Centrifugal Pseudo-Gravity in KSP

[Voyager55]

So i've been playing around with centrifuges in KSP alot and i'm amazed at what KSP's engine pulls off. I drove a small rover on my ring.

Here's a video that's not mine it's HOCGaming's but it demonstrates the physics perfectly.

But what's driving me insane is that I can't have kerbals walk on it! Is this possible, is it modable, it would be amazing if the engine allowed kerbals to walk on centrifuges, or perhaps it could be modded. Who else loves centrifuges!

[merendel]

The reason kerbals cant walk on them is the game thinks they are falling. When they hit the moving platform its moveing too fast for them to keep their feet and they just ragdoll. There is no gravity for them to orient too and their constantly changeing direction from the spin keeps them ragdolling till the spin stops or they fall off. With a rover it is being pushed into the rotateing platform hard enough for the tires to get traction. they dont care what state the rest of the vessle is in, as long as the tires have traction they will move the rover in the direction the tires drive it.

[Voyager55]

Yes, but my question was if there's any way around this. Any way to allow kerbals to walk on a gravity ring, whether by modding or exploiting some engine glitch.

[arkie87]

So i've been playing around with centrifuges in KSP alot and i'm amazed at what KSP's engine pulls off. I drove a small rover on my ring.

Here's a video that's not mine it's HOCGaming's but it demonstrates the physics perfectly.

But what's driving me insane is that I can't have kerbals walk on it! Is this possible, is it modable, it would be amazing if the engine allowed kerbals to walk on centrifuges, or perhaps it could be modded. Who else loves centrifuges!

What if you use RCS to thrust down onto the ring, then get started walking, and once you are walking fast enough, the centrifugal force is enough to keep you there?

[Voyager55]

What if you use RCS to thrust down onto the ring, then get started walking, and once you are walking fast enough, the centrifugal force is enough to keep you there?

I've actually tried that, but no matter what i've done to date the kerbal always instantly ragdolls on contact with the ring.

[LABHOUSE]

You could edit the persistent file to make the kerbal not be in rag doll mode.

[Kerba Fett]

The only thing that might work would be to put a capsule on the inside of the ring (or probably 2 for balance) then spin the ring up to speed before you EVA the kerbal. This way you've already got all the centrifical force you're going to get before the kerbal spawns. If that doesn't work I doubt if anything will.

[merendel]

The only thing that might work would be to put a capsule on the inside of the ring (or probably 2 for balance) then spin the ring up to speed before you EVA the kerbal. This way you've already got all the centrifical force you're going to get before the kerbal spawns. If that doesn't work I doubt if anything will.

Doubt it would work. The kerbal would still be in a 0g reference frame even if you technically have a rotationally induced artificial gravity. As far as the game is concerned the moment he lets go of the ladder he just impacted on a object moveing fast enough to rag doll him and the results are predictable.

[Starwaster]

Doubt it would work. The kerbal would still be in a 0g reference frame even if you technically have a rotationally induced artificial gravity. As far as the game is concerned the moment he lets go of the ladder he just impacted on a object moveing fast enough to rag doll him and the results are predictable.

I disagree. I think that err.... 'research' should be done.

No doubt we can find some brave Kerbal 'volunteers' to help put this thing to rest?

[Sasami_TN]

if wheels work and kerbal feet doesn't, wouldn't a workable compromise be to put wheels on kerbal feet by way of rollerskates? They can be like those kid shoes which has hidden skatewheels tucked inside and are deployed when they want to go faster than simply walking.

[Trentendegreth]

at one point there was a mod that fixed this, "no drunk kerbals" or something like that because the issue happened on boats as well. though i don't know that it would apply to a space ring

[LordFerret]

if wheels work and kerbal feet doesn't, wouldn't a workable compromise be to put wheels on kerbal feet by way of rollerskates? They can be like those kid shoes which has hidden skatewheels tucked inside and are deployed when they want to go faster than simply walking.

LOL!... I've seen more than one cracked skull from those things! No thanks!

[Tery215]

In real life, they wouldn't be walking because of the difference in acceleration between their space boots and their head.

[rdwulfe]

Well, one of the problems here is that there's no air. Think about it.

In our theories about centrifugally generated pseudo gravity in space, you're within an enclosed space, with air around you. The air helps you keep moving with the rotation of the ring (or other shape, rings aren't the only way). In the video, when the little rover loses connection with the ring, it begins to drift away immediately. Same would happen with Kerbals, but they have even less mass to effect the "escape".

