[1.1.2] Realism Overhaul v11.0.0 May 8

[gruneisen]

I can say that I do not use any of the stock bug fixes. Additionally, the OP doesn't require, recommend, or suggest them, so I would guess that they are not needed or are not incompatible with RO.

That being said, it appears as though Nathan gas been AFK for the last few days, and I'd wait for him to come back to answer your question.

Of course, you can always install and try them and report back here any bugs or incompatibilities you may find!

As a final note, the CKAN metadata for RO does not list any of the stock bug fixes as incompatible, so you should be good to go to try them!

[jrodriguez]

What version of MechJeb are you using? Try deactivating your engines and see if MechJeb is better at turning with RCS with the engine deactivated. Another possible solution would be to try updating MechJeb to the latest stable dev build.

There was a bug with how MechJeb reads the torque available to a craft where it thinks it still has torque available from engine gimballing when the engine is not burning. I submitted a report in the official MechJeb thread a week or two ago. A subsequent dev build was released of MechJeb that had a fix for this issue, but I have not had the free time to test it.

Also if I recall correctly deactivating the engine (and maybe disabling the engines gimbal) also avoided this bug.

Thanks I will try that!

[63Hayden]

I think it would be awesome if you could add support for this flashy capsule created by Ledenko: http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/82045-K-P0110-Apollo-like-crew-module-now-with-source-files-included

It has all the foundation, but just needs a patch for the internal RCS to function. I've been using this command pod for a very long time and can vouch for its awesomeness.

[Yaivenov]

Having some performance issues and trying to lower the work load of the computer. RealPlume is listed as being an optional mod however CKAN is treating it as mandatory and I am unable to split them in a CKAN install. So first, how do I properly remove RealPlume without breaking everything else and/or leaving all my engines with no sound or visual effects? Second, if I wanted to keep the very nice engine exhaust, but just turn down the system strain, how would I see about removing the giant exhaust plume that is present below 20km?

[gruneisen]

The easiest way to control CPU load with RealPlume is to adjust the number of particles that are used by SmokeScreen. You can do this during the flight and manually change the number of particles as function of altitude if you like.

[Yaivenov]

The easiest way to control CPU load with RealPlume is to adjust the number of particles that are used by SmokeScreen. You can do this during the flight and manually change the number of particles as function of altitude if you like.

Wow, thanks for the fast answer.

Will that typically reduce just the voluminous smoke plume, or both the plume and the immediate engine exhaust envelope/flame feather?

[Squiggsy]

The easiest way to control CPU load with RealPlume is to adjust the number of particles that are used by SmokeScreen. You can do this during the flight and manually change the number of particles as function of altitude if you like.

Ohh do you have any details on how to do this? I looked around for something like this but was unsuccessful, RealPlumes ruins the performance when running more than 4-5 engines at once and on some engines gets bad even with just 1 or two

[gruneisen]

Wow, thanks for the fast answer.

Will that typically reduce just the voluminous smoke plume, or both the plume and the immediate engine exhaust envelope/flame feather?

Ohh do you have any details on how to do this? I looked around for something like this but was unsuccessful, RealPlumes ruins the performance when running more than 4-5 engines at once and on some engines gets bad even with just 1 or two

You can add the SmokeScreen button via blizzy78's toolbar. From there, you can open up the SmokeScreen dialog and adjust the number of particles.

I'm no expert on how these two mods work, but it will reduce smoke and flame together - I believe changing the total number of particles does just that and that the same bucket of particles is used for both flame and smoke...but don't quote me on that.

And glad to help!

[Yaivenov]

So another question, I've been jotting down noted bugs and ideas as they occur to me while playing and I'd like to bounce them off the other RO fellas. Where would be a good spot on the forum to post it all?

[leocpadua]

Hey guys,I'm using RSS and I wanted to add one brazilian launch site.

Worked well on configs,no problem at all,but the RemoteTech ground base don't appear/work on the game,here is the print of my config:

If someone can help me,I appreciate.

[Lilienthal]

So another question, I've been jotting down noted bugs and ideas as they occur to me while playing and I'd like to bounce them off the other RO fellas. Where would be a good spot on the forum to post it all?

either here or on https://github.com/KSP-RO/RealismOverhaul

[Yaivenov]

So whenever I'm playing KSP, or modding KSP, or reading about KSP, or eating, sleeping, driving, etc. well lets just say ideas are always bouncing around and sometimes I actually remember to write them down! So here's just some of those thoughts while I was whittle away the hours in the game. There's no real pattern here, I just jotted down things as they occurred to me. Hopefully a few of them are actually worthwhile ideas and will spur some mod development (awesomeness sold separately).

