New Horizons

[TheDataMiner]

I've been looking forward to this for years...I can't believe it's almost here

[LordFerret]

A number of the preceding comments have me posing this question, a thing I've been wondering about for some time now: Will we make an attempt to visit Sedna? Time is running out to do so. If we don't do it soon, we'll have to wait somewhere on the order of 12,000 years for its next pass.

[Mitchz95]

A number of the preceding comments have me posing this question, a thing I've been wondering about for some time now: Will we make an attempt to visit Sedna? Time is running out to do so. If we don't do it soon, we'll have to wait somewhere on the order of 12,000 years for its next pass.

That's assuming we don't invent warp drive in the next 12,000 years.

[Kibble]

A number of the preceding comments have me posing this question, a thing I've been wondering about for some time now: Will we make an attempt to visit Sedna? Time is running out to do so. If we don't do it soon, we'll have to wait somewhere on the order of 12,000 years for its next pass.

My guess: our best hope is a fast flyby launched by SLS Block IB in the late 2040s.

[Streetwind]

A number of the preceding comments have me posing this question, a thing I've been wondering about for some time now: Will we make an attempt to visit Sedna? Time is running out to do so. If we don't do it soon, we'll have to wait somewhere on the order of 12,000 years for its next pass.

I'm a great Senda fan! Proof (Also, another thread I posted something in)

Thing is, though, there is still plenty of time. Sedna hits periapsis sometime around 2076, and even if we need to fly 20 years one-way, that means we still have 40 more years to plan and build a mission. And then some years more, because the planet isn't immediately gone after periapsis. We can still probably catch it ten, twenty years later without too much trouble.

I agree that Sedna is a unique science destination, but there's probably more directly available and interesting things to cover first. Europa and Enceladus, for instance. But I can see for example a Decadal Survey in the 2033 or 2043 timeframe starting to recommend (or at least consider) Sedna.

And who knows, maybe Dr. White will have his purported quantum thruster finished by then and we no longer really have to worry about dV... orbit + lander mission go go go! (Hey, gotta dream sometimes )

[Frida Space]

A number of the preceding comments have me posing this question, a thing I've been wondering about for some time now: Will we make an attempt to visit Sedna? Time is running out to do so. If we don't do it soon, we'll have to wait somewhere on the order of 12,000 years for its next pass.

I asked that exact same question to Cathy Olkin, New Horizons project scientist, when I met her last December as part of a small interview. This is (part) of what she answered: "I think it would be worth visiting, but there are significant technical challenges. The technical challenges are dominated by traveling that far out in the solar system. Without significant improvements in propulsion, the lifetime of the mission would be extremely long so the spacecraft and instruments would have to be proven to last probably more than 20 years"

Edited July 9, 2015 by Frida Space

[lajoswinkler]

That's assuming we don't invent warp drive in the next 12,000 years.

Don't worry, the SF nerds are working on it. Their technobabble and fairy dust is showing huge potential.

[Streetwind]

I found this comparison quite striking:

[Scotius]

Pluto really is looking similiar to Triton.

[Frida Space]

Pluto really is looking similiar to Triton.

It is, it's quite remarkable. A colorized photo of Triton:

[Streetwind]

Then that's just extra fuel for the theory that Triton did not form with Neptune but is actually a captured KBO.

[PB666]

I'm a great Senda fan! Proof (Also, another thread I posted something in)

Thing is, though, there is still plenty of time. Sedna hits periapsis sometime around 2076, and even if we need to fly 20 years one-way, that means we still have 40 more years to plan and build a mission. And then some years more, because the planet isn't immediately gone after periapsis. We can still probably catch it ten, twenty years later without too much trouble.

I agree that Sedna is a unique science destination, but there's probably more directly available and interesting things to cover first. Europa and Enceladus, for instance. But I can see for example a Decadal Survey in the 2033 or 2043 timeframe starting to recommend (or at least consider) Sedna.

And who knows, maybe Dr. White will have his purported quantum thruster finished by then and we no longer really have to worry about dV... orbit + lander mission go go go! (Hey, gotta dream sometimes )

Its not a quantum thruster yet, they have not done the diversity of experiments that need to be done to prove that are generating thrust as a result interaction with the quanutum vacuum. They also have a problem if it is since thrust = voltage³ and there is clearly inadequate power source for deep space to power such a thruster. My suspicion is if this is a quantum virtual particle effect (As per the wiki page) then it saturates quite rapidly, and to be effective the Q-thrusters would need to be much smaller and spread perpindicular to the acceleration vector over a large area of space.

