KSP players: Male or Female

[Tw1]

. There aren't a whole lot of women.

It's a pity really, I know many nerdy/gamer girls IRL, but not so much on these forums. It's would be nice to have more balance.

(Resists urge to rant about reasons why they should get cracking with those female kerbal models, and invite more in.)

For the record, I am male or female.....Why is there no "yes" option in the poll?

[Accelerando]

Sorry, I got a strong Little Britain flashback from that!

That's cool. The way you talk about gender, not so much. Sorry, but:

Am I the only one who would like to know if those voting both or other are just jokers? And why someone would rather not say in an anonymous poll?

No, please don't. I know many fine people who more than seriously consider themselves agendered or non-binary. I'm transgendered myself. It's just a name and group association, after all; it's not any more or less joking to consider yourself one gender than another, unless you mean it that way to begin with. While I understand that you might not be familiar with the idea, please don't start with the "are the alternate options just jokers?" It's far too common as a first response to the concept, and frankly a little grating.

Edited January 16, 2015 by Red Iron Crown
Removed a bunch of political stuff.

[Red Iron Crown]

Please stop the debate about the source of gender inequality, it is not appropriate for this forum and will likely lead to hard feelings.

[Accelerando]

Alright. Turning it over to the pollsters.

[WinkAllKerb'']

Everyone know frogs are turning herma ...

http://www.livescience.com/20532-birth-control-water-pollution.html

[razark]

GreeningGalaxy was, rather, responding to a post which in space of the same breath names "female" gamers while naming himself as a "guy". "Guy", as at least a rough synonym for "man", generally implies an age for the person; if you're concerned about using age-nonspecific terms, then why not criticize Commander Jeb, too, for mixing his terms, since he's the person GG was responding to?

Commander Jebidiah knows his age, therefore using an age-specific term works. When referring to a group of people, the only characteristic which all of them are known to share being gender, it makes sense to use a gender-specific, but not age-specific, label.

[Cirocco]

Wow, just had a look at the results... that's a lot bigger disparity then I expected.

I do wonder a little why that is. I know many engineers are men, but I know the gap (thankfully) has been closing for a while now. And I also know for a fact that a large part of gamers are women (probably a far larger part than most gamers would think). I would have guessed at at a 70-30 or something ratio. I wonder why it's *this* skewed.

I am male btw.

[Red Iron Crown]

Wow, just had a look at the results... that's a lot bigger disparity then I expected.

I do wonder a little why that is. I know many engineers are men, but I know the gap (thankfully) has been closing for a while now. And I also know for a fact that a large part of gamers are women (probably a far larger part than most gamers would think). I would have guessed at at a 70-30 or something ratio. I wonder why it's *this* skewed.

I am male btw.

It's because both effects are there. Hypothetical numbers: Say gamers are 70/30 male/female and STEM-interested people are 70/30 male/female. STEM-interested gamers would be 91/9 male/female, all other factors being equal.

[Cirocco]

It's because both effects are there. Hypothetical numbers: Say gamers are 70/30 male/female and STEM-interested people are 70/30 male/female. STEM-interested gamers would be 91/9 male/female, all other factors being equal.

I suppose... still makes me a little sad. Is that weird?

[Red Iron Crown]

Not at all. I would much prefer a more equitable distribution in both areas as well as the KSP player base.

[Commander Jebidiah]

Please can everyone just keep this topic on rails. As Bill Phill said there was once a thread for this but it got closed and I'm guessing that it got off topic please I don't want that to happen to this thread.

[Frozen_Heart]

MtF except I'm kind of halfway... that makes for a bit of fun with strangers.

I put other as quite a few ppl can't even tell what gender I am now. :/

You know this is the 2nd time ive seen females on this forum

There are actually quite a few. Everyone just assumes that they're male though.

Edited January 16, 2015 by Frozen_Heart

[megatiger78]

also am male

[Louella]

I was typing stuff into Google, to see if there was a Barbie space program.

Turns out, Barbie first became an astronaut in 1965. And subsequently went to the Moon (bringing back glow-in-the-dark Moon Rocks), and later to Mars.

MARS !

[Iskierka]

It's because both effects are there. Hypothetical numbers: Say gamers are 70/30 male/female and STEM-interested people are 70/30 male/female. STEM-interested gamers would be 91/9 male/female, all other factors being equal.

This is a false assumption, as it declares that STEM-interest and gaming interest are independent, when it is very likely they are not, especially with STEM-orientated games. In theory, given PC gaming's greater popularity with techy people, a very high % of STEM-interested people, regardless of gender, should be interested in STEM-orientated games, so it should remain close to the original 70/30. There's a lot more to consider in asking why the disparity is so high, especially considering it's actually beyond the 91/9 ratio proposed. As of writing this it's at 122/10, ~= 109.8/9. It may be that fewer ladies like the forums for some reason, giving a bias in this poll, in which case you then have to wonder what pushes them away from this kind of environment.

I myself am also a lady, and quite disappointed with this result - I do feel that this game should be able to get at least a 70/30 split in appeal, so it's quite strange that it doesn't have nearly that.

[Red Iron Crown]

This is a false assumption, as it declares that STEM-interest and gaming interest are independent, when it is very likely they are not, especially with STEM-orientated games. In theory, given PC gaming's greater popularity with techy people, a very high % of STEM-interested people, regardless of gender, should be interested in STEM-orientated games, so it should remain close to the original 70/30. There's a lot more to consider in asking why the disparity is so high, especially considering it's actually beyond the 91/9 ratio proposed. As of writing this it's at 122/10, ~= 109.8/9. It may be that fewer ladies like the forums for some reason, giving a bias in this poll, in which case you then have to wonder what pushes them away from this kind of environment.