Bugs - Just a few of the more annoying glitches that keep getting in the way of a good space mission.

Life support electricity showing "0:infinity" in RO, shows proper time in stock.

Built in crew pod RCS is still buggy. The "mercury" pod's rotational RCS thruster fires when the yaw command is given. This continues even if the roll RCS selection is switched off in the VAB.

SAS/SASS still needs anticipation/damping to fix the constant "hunting" and overshooting problem. Perhaps the system can be made to examine the position and power of the available manuevering thrusters versus the mass of the craft to determine available angular acceleration and use that to set limits onto the automatic RCS systems so they do not keep accelerating the crafts rotation continuously through out the manuever.

Capsule-integrated RCS thrusters still bugging out when being controlled by mechjeb or the stock SAS. Sometimes have to manually disable the mechjeb module in the crew capsule/probe core to restore function. Recommend just removing them for the time being and adding a simple linear thruster part that is available in the starting node. Let the players figure out how best to arrange control thrusters.

The launch clamps are chasing the spacecraft (snapping to it's location and sometimes colliding) at some of the same altitudes used for the automatic "altitude record" contracts, namely 6.5km, 13km and 22km (approximate).

Needs - Critical bits that are missing.

Some sort of starting interstage is needed, procedural interstage and payload fairings unlock far after the player is using multi-stage rockets. As an idea, what about crude forms of interstage design, like the bird cage or lattice arrangements. As better interstage systems are unlocked they will become lighter (for a given size) and also improve in aerodynamics (lattice versus hard shell).

Ability to turn down realplume in a more readily accessible manner, selections to exclude entire aspects, such as the smoke plume but not the flame envelope (or even just easily found documentation to instruct players in how to alter settings in smoke screen and elsewhere as they may need to.) Can we get engine lighting integrated into realplume?

Clear documentation in game of which tech nodes improve already unlocked parts (such as the procedural fairing sizes and the mechjeb capability modules).

Wants - What most of my ideas fall into, "hey it would be great if...."

A part trimming tool in game that can be used to "permanently deselect" parts out of the list in the VAB/SPH and upon next reboot they will remain unloaded.

Multistage engine starting: spin up turbomachinery first via compressed gas or gas generator, when the pumps are "at speed" or the propellant lines read a certain pressure available then open the fuel valves to the injector and activate the ignitor system if seperate (the H-1 engine automatically bled off gasses from the solid rocket motor gas generator that spun up the pumps and used it to also ignite the combustion chamber). On/off status should be independant of throttle setting and require a direct action by the player (shutting the propellant valves). Some issues with start-limited engines in the KSP game are there are instances where the game may either bug out momentarily setting throttle to 0 and then back to the previous setting and there are instances with mechjeb (such as switching off the launch guidance while still in powered flight) that will also change the throttle setting and interfere with proper operation and often cause a failed launch.

Spacesuit change to crew inventory item that they can choose to wear (option to wear available both inside and outside the craft).

Cabin CO2 needs to changed so it's displayed as a percentage of the cabin atmosphere, and not an alterable resource. CO2 needs to be constantly and immediately scrubbed so the CO2 absorbers need to be planned to last the entire mission. CO2 gauge should be from 0.00% to 1.50% (or whatever is considered lethal). Kerbal suits should have their own built in systems and crew should be able to get into their suits if the spaceship life support isn't working.

"Life support" electricity should be broken down into detail so that select technology upgrades will cause the astronauts to use less. More efficient lighting/heating/cooling/etc.

Crew capsules should also be temperature controlled, which would require greater ammounts of electricity if the craft isn't setup to handle its own waste heat properly (radiators, etc., more energy used if you have to use a lot of heat pumps to move the waste heat somewhere else to be radiated, so on)

Unable to exit the crew capsule unless it is depressurized first, can only depressurize if everyone in the capsule is suited up. Airlock code module for crew capsules large enough to support them, airlocks allow ingress/egress without depressurizing the whole capsule, but will vent an airlock's worth of oxygen to space if a scavenger pump isn't available/used. Airlock possible extra item to add to capsules or stations that don't yet have one.

Preferential electrical grid that allows prioritizing of electrical sources, and lock outs that prevent their consumption before other systems (TAC fuel balancer could probably do this but would need persistent resource storage settings. Also accurate estimations for energy consumption rates and estimated depletion times, TACLS for instance doesn't change the remaining time for life support based on current craft drain, instead that clock just speeds up (electrical estimation clock observed in stock KSP, presently non-functional in RO).