[lajoswinkler]

Then that's just extra fuel for the theory that Triton did not form with Neptune but is actually a captured KBO.

Why? It could form with Neptune and still look like this. Neptune and KBO belt are neighbours.

[Streetwind]

Then Neptune's other moons would also be similar in composition, but IIRC they aren't...

(I haven't really studied it in depth.)

[Kryten]

Why? It could form with Neptune and still look like this. Neptune and KBO belt are neighbours.

The orbit is retrograde, impossible with co-accretion.

[LordFerret]

I asked that exact same question to Cathy Olkin, New Horizons project scientist, when I met her last December as part of a small interview. This is (part) of what she answered: "I think it would be worth visiting, but there are significant technical challenges. The technical challenges are dominated by traveling that far out in the solar system. Without significant improvements in propulsion, the lifetime of the mission would be extremely long so the spacecraft and instruments would have to be proven to last probably more than 20 years"

I believe a flyby is possible, but we would need to get working on it soon. As for such a probe's potential longevity, the Voyager craft (among others) have proven we can accomplish that. That stirs another issue in me, the fact that we've proven technology, yet we're not using it ... the Saturn V is perfect example ... instead we're wasting money mucking around with a whole series of failing lifters.

[Kryten]

Saturn V was pretty unreliable by modern standards-just look what it did to skylab, that'd be a total mission failure for most payloads-it was just big. We don't need rockets that size, and frankly never did.

[Motokid600]

Then Neptune's other moons would also be similar in composition, but IIRC they aren't...

(I haven't really studied it in depth.)

What makes you say that? Moon's are the most diverse bodies in the solar system. Look at Jupiter's moons each one of them is completely different from each other. Remarkably different actually.

[Camacha]

What makes you say that? Moon's are the most diverse bodies in the solar system. Look at Jupiter's moons each one of them is completely different from each other. Remarkably different actually.

While that is true, the orbit strongly suggests that a scenario of the moon forming along Neptune is unlikely.

I believe a flyby is possible, but we would need to get working on it soon. As for such a probe's potential longevity, the Voyager craft (among others) have proven we can accomplish that.

It is important to note that there never were any guarantees that the mission would last that long. If you want to send a mission out to Sedna, you would need to rate your spacecraft for at least that period of time. Having a stroke of good luck (along with some overengineering) is different from designing a craft to last that long.

[lajoswinkler]

The orbit is retrograde, impossible with co-accretion.

Oh, forgot about that one. Yeah, then it's obvious.

[Motokid600]

Is it really not possible from an engineering stand point to put a probe in LKO with a very large ejection stage that can boost out with hypergolics and in another ten years brake into orbit with the same stage? Surely it's possible. Itd possibly take having to refuel the ejection stage in LKO, but surely such a rocket could be built.

Like what if instead New Horizons was launched on a SaturnV and the SIVB was converted to hyperbolic?

[Kryten]

That would take an absurd amount of money that'd be better spent funding several different missions to other locations.

[Camacha]

Is it really not possible from an engineering stand point

Engineering wise almost anything is possible. If you factor in probe durability (since not flying by takes considerably more time), financial cost and political support, things become very complicated. The fact that you have a mission reaping rewards half a century later (meaning more than a career later) will greatly reduce people's preparedness to engage such a project. I am not even talking about the chances of things breaking permanently during that period. Reducing the time span quickly adds cost.

[Frida Space]

I found this comparison quite striking:

I blurred the latest New Horizons image and hell, does it look like Hubble's.

[Motokid600]

Yea I'm just saying it IS possible to put a probe into the Plutonian ( that was cool to type ) orbit. But yes it'd take a big rocket and big money.

Because here's the thing. I do this all the time in RSS. Take the FASA SaturnV, retrofit the SIVB with hypergolic engines and fuel. And that's it. The probe core IS the probe. The only payload is the power source. So you have this ejection stage with massive DV numbers I can take anywhere.