LAYER DVD WRITER ±R/±RW/RAM

Memory Card Reader

INTERNAL 52 IN 1 CARD READER (XD, MS, CF, SD, etc) + 1 x USB 2.0 PORT

Power Supply

CORSAIR 350W VS SERIESâ„¢ VS-350 POWER SUPPLY

Processor Cooling

Corsair H60 Hydro Series High Performance CPU Cooler (£59)

Sound Card

ONBOARD 6 CHANNEL (5.1) HIGH DEF AUDIO (AS STANDARD)

Wireless/Wired Networking

10/100/1000 GIGABIT LAN PORT (Wi-Fi NOT INCLUDED)

USB Options

MIN. 2 x USB 3.0 & 4 x USB 2.0 PORTS @ BACK PANEL + MIN. 2 FRONT PORTS

Power Cable

1 x 1 Metre UK Power Cable (Kettle Lead)

Operating System

Genuine Windows 8.1 64 Bit - inc DVD & Licence (£79)

Office Software

FREE 30 Day Trial of Microsoft® Office® 365

Anti-Virus

BULLGUARD INTERNET SECURITY - FREE 90 DAY TRIAL

Warranty

3 Year Standard Warranty (1 Month Collect & Return, 1 Year Parts, 3 Year Labour)

Delivery

STANDARD INSURED DELIVERY TO UK MAINLAND (MON-FRI)

Build Time

Standard Build - Approximately 9 to 11 working days

Quantity

1

Price: £540.00 including VAT and delivery.

Unique URL to re-configure: http://www.pcspecialist.co.uk/quotes/intel-home-office-pc/ohS5eam0nY/

[Alshain]

Graphics Card

INTEGRATED GRAPHICS ACCELERATOR (GPU)

Not unless the only game your playing is Solitaire. Intel integrated graphics are designed with Microsoft Office in mind, not 3D Gaming... at all... ever.

[John FX]

What you should look for is future proofing. KSP (i hope) will not stay 32 bit or single threaded and you may want to use you PC for other things.

I would spend the bulk of your money on a good mobo/cpu combo then look at a power supply.

This will give you a good base to attach other stuff to.

I have never had problems with corsair power supplies myself, YMMV.

I agree that 8Gb is a minimum. You should do that with one or two sticks and make sure that you have at least half of your slots empty.

Currently the clock speed on the CPU seems to be the limiting factor for KSP with the GFX card coming a close second. (this assumes you have enough RAM)

On the topic of RAM, remember that the 8GB (or whatever you choose) has to run your operating system, anything you have in the background and then on top KSP so you will not get 8GB free, you may not get 4BG free.

I would say to go Intel, Nvidia. ( I may be biased as I make video)

In a similar way to RAM, your CPU has to cope with all the background stuff too. You may find, depending on what you want to do with your system, that four cores will make KSP faster than two as it lets KSP have a core just for itself with no interruptions.

As has been said, you may find this useful

http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/42877-CPU-Performance-Database

[Oafman]

Not unless the only game your playing is Solitaire. Intel integrated graphics are designed with Microsoft Office in mind, not 3D Gaming... at all... ever.

Ah, right. I just went for the cheapest. If I change that to a 1GB NVIDIA GEFORCE 210 I'm up to £566. Starting to get towards the realm of unacceptable... Maybe I can make savings elsewhere?

It looks like an AMD could save me money, as skeevy suggests. I'll play around to see how much

With RAM, I guess I'll start with 8GB, but check that there are slots to double that in the future.

The cooler adds quite a bit to the cost. Corsair H60 Hydro Series High Performance CPU Cooler (£59). How important is this? I do live in England - the temperature tends to be quite modest!

[Alshain]

Ah, right. I just went for the cheapest. If I change that to a 1GB NVIDIA GEFORCE 210 I'm up to £566. Starting to get towards the realm of unacceptable... Maybe I can make savings elsewhere?

It looks like an AMD could save me money, as skeevy suggests. I'll play around to see how much

With RAM, I guess I'll start with 8GB, but check that there are slots to double that in the future.

The cooler adds quite a bit to the cost. Corsair H60 Hydro Series High Performance CPU Cooler (£59). How important is this? I do live in England - the temperature tends to be quite modest!

Water cooling us unnecessary unless your overclocking. That CPU isn't really an overclocking CPU (unlocked CPU's are denoted by K in the number). I have the Hyper 212 EVO and it's wonderful even when overclocking by a GHz on my (albeit older) 2550K. Realistically, the stock Intel cooler should be fine if your not overclocking.