I myself am also a lady, and quite disappointed with this result - I do feel that this game should be able to get at least a 70/30 split in appeal, so it's quite strange that it doesn't have nearly that.

That's the "other factors being equal" part of my post, but you're right that they're probably not equal in this case. At any rate, combining two minorities will nearly always result in a smaller minority, even if it's not by as much as if they're unrelated.

[[email protected]]

That's the "other factors being equal" part of my post, but you're right that they're probably not equal in this case. At any rate, combining two minorities will nearly always result in a smaller minority, even if it's not by as much as if they're unrelated.

Buy your daughters telescopes and microscopes! Fix the disparity!

Male, btw. My wife loves watching the kerbals scream while I fly around.

[Accelerando]

MtF except I'm kind of halfway... that makes for a bit of fun with strangers.

Doesn't it? Also, yay for another transperson!

It may be that fewer ladies like the forums for some reason, giving a bias in this poll, in which case you then have to wonder what pushes them away from this kind of environment.

I myself am also a lady, and quite disappointed with this result - I do feel that this game should be able to get at least a 70/30 split in appeal, so it's quite strange that it doesn't have nearly that.

There are actually quite a few. Everyone just assumes that they're male though.

Sadly I can attest to this. Even though my signature clearly declares what I am, and/or I put my gender on forum profile pages, I've still been called "sir" before. And people wonder why they don't see women on the internet as much. I dub this phenomenon manliness-goggles.

Nevertheless, the fact that there are women in this poll at all is at least slightly heartening. But there's definitely much, much farther to go.

I was typing stuff into Google, to see if there was a Barbie space program.

Turns out, Barbie first became an astronaut in 1965. And subsequently went to the Moon (bringing back glow-in-the-dark Moon Rocks), and later to Mars.

MARS !

Awesome! I'll definitely check that out.

[Louella]

Awesome! I'll definitely check that out.

yeah, I didn't know that Astronaut Barbie first appeared four years before the Moon landings, and long before the USA put female astronauts in space (though they had some in training but who didn't fly for some reason.And the USSR had a female astronaut two years before Barbie).

There were some later space Barbie dolls that were spacecraft crew of some sort. Some that made Moon landings (glow in the dark moon rocks), some time in the 80's and 90's. And then a Barbie that went on a Mars mission.

so yeah, whatever it is that means that there's not a lot of female KSP players, it's not Barbie that's the cause of it.

apparently too, original 1965 Astronaut Barbies are real collectors items.

Never had any real Barbie dolls myself, but what I did have, was my own, and my parents Action Man and Sindy dolls, and they went to space! in cardboard box spaceships, with spacesuits made of biscuit wrappers and sellotape and stuff, lol.

[turkwinif]

Other, cheese.

Sometimes, I dream about cheese.

[lajoswinkler]

I dub this phenomenon manliness-goggles.

One of the factors influencing it is English grammar. You simply don't know who are you talking to. Most languages don't have such problems because various helping language features exist. Pronouns, particles, verb suffixes...

[Slam_Jones]

I must say I'm not even remotely surprised by the disparity between male and female KSP'ers.

And I must stop there to keep from getting political

[Accelerando]

yeah, I didn't know that Astronaut Barbie first appeared four years before the Moon landings, and long before the USA put female astronauts in space (though they had some in training but who didn't fly for some reason.And the USSR had a female astronaut two years before Barbie).

There were some later space Barbie dolls that were spacecraft crew of some sort. Some that made Moon landings (glow in the dark moon rocks), some time in the 80's and 90's. And then a Barbie that went on a Mars mission.

so yeah, whatever it is that means that there's not a lot of female KSP players, it's not Barbie that's the cause of it.

apparently too, original 1965 Astronaut Barbies are real collectors items.

Never had any real Barbie dolls myself, but what I did have, was my own, and my parents Action Man and Sindy dolls, and they went to space! in cardboard box spaceships, with spacesuits made of biscuit wrappers and sellotape and stuff, lol.

I suppose so! I'm not sure if a few space missions would have helped sway girls a lot considering the focus seems still to be largely about stuff traditionally marketed to girls, though. Nevertheless, these spacesuits're definitely badass:

And yeah! The Mercury 13 - really awesome people, and it's really sad that they never flew. Apparently NASA mandated that all Mercury astronauts had to be already qualified test pilots, who of course were all dudes.

One of the factors influencing it is English grammar. You simply don't know who are you talking to. Most languages don't have such problems because various helping language features exist. Pronouns, particles, verb suffixes...

While that's true, it isn't really what I mean. After all, the people mistaking my gender could always say "they" if they're unsure. Most people, on the other hand, assume male, or treat masculine nouns as if they're genderless, which raises the question of if you're going to consider masculine nouns genderless, why aren't feminine ones also genderless? But I'll stop there.

English could, though, definitely use a major reworking!

[Whirligig Girl]

Relevant.

[razark]

Nevertheless, these spacesuits're definitely badass:

The first one's not bad.

The other has a couple problems. Space suits aren't form-fitting, and they're not fashion accessories. It seems to say "It's okay if you want to be an astronaut, dear. You can do anything you want. Just so long as you look good doing it."