Control Moment Gyroscopes to compliment and upgrade from the Reaction Wheels and Reaction Control Systems. Make some that are single gimbal versus full gimballed.

Locking out certain in-game information from mechjeb and other sources until suitable parts are unlocked, ie. no exact temperature readings until the thermometer is unlocked and installed on the craft, no exact surface coordinates without a GNSS receiver and constellation or a star tracker.

Limited fuel flow rates through lines, fuel flow rate from balloon tanks limited by the available pressurization. Player will need to account for necessary propellant flow rates to meet the demands of the various engines.

Procedural "utility tunnels" (fuel lines) that hug the surface of the craft allowing the simplified and low profile of linking parts in a stack. Selectable for which resources it will pass, and also which/both direction (say a one-way RCS propellant line so your CM drains the SM's tanks before its own and a two way electrical umbilical both in the same utility tunnel object).

Electrical power being treated like other fuels and requiring a suitable connection across stage seperators.

Toolsuite to evaluate the best launch profiles for a given rocket.

Overhaul current staging systems. Placing a stage-possible part on a ship and that staging icon should go into an unassigned pool. From there the player chooses which parts to assign to the staging list, if any. Parts left in the unassigned pool are excluded from the staging list (for instance an engine that you want to only ever be activated via control group). Each "stage" can be broken down and different parts can be assigned different action times to be executed as a stage. Example:

Stage 1 (launching)

T+0 seconds = fire gas generators starting turbomachinery for engines.

T+6 seconds = open fuel valves.

T+6.25 seconds = activate ignitor.

T+10 seconds = after achieving full thrust, release launch clamps.

T+n seconds = close fuel valves to turbomachinery and allow to spin down on own, thrust drops off gradually.

T+n+5 seconds = initiate staging

Contracts and administraction strategies should remain open and available during "science only" career playthroughs as both provided a source of science points to unlock technology (a science only career has less science points available to it than a full career, especially early on when the player is scraping together a few points here and there to unlock the initial techs). Additionally a career mode that allows the player to act as a government agency for funding purposes could be interesting, a regular albeit fixed budget that is provided each year/month with the player able to petition for an increase in funding by putting together project presentations, tech demonstrators, etc. or suffer a decrease if they fail to show merit for continued funding.

Collision mesh (?) for parachutes so they push each other aside instead of clipping through each other.

To Do's - Things that I think should be within my skills to create/fix.

Make a list of engines and suitable models that match (or closely match) them for a "RealEngine" mod. Standalone engine pack to reduce the excess clutter and memory usage from installing entire mod packs just for the engines. Also to correct for tech node misplacement, duplicated engines (RL-10 and J-2 I'm looking at youse) and poor models (stock engines being repeatedly recycled and distorted as place holders and filler). Need to contact mod authors to get permission to repack their engine models together. Search the available mods for the best engine models to match their real world counterparts.

Find a way to integrate Kerbal GPS into RemoteTech and MechJeb (no ground coordinates available without a GPS constellation or an independent navigation system such as a Startracker. (Should GPS satellites be required to carry an isotope clock and startracker to be functional?)

Being able to build an appropriate IU (Instrumentation Unit) for the different stages. Almost possible currently with smart parts. Being able to add additional tanks of high pressure helium and/or TEA/TEB to change the number of times an engine could be restarted. The Saturn V S-2 engines (five J-2's) only needed to light once, versus the S-IVB's engine (also a J-2) would need to be able to start at least twice. This will let players further tailor their rockets to their own designs.

A tech tree based on dates of development with the different branches based on different technology types/engine development programs.

Make the doors on the stock science bays deployable radiators like the space shuttle's cargo doors.

To Done's - Stuff I've already done.

Require bulk fueling to be done at the pad after rollout. In order to get around part loading lag that was destroying massive rockets in my game I would prepare them in the VAB and then drain all the main LOX/LH2/RP-1 tanks and have a few of the ground support parts (launch clamps, umbilical towers) set as resource generators. The rocket would load in with only a fraction of it's flight mass avoiding lag bug destruction, and then would spend a short while gassing up prior to flight. obviously shouldn't apply to small pre-prepared tanks like the Apollo SM's SPS hypergol tanks, RCS fuel, etc. Only modification needed was to add the resource modules to the launch clamps.

Random Thoughts - Like I needed to restate that...

