Part Clipping

[Daveroski]

Would someone please give me the facts on part clipping.

What are the known detrimental effects of clipping parts?

If you have the details on this matter, please feel free to talk to me, in this instance, as though I was a five year old idiot and explain them to me.

No guesses please.. just the FACTS.

[sal_vager]

Part clipping is enabled by default in 0.90.0, what this means is that no checks are made to see if a part is inside another part, it will attach if there is a valid node or surface.

Parts will not attach to a node that is already in use.

The part clipping option in the debug menu enables nodes to be used by more than one part, this causes problems in the craft files and with resource pathing, and is known to break, so it is recommended that you do not use that option.

That's is, not complicated

[Daveroski]

Part clipping is enabled by default in 0.90.0, what this means is that no checks are made to see if a part is inside another part, it will attach if there is a valid node or surface.

Parts will not attach to a node that is already in use.

The part clipping option in the debug menu enables nodes to be used by more than one part, this causes problems in the craft files and with resource pathing, and is known to break, so it is recommended that you do not use that option.

That's is, not complicated

Thanks Sal_Vager,

Now that bit about "this causes problems in the craft files and with resource pathing, and is known to break"

Could you explain that to me as if I was a BSC in computer Information technology and Graphic design?

[Engineer of Stuff]

What are the bugs for the f12 menu part clipping?

[Rosco P. Coltrane]

Can someone confirm that clipping ("traditional", not from the debug menu) octo struts it not prone to disassembling your craft anymore?

[sal_vager]

Can't really explain the node things better then that sorry, you'd need a developer, but the tree style craft files aren't really designed with attaching to multiple nodes in mind.

[Daveroski]

It has been suggested to me that spontaneous rotation of an unpowered (zero thrust) craft in high orbit, without RCS, SAS or Reaction Wheels activated on the craft, can be caused by part clipping.

I'm pretty bright but I'm struggling with this.

Anyone have any actual data that shows that part clipping can be the sole cause of this behaviour?

[Rosco P. Coltrane]

Well, last time I tried it was in 0.20 or something like that. It was pretty much impossible to predict that a ship would have the problem and when it would happen. Sometimes you would send the ship all the way to Jool, only to decouple a probe in orbit and have problems there, a year after launch.

That's why I stopped doing any designs that required many cubic octogonal struts "too close" to each other close to decouplers... So I don't know, tried several designs now and I can't make it happen anymore, but as I said, it was something that you never knew when it would happen.

[T-Bouw]

Nowadays using 0.90, I personally haven't had any weird things happen to my craft and almost each one has some light clipping for aesthetics.

Only when using physical warp do I have problems though I guess that's not related to clipping.

Indeed, with older versions, my craft sometimes spontaneously combusted!

Edited January 27, 2015 by T-Bouw

[rkman]

What are the known detrimental effects of clipping parts?

It allows you to seamlessly transition from semi-realistic engineering into magical engineering.

[Guest]

It has been suggested to me that spontaneous rotation of an unpowered (zero thrust) craft in high orbit, without RCS, SAS or Reaction Wheels activated on the craft, can be caused by part clipping.

I'm pretty bright but I'm struggling with this.

Anyone have any actual data that shows that part clipping can be the sole cause of this behaviour?

Spontaneous rotation can be caused by part clipping, but part clipping is probably not the sole cause. It can be difficult to track down the exact cause when it happens. A quick example : Build a cage out of the modular girder segments that is open on one end. While in orbit, use the cage to corral a spent fuel tank. Now, time warp 5x or more until the fuel tank begins to "slide" through the cage. Exit time warp while 2 parts are sharing the same space or clipping. Watch as strange stuff happens. Sometimes explosions, sometimes weird rotations, sometimes nothing. KSP and unity are good at modeling physics, but are not perfect.

This experiment shows that clipping can cause weird rotational forces. But, I have seen spontaneous rotation occur in other circumstances when clipping wasn't obvious. The SOI you are in is one variable that has influence. The parts used on the craft is another, and how they are attached, whether on a node or surface attached, along with the overall balance of the craft. There are probably more.

[Daveroski]

Spontaneous rotation can be caused by part clipping, but part clipping is probably not the sole cause. It can be difficult to track down the exact cause when it happens. A quick example : Build a cage out of the modular girder segments that is open on one end. While in orbit, use the cage to corral a spent fuel tank. Now, time warp 5x or more until the fuel tank begins to "slide" through the cage. Exit time warp while 2 parts are sharing the same space or clipping. Watch as strange stuff happens. Sometimes explosions, sometimes weird rotations, sometimes nothing. KSP and unity are good at modeling physics, but are not perfect.

This experiment shows that clipping can cause weird rotational forces. But, I have seen spontaneous rotation occur in other circumstances when clipping wasn't obvious. The SOI you are in is one variable that has influence. The parts used on the craft is another, and how they are attached, whether on a node or surface attached, along with the overall balance of the craft. There are probably more.

Thankyou but your example doesn't apply.

I am talking about the parts of a single entity while you are talking about displacement and mesh failure of two entities during warp.

One can expect two entities, each travelling separately at different velocities and on different vectors to do interesting things during warp.

The parts of an individual entity should all be moving at the same velocity and on vectors relative to the COM/COT. Not the same thing at all.

I have experimented with simple entities without intentionally clipped parts. and repeated the experiments with intentionally clipped parts.

My results imply that clipping is not causing the rotation but that the entity is acting on a slightly but distinctly different set of data which as the difference increases, causes the entity to rotate faster. The discrepancy, while small, is being added to the rotational spin.

While having a second entity in close proximity may be the trigger, your postulation regarding warp points to a very different effect.

[panzer1b]

I dont know much about F12 menu, but right now the game doesnt check if a part is colliding.

There are a few issues that may come up, such as phantom forces, or ships spontaneously exploding, but usually, unless you try to decouple or undock something that is inside something else that isnt undocked, you should be fine. If you decouple something inside your craft, it does make a very nice self-destruct feature i will say.