Now yes, it's a bug causing this, but having an enclosed, aired space might help them... problem is, the air has to actually move *with* the centerfuge as well.

[lajoswinkler]

I've been testing this few weeks ago, although not in a tunnel, but in a manually assembled station in Duna orbit.

They certainly can't walk because this is not ground they're touching. They are in microgravity with the respect to the planet and being squished against the floor of the station makes them "feel" like they're permanently hitting an object like a ragdoll.

It would be fun if they could actually stand "up".

[Red Iron Crown]

Well, one of the problems here is that there's no air. Think about it.

In our theories about centrifugally generated pseudo gravity in space, you're within an enclosed space, with air around you. The air helps you keep moving with the rotation of the ring (or other shape, rings aren't the only way). In the video, when the little rover loses connection with the ring, it begins to drift away immediately. Same would happen with Kerbals, but they have even less mass to effect the "escape".

Now yes, it's a bug causing this, but having an enclosed, aired space might help them... problem is, the air has to actually move *with* the centerfuge as well.

Air is irrelevant to using centrifugal force as pseudo-gravity, the rotation rate and radius are all that matters. An unpressurized centrifuge would provide exactly the same force as a pressurized one, all other things being equal.

[Sasami_TN]

I've been testing this few weeks ago, although not in a tunnel, but in a manually assembled station in Duna orbit. They are in microgravity with the respect to the planet..

If your astronaut kerbal is on the outside of the station and the problem is with walking on the surface without being launched into space.. I believe that Bobcat addressed something similar to this in a video. On a moon his rover would hit a bump and be launched into space because of the microgravity. He solved this by pointing his ion exhaust upwards which created a downward force for his rover to remain on the surface of the moon because the downward force approximated regular gravity. So why not use your astronaut kerbal's rocket pack descent jets which would cause him (her?) to stay on the station surface? A possible mod is to have magnetic boots which I think is something that alot of sci-fi movies addressed when faced with this same problem.

If your astronaut kerbal is on the inside of the station.. no workable solution comes to mind to keep from tumbling into the floorplate section in front of him (her?). Unless there is something like a walkway which is coded similar to the exterior handrails to have the kerbal "connect" to it but allows for walking.

My question (different topic) is which mod you found those long skinny support trusses at? I've yet to come across them and I like them. :-)

-Sasami (^___^)/

Edited November 29, 2014 by Sasami_TN

[JayKay]

A possible mod is to have magnetic boots which I think is something that alot of sci-fi movies addressed when faced with this same problem.

Yeah, apparently, they used a lot of iron and steel in 50s sci-fi rockets. . . and apparently also the Enterprise-E (First Contact.) Magnetic boots would be useless on aluminum or titanium ship hulls. Of course, in Kerbal-space anything is possible.

[Tw1]

at one point there was a mod that fixed this, "no drunk kerbals" or something like that because the issue happened on boats as well. though i don't know that it would apply to a space ring

Sea Sickness Cure was one that did it, though it is no longer needed nowdays. Though it would be nice to have it in space. I could re-build the station with a 'balcony' I had back in '0.18

if wheels work and kerbal feet doesn't, wouldn't a workable compromise be to put wheels on kerbal feet by way of rollerskates? They can be like those kid shoes which has hidden skatewheels tucked inside and are deployed when they want to go faster than simply walking.

This would be an awesome mod. With a different model, you could have ice skates. Magnetic boots would be nice to, but there are a number of (not insurmountable) issues. Velcro would be better, for most situations.

[merendel]

Yeah, apparently, they used a lot of iron and steel in 50s sci-fi rockets. . . and apparently also the Enterprise-E (First Contact.) Magnetic boots would be useless on aluminum or titanium ship hulls. Of course, in Kerbal-space anything is possible.

Most SciFi shows employ so much HandWavium that they are completely laughable when you try to apply real world physics to what is going on in a scene. Then agian this happens with alot of other subjects in entertainment. Writers come up with pseudo science or grab tech words out of a dictionary and string them togeather to plaster over the plot holes. I still laugh at almost every depiction of hacking on TV or movies. My fav example was CSI:NY where they were monitoring an IRC chat and one of the characters stated they were going to quickly code up a GUI in VB to trace the signal... I dont think the writer had any clue. If they can get away with that they can get away with magnet boots working on any material, even non metalic ones.

[LABHOUSE]

Try putting a command chair there and then make the kerbal get out. But I think editing the config can work just change the state from ragdoll to standing.