For the tech reliability mod: What about test stands that let you evaluate and develop engine reliability without risking them in flight? Test stand can be as simple as your rocket stage being mounted to extra-strong, non-releasing launch clamps that also act as the probe core for control. As an addon for KCT, you could develop engines on a test stand to reduce their dynamic failure rate (rather than flying them to do so), and then also incorporate a minimum "material defect" failure rate. To counter this you would test unique engines on the stands, verify they are good, and then install them on the rockets for use. A few special areas don't allow this though, such as the Lunar Descent Engine on the LEM. Due to the corrosive hypergol propellant and the ablative cooling it could only be fired once and allowed for no pre-testing, so while you might reduce the tech development failure rate with R&D and live fire tests you will be unable to avoid the material defect failure rate in certain cases.

Questions - Something I'm apparently too stupid to find on the internet. Please help.

Does it damage liquid engines to let them run to propellant exhaustion?

Edited August 10, 2015 by Yaivenov

[Boris33fr]

Hello ! I have so frequent crashes in game, only during loading, when i'm changing scenes. (Rocket to KSC, KSC to VAB, ...). It's so annoying and i cant play anymore like this. Anyone know a way to resolve this issue ? Thanks

Output Log :

https://www.dropbox.com/s/gjtwkgrd6qalx6r/output_log.txt?dl=0

[ColKlonk]

There seems to be a conflict with RO (V10.2) and Procedural Parts (v1.1.7.0)...

Loading stops at the Procedural parts SRB tanks..

ModuleManager used is V2.6.6.. (as V2.6.7 just doesn't get off the ground)

With either one of these two mods removed, loading is OK

Solution and/or WorkAround :-

The problem looks to lie between the files:-

..\GameData\ProceduralParts\Parts\ZOtherMods\RFSRB.CFG

and

...\GameData\RealismOverhaul\RO_RecommendedMods\Procedurals\RO_ProceduralParts.cfg

What I've done is just delete the RFSRB file and all works fine so far... as I can do without Procedural SRBs for the time being.

Maybe Nathan can speak to the Procedural Parts modder.

Edited August 10, 2015 by ColKlonk

[Boris33fr]

There seems to be a conflict with RO (V10.2) and Procedural Parts (v1.1.7.0)...

Loading stops at the Procedural parts SRB tanks..

Still looking at it..

Thanks for taking care of me. But, where do you see this in my crashlog ^^ I would like to be able to read it as you do to don't bother people anymore. ^^

[ZoltanJackson]

I am having trouble G-forces, if somebody could help with any advice?

Playing career mode RP-0, using all of the recommended mods and some of the suggested mods, plus a couple of UI-related things such as Kerbal Alarm Clock and Science Alert.

Unlocked the first capsule - built a simple single stage sub-orbital rocket, launched it - don't remember the altitude I reached, some hundreds of km, and velocity maxed out around 3,500 m/s. Upon reentry, some heating starts, then G-forces rise and rise, until around 30 km my pilot gets splatted across the cabin.

I figured maybe the velocity was too high, so I built a replica of Mercury-Redstone using FASA (I believe). After gravity turn and full burn, apogee is around 280 km, and velocity something like 2,500 m/s. Reentry - same thing happens around 30 km, and my pilot is splatted again.

What am I doing wrong? I see no way in the Mercury capsule to slow my descent so the G-forces aren't so lethal; they just rise up to maximum and kill my pilot. Obviously I'm doing something wrong, but what? If I can't survive a simple suborbital flight, how will I survive any orbital returns?

[Boris33fr]

lol, i'm having the sames problems since a few minutes. ^^ Welcome

[HoloYolo]

I am having trouble G-forces, if somebody could help with any advice?

Playing career mode RP-0, using all of the recommended mods and some of the suggested mods, plus a couple of UI-related things such as Kerbal Alarm Clock and Science Alert.

Unlocked the first capsule - built a simple single stage sub-orbital rocket, launched it - don't remember the altitude I reached, some hundreds of km, and velocity maxed out around 3,500 m/s. Upon reentry, some heating starts, then G-forces rise and rise, until around 30 km my pilot gets splatted across the cabin.

I figured maybe the velocity was too high, so I built a replica of Mercury-Redstone using FASA (I believe). After gravity turn and full burn, apogee is around 280 km, and velocity something like 2,500 m/s. Reentry - same thing happens around 30 km, and my pilot is splatted again.

What am I doing wrong? I see no way in the Mercury capsule to slow my descent so the G-forces aren't so lethal; they just rise up to maximum and kill my pilot. Obviously I'm doing something wrong, but what? If I can't survive a simple suborbital flight, how will I survive any orbital returns?

Don't enter too steeply. The reentry effects ramp up at around 30,000 km right before they die down, so coming in too steep could turn your capsle into a blender, I recommend flatting out somewhere along your flight for shallow reentrys.