EDIT: By the way, I live in East Texas, so heat here is comparable to England (we get around 43-48 deg C during the summer if it's a bad summer). Of course I do have air conditioning.

Edited October 7, 2014 by Alshain

[skeevy]

The best you can do budget-wise is something like this AMD Kaveri APU based system for $386. Spend another $110 for a 2GB GDDR5 R7-250X to crossfire with the APU and you'll be gaming great for under $500.

And integrated Intel graphics are crap. Best to steer clear of them.

[Tw1]

Isn't there an advantage to using NVIDIA with physx?

Or am I mistaken? I have a Geforce gt 640, and an i7-3630QM, but I do do a bit of image editing.

[Alshain]

Isn't there an advantage to using NVIDIA with physx?

Or am I mistaken? I have a Geforce gt 640, and an i7-3630QM, but I do do a bit of image editing.

No, KSP uses PhysX on the CPU only. I doubt that will change anytime soon (though I wish it would!).

OP: I just saw your configuration link. Drop to the Stock intel cooler and get the Nvidia 740. That quoted 537, is that ok? I wouldn't go much lower than that but if you absolutely must try the 730. The 210 video card is not much better than the intel graphics, it's not really meant for gaming.

Edited October 7, 2014 by Alshain

[Oafman]

So, I can make big savings with AMD. Does this sound viable:

Processor (CPU)

AMD A4-6300 Dual Core APU (3.7GHz) & Radeonâ„¢ HD 8370D Graphics

Motherboard

ASUS® A58M-E FM2+ (M-ATX, DDR3, USB 2.0, 3Gb/s)

Memory (RAM)

8GB KINGSTON DUAL-DDR3 1600MHz (1 x 8GB)

Graphics Card

1GB NVIDIA GEFORCE 210 - DVI, HDMI, VGA

Processor Cooling

STANDARD AMD CPU COOLER

Price: £405.00 including VAT and delivery.

Unique URL to re-configure: http://www.pcspecialist.co.uk/quotes/amd-fm2-richland/BCqABGLSLP/

--------------------------------------------

If I go Intel, I could go for something like this, but it's quite a bit more money:

Processor (CPU)

Intel® Core™i5 Quad Core Processor i5-4460 (3.2GHz) 6MB Cache

Motherboard

ASUS® Z97M-PLUS: m-ATX, USB3.0, SATA 6.0, XFIRE

Memory (RAM)

8GB KINGSTON DUAL-DDR3 1600MHz (1 x 8GB)

Graphics Card

1GB NVIDIA GEFORCE 210 - DVI, HDMI, VGA

Processor Cooling

INTEL STANDARD CPU COOLER

Price: £554.00 including VAT and delivery.

Unique URL to re-configure: http://www.pcspecialist.co.uk/quotes/intel-haswell-pc/I6rVyEHIv4/

Do people think any difference in performance between these two justifies the extra £150? And I'm OK with the coolers I selected?

[Oafman]

OP: I just saw your configuration link. Drop to the Stock intel cooler and get the Nvidia 740. That quoted 537, is that ok? I wouldn't go much lower than that but if you absolutely must try the 730. The 210 video card is not much better than the intel graphics, it's not really meant for gaming.

OK. If I get the 740 and standard cooler I'm getting £592, which is too much. Where else can I save?

Processor (CPU)

Intel® Core™i5 Quad Core Processor i5-4460 (3.2GHz) 6MB Cache

Memory (RAM)

8GB KINGSTON DUAL-DDR3 1600MHz (1 x 8GB)

Graphics Card

1GB NVIDIA GEFORCE GT 740 - DVI, HDMI, VGA - 3D Vision Ready

Processor Cooling

INTEL STANDARD CPU COOLER

Price: £592.00 including VAT and delivery.

Unique URL to re-configure: http://www.pcspecialist.co.uk/quotes/intel-haswell-pc/UGw3NaBjqc/

For the AMD option, it goes up to £442 with the 740

[Alshain]

I made an edit but you probably didn't see it. The 210 is not a gaming card, it's only slightly better than the Intel integrated graphics. As much as I hate Radeon, I would choose it over the 210 for gaming. AMD CPU's are much weaker, they have fallen way behind Intel these day, that said, they will work and seeing as your on a tight budget that may be the way to go.

Edited October 7, 2014 by Alshain