[0.90] Lazor System v35 (Dec 17)

[sal_vager]

I had the engines running okay for me, they even drained properly, the craft just wouldn\'t move even at full thrust

[Romfarer]

I had the engines running okay for me, they even drained properly, the craft just wouldn\'t move even at full thrust

Is it still doing this?

[sal_vager]

Had a bit of difficulty getting the Lazor equipped buggy into the flight scene at first without parts exploding, maybe with the new finer placement system node_colliders were overlapping, but I don\'t know.

I like the new mouse aiming system, much faster and easier to use.

The Stocket launched this time with the SAS button activated but camera limitations prevented me from seeing if it was staging properly, it did fly off course though but that could have been after jettisoning the section with the ASAS, I\'ll try again with a simpler vessel, I will test an early engine cut off and capsule chute deployment.

A test with my Shamrock craft was more successful, I played with the throttle control and was able to make the ship rise and fall on it\'s engine, it seemed to remain straight until i turned off SAS so I believe that is working.

The Shamrock staged perfectly and deployed its parachute, it was a bit low though and almost didn\'t open, maybe a useful feature would be the ability to have two different colours active at once, so I can remote control a craft and see its statistics such as altitude at the same time.

Maybe mixing crystals on a Lazor could allow for this? But it would prevent other colours and effects, I\'m not sure what is best

Perhaps more crystal colours is the easiest way?

I\'m very happy with the remote control, I haven\'t worked out how to steer yet though, well done Romfarer

[Romfarer]

I\'m glad to hear it finally worked out

Had a bit of difficulty getting the Lazor equipped buggy into the flight scene at first without parts exploding, maybe with the new finer placement system node_colliders were overlapping, but I don\'t know.

Please upload the craft file so i can have a look at it.

The Stocket launched this time with the SAS button activated but camera limitations prevented me from seeing if it was staging properly, it did fly off course though but that could have been after jettisoning the section with the ASAS, I\'ll try again with a simpler vessel, I will test an early engine cut off and capsule chute deployment.

The 'advance stage + set throttle' part of remote control was more of a tech preview. Right now it is only possible to remote control crafts within a 2500meter range. Beyond this point the craft is destroyed automatically by the game engine.

The Shamrock staged perfectly and deployed its parachute, it was a bit low though and almost didn\'t open, maybe a useful feature would be the ability to have two different colours active at once, so I can remote control a craft and see its statistics such as altitude at the same time.

This is definately a job for the side mounted lazors. I\'m gonna add these features real soon.

Maybe mixing crystals on a Lazor could allow for this? But it would prevent other colours and effects, I\'m not sure what is best

This would be the heart of the planning phase, to build your lazor system to do exactly what you want it to do. I think i\'ll purposely make it so you can\'t run the system with everything enabled at the same time. Or would that be bad?

Thanks for the feedback

[sal_vager]

I unfortunately do not have the .craft as I saved over it when making a working buggy, but the Lazor emitters may have just been too close together.

The 2500m limit will be a menace should we want to control landed craft from orbit, it\'s a rails problem and I don\'t think there is a solution at this stage.

Having more than one mode active could be useful depending on what the player wants to do, maybe the only limitations should be system weight and drag (and cost later) if we decide we need all the Lazors features I see no reason not to allow it, it\'s just how all the current and future colours will be made available I\'m unsure of, though that can be worked on later as there is still the scanning beam to deal with next I think.

I think for immersion, scanning should not be instant, in every film with scanners there is some kind of delay and effect before info is relayed, and the format in which the info is displayed is important as well, maybe it\'s possible to display a wireframe image of the target?

[Romfarer]

Having more than one mode active could be useful depending on what the player wants to do, maybe the only limitations should be system weight and drag (and cost later) if we decide we need all the Lazors features I see no reason not to allow it, it\'s just how all the current and future colours will be made available I\'m unsure of, though that can be worked on later as there is still the scanning beam to deal with next I think.