[Motokid600]

Also afaik even the suborbital Mercury flights fired retro rockets at apoapsis. I remember back when I was simulating Mercury flights I was having the same issue. But the retro fire helped and... I was just going too high. 280km is way too high which is probably the culprit for the excess g forces. Mercury Redstone 3 went up to 186km. So your almost one hundred km higher.

Edited August 10, 2015 by Motokid600

[Boris33fr]

There seems to be a conflict with RO (V10.2) and Procedural Parts (v1.1.7.0)...

Loading stops at the Procedural parts SRB tanks..

ModuleManager used is V2.6.6.. (as V2.6.7 just doesn't get off the ground)

With either one of these two mods removed, loading is OK

Solution and/or WorkAround :-

The problem looks to lie between the files:-

..\GameData\ProceduralParts\Parts\ZOtherMods\RFSRB.CFG

and

...\GameData\RealismOverhaul\RO_RecommendedMods\Procedurals\RO_ProceduralParts.cfg

What I've done is just delete the RFSRB file and all works fine so far... as I can do without Procedural SRBs for the time being.

Maybe Nathan can speak to the Procedural Parts modder.

Thanks you ! Really nice from you !

[gruneisen]

I am having trouble G-forces, if somebody could help with any advice?

Playing career mode RP-0, using all of the recommended mods and some of the suggested mods, plus a couple of UI-related things such as Kerbal Alarm Clock and Science Alert.

Unlocked the first capsule - built a simple single stage sub-orbital rocket, launched it - don't remember the altitude I reached, some hundreds of km, and velocity maxed out around 3,500 m/s. Upon reentry, some heating starts, then G-forces rise and rise, until around 30 km my pilot gets splatted across the cabin.

I figured maybe the velocity was too high, so I built a replica of Mercury-Redstone using FASA (I believe). After gravity turn and full burn, apogee is around 280 km, and velocity something like 2,500 m/s. Reentry - same thing happens around 30 km, and my pilot is splatted again.

What am I doing wrong? I see no way in the Mercury capsule to slow my descent so the G-forces aren't so lethal; they just rise up to maximum and kill my pilot. Obviously I'm doing something wrong, but what? If I can't survive a simple suborbital flight, how will I survive any orbital returns?

Additionally, RO used to included a 'descent mode' which could be activated on capsules. It operated by changing the location of the CG so that the capsule could generate some lift as it re-entered the atmosphere. I'm not sure if it's still there - I haven't re-entered a capsule for some time, but if it is, it can significantly reduce the re-entry G forces as well!

[Devinci]

Does anyone know what "Insufficient resources to ignite means"? My engine is not starting at all from the pad.

- - - Updated - - -

Does anyone know what "Insufficient resources to ignite means"? My engine is not starting at all from the pad.

Edit: Using the FASA umbillical towers fixed the problem somehow.

[ZoltanJackson]

Thanks for the great replies. The Mk1 capsule does have a descent mode, but it didn't make any difference to my pilot getting squashed - but that's probably because I was way too steep. The Mercury pod doesn't have a descent mode but, again, it sounds like I am going way too steep. I did my gravity turn roughly according to the Wiki, but I guess I was not flattening out enough. My turn generally seems to slow down around 45 degrees / 1 km/s velocity, so I will look at refining this. I did try burning the retro rockets at apogee, but they're only like 100 m/s so it didn't change the end result... But clearly, if I am going up 100 km too high then I am way off where I'm supposed to be!

Next time I'm at my computer I'll give it a go, concentrating on shallowing my gravity turn quite a bit. Thanks!

[gruneisen]

Does anyone know what "Insufficient resources to ignite means"? My engine is not starting at all from the pad.

- - - Updated - - -

Edit: Using the FASA umbillical towers fixed the problem somehow.

Chances are you do not have the engine attached to a fuel tank with the correct fuel. Most to all fuel tanks in RO are defaulted to empty so, once you attach an engine to one - be it a FASA tank or a Procedural Tank, you have to right click on the tank and hit the button to fill it with the right resource.

One note is that most engines will work fine with the default Procedural Tank, but if you're using a pressure fed engine, then you need to use a Procedural Tank and set the type to 'Device Module' or use a tank that says it is 'Pressurized'.

Cheers!

[Boris33fr]

I have installed ATM also, but my game keep crashing, even after deleting the file you told me to. :(

Still crash when i'm loading a scene.

My output log

https://www.dropbox.com/s/gjtwkgrd6qalx6r/output_log.txt?dl=0

Thanks :'( ^^