I was thinking of adding a second lazor mounting position to the lazor system module. So the selection of systems would be based on the color of these. You would of course have access to all the stuff that requires a white, green, red or blue lead lazor then or two of variations of those colors. Or you could add a color crystal to one of them, opening up for more advanced systems, within its group (red, green, blue) and this is why i wanted to have those colors represent the really basic system functions.

I think for immersion, scanning should not be instant, in every film with scanners there is some kind of delay and effect before info is relayed, and the format in which the info is displayed is important as well, maybe it\'s possible to display a wireframe image of the target?

Already good on the way with the scanning system. One for finding targets in mouse-look mode and one for getting information about a target, once locked. Still haven\'t decided what to display though.

I believe it is possible to display a wireframe image of the target. I also believe it is incredible hard to do =P on the other hand. YEEEESS we need this!! ??? do you want it as a hologram projected from the vessel or in a GUI window?

[sal_vager]

When I thought of this, I imagined the target ship in a GUI window, perhaps with parts listed below, but a hologram sounds far cooler, I need to see that

[Romfarer]

Looks like it\'s gonna be a camera view of the target in a GUI window. Took me the good part of the afternoon but now i know how to do it this thing is funny, can make telescopes and stuff with it...

Edit: I knew this would be tricky. So i have now made a window that displays the target, HOWEVER when the target is far away, it\'s just not there >

[sal_vager]

Telescope mode? Now that is a feature I really want

To get around the distance limitation maybe it\'s possible to build a new temporary craft matching the target craft, and place it in a layer the player can\'t see but the target view can?

The telescope mode would be cool as scan mode 2 (2 Lazors), with mode 1 showing data and mode 3 showing a parts list.

[Romfarer]

The camera works just fine as long as things are not too far away (2500 meter or something). Beyond that everything is pretty much invisible and it can only see the skybox. And this might be the true problem, i\'m sure i can force just the target object to show, but around it will be a gray skybox. Yeah i can remove that too and so but.....the dream of remote controlling a vehicle from orbit is far away as it means there probably wont be any surface to remote control it on =P

[sal_vager]

Okay, surface remote control from orbit will have to wait until KSP supports it, just being able to control nearby craft is already an amazing thing, I\'m going to have to talk up your plugin in other threads as it really should be as big as Mechjeb, the remote SAS alone is brilliant.

[Romfarer]

Here is a sneak peek at the Target Cam prototype. Unfortunately it\'s range is only 2500 meter. The system keeps Unloading my vessels beyond that point no matter how fast i Load them again =P I want to make it stop doing that >

Oh yeah and the game is rendered using 4 cameras and i have yet to figure out how to draw them all in the window...

[sal_vager]

I\'m liking that, ok so there\'s a range limit, so the screen will just have to go fuzzy and say 'out of range' for now.

[Romfarer]

What\'s annoying about it is that the camera can see the buildings at ksp 'perfectly'. Here is one taken from 300km above ksp.

[sal_vager]

Yeah I think that\'s because Kerbin is scaled down and isn\'t that far away, it just looks like it is, but that will be confusing for people, I guess you could say they are simulated images of known objects.

Is it possible to build a craft from the file in miniature so it\'s in range as a nonpiloted craft but looks far away?

[Romfarer]

It is actually over 300km away, just checked with my distance measuring device (overcharged it). I\'d really like to figure out how to do the loading and unloading of vessels manually.

[Romfarer]

I figured out how to display vessels beyond the 2500 meter limit. Can\'t believe how simple the solution was, and that i didn\'t think of it before.... :-[

This vessel is 3500 meter away. Notice how the lazor i\'m sending towards the vessel is displayed as well.

Here my target is approximately 369km away. The lazor can\'t be seen, this is probably because i\'m emitting from so far away while moving fast. The display of the target is shaking like crazy too.

[Kreuzung]

That looks cool, maybe also add something like this for space telescopes that just look forward (and maybe have unnatural colors)?

Also, shaking camera doesn\'t sound that unnatural for this distance. Can we control them from far away too? And are you checking for things that could block lazor communication?

[Romfarer]

That looks cool, maybe also add something like this for space telescopes that just look forward (and maybe have unnatural colors)?

How exactly do you envision that these telescopes should work?

Also, shaking camera doesn\'t sound that unnatural for this distance. Can we control them from far away too? And are you checking for things that could block lazor communication?

I can remove the shaking completely but perhaps it should be a feature that the cams get more and more unstable the farther away from the target you get, to the point where you only get static.

By control i suppose you mean, remote control of the vessel, i\'m still working on that. There has to be some limit though because of the floating point issue. Unless some modifications are done to the game engine.

There is no line of sight implemented for the camera or the tracking station linkup yet.

[Kreuzung]

Telescope - Just looks into a direction set in it\'s part.cfg. It just \'zooms\' (shows terrain details, vessels, etc) into that direction, and maybe applies something (I really don\'t know what) that makes it look less natural and more pseudo-scientific.

Min and max zoom should be configurable too.

[sal_vager]

I\'m less worried about how it looks and more interested in what it can do and how to control it, obviously it\'d track the locked target or point in the direction you set it in with the mouse, I think zoom is important but if it\'s a scope it could be better with set zoom levels you can click on, just as if you were changing eyepieces.

That would help set an absolute range as well just like a real scope, it\'d just depend on what eyepieces we get, the image could also get dimmer the further you 'zoom'

[Romfarer]

To begin with i\'m planning to add some functionality to the target cam to make it easier to track your target. Such as the ability to change the position of the camera (move frame around), change zoom level and lock the orientation. The last point is there because the up axis keep changing and your craft will for the most part be spinning in some direction or be up side down when you activate the cam. Not to mention, some objects (half of the ksp buildings) have a incorrect up axis.

I\'m also having a little progress on the remote controlling from a distance, i have moved from 'nothing happens' to 'exploding the craft immediately' to 'moving a little and then exploding the craft' =P Also if you apply my technique to a craft that is within 2500 meter you get the most spectacular explosion i have ever seen in ksp ;D

[sal_vager]

Also if you apply my technique to a craft that is within 2500 meter you get the most spectacular explosion i have ever seen in ksp ;D

Sounds good

I was wondering also if it\'s worth making some features later for use on your own craft, now we have aircraft it\'d be amazing if the Lazor were able to show the forces acting on it, it\'s center of mass, thrust and lift, and other stuff useful for craft design, obviously it could only show these in the flight scene but it\'d be a bit like in orbiter where forces can be displayed.

Don\'t worry about this for now though, it\'s just an idea, but if anyone can make that work it\'s you

[Romfarer]

Don\'t worry about this for now though, it\'s just an idea, but if anyone can make that work it\'s you

Thanks for the confidence vote

About the other thing you mentioned, isn\'t mechjeb doing this already? Or one of the calculator mods? cause it\'s just a matter of reading the values from the parts.

When i was doing my orbit tests i could see the use of the prograde, retrograde, -g control functions. I think i\'ll open for the possibility to remote-control your own vessel

[sal_vager]

Mechjeb does show you your altitude and velocity, and in that regard it is a very good tool, but just having it installed is a temptation to use it, and it can do almost all your flying for you.

Not only that but having it can make other dubious of whether you were flying your craft, or mechjeb, this wouldn\'t be a problem with your Lazor as even with remote control, you are still in control and doing things manually, which I think is a really great feature of your Lazor.

Remote control of your own craft might be interesting, as it would be a new way to manually fly without having a computer do all the work for you, even if we can point and click like in EVE it\'d still be manual control and require the players concentration, it could be fun

Edit!:

Romfarer, I have an idea how we can get more people using your Lazor, there are a lot of players who are crying out for a way to have their airplanes and orbiters keep level with the planet below when ASAS is enabled, instead of the current behaviour where craft remain stationary relative to the universe.

They basically want their craft to automatically tilt at the correct rate so they keep the same part facing the body they are orbiting or flying over.

You already mentioned remote control of your own craft, well this is a feature these players have been asking for for ages, it just needs to work like ASAS, they\'ll deactivate it to steer, and if it can also work on other craft and remember its state the same way Tosh\'s cart does with its brakes and lights, players will use it to make tidally locked space stations

The Lazor will become the must have mod