[1.8+] Real Fuels

[Starwaster]

This is the final Real Fuels release specifically for KSP 1.0.4 to address a bug that could lock up KSP when starting the game.

Also includes insulation/conductivity fixes.

All development after this will be for KSP 1.0.5 (which is mostly already done but needs some further testing/development to ensure proper thermal analytic operation)

A 1.0.5 update won't be too far behind but I wanted to get this out of the way for anyone who wanted to stick with 1.0.4 for whatever reason. (waiting for mods to update, etc etc)

https://github.com/NathanKell/ModularFuelSystem/releases/tag/rf-v10.7.2

Change log

• Increased boiloff rate can be switched off by adding ferociousBoilOff = False to MFSSETTINGS (best use MM patch for that)
  
• PhysicsGlobal.conductionFactor can be compensated for by adding globalConductionCompensation = true to MFSSETTINGS (use at own risk)
  
• cryogenic outerInsulation improved to 0.0005 (previous value 0.01)
  
• All LOX tanks now assume stainless steel tanks, except the ServiceModule.
  

Note the first item there. Those who feel that boiloff is too intense can reduce that by editing the RealSettings.cfg file and adding %ferociousBoilOff = False to MFSSETTINGS

Or instead of directly editing that file, create a Module Manager config like so

@MFSSETTINGS[MFSSettings]:FINAL
{
	%ferociousBoilOff = False
}

Edited November 10, 2015 by Starwaster

[Sovek]

Thanks. Cause it was getting stupid. I still have 1.04 and using the stock configs with KScale 2. I COULD NOT launch RP-1/LOX fueled rockets without all LOX boiling off before it even burned through half of its RP-1 with the default tanks. It took two small radiator panels and cryo-tanks just to avoid all my LOX disappearing into the void.

[Gaarst]

I am having an issue with liquid oxygen boiling off cryogenic tanks way too fast as soon as I launch the rocket; using the latest version: 10.7.1 in KSP 1.0.4.

The issue is described in this thread.

May be linked to other liquid oxygen boiloff issues I've seen in this thread.

Also, I have issues with Real Fuels detecting modded tanks types: all of my modded tanks are set to Default, even while using the latest version (10.7.1, KSP 1.0.4).

Sorry if this is not the right place to report this one.

Didn't see there was a new release, sorry.

Edited November 11, 2015 by Gaarst

[Jovus]

Re: LOX boiloff - check two posts above your own.

[ialdabaoth]

Hrm. I have FAR, AJE and RealFuels installed, and I'm trying to build my own set of resources from scratch.

I'm trying to set up:

LiquidFuel (with the same stats as RealFuels' Kerosene)

Oxidizer (with the same stats as RealFuels' NTO)

CryOx (with the same stats as RealFuels' LqdOxygen)

CryoFuel (with the same stats as RealFuels' LqdHydrogen)

MonoPropellant (with the same stats as RealFuels' Hydrazine)

XenonGas (as modified by RealFuels)

I've got all the tank types set up, and after wrestling with AJE's attempts to insert LqdMethane and Ethanol back into the fuel mix, I've got that resolved.

But now I keep getting an error at various parts (as I use modulemanager to comment out one part, it appears in another):

MissingMethodException: Method not found: 'PhysicsGlobals.get_SkinInteralConductionFactor'.

Any idea what I'm doing wrong?

[Starwaster]

We still have to put out a build for 1.0.5 because that field got renamed. The last build was ONLY for 1.0.4

I'll try to get something out tonight, got sidetracked.

[ialdabaoth]

Oohhhhhhh. Cool.

[fallout2077]

I've encountered a strange bug that seems to stem from Real Fuels that renders the game unplayable. I am playing with KSP 1.0.5 and using RF 10.7.2, and when playing a game using Real Fuels the game becomes quite choppy performance-wise and absolutely no parts are loaded. It strikes me as odd that Real Fuels would cause this problem, but upon removing Real Fuels from my GameData folder, the above issues are resolved. I will post my KSP.log file with this post.

Log file:https://www.dropbox.com/s/18kur1vyis9gw27/KSP.log?dl=0

[Starwaster]

I've encountered a strange bug that seems to stem from Real Fuels that renders the game unplayable. I am playing with KSP 1.0.5 and using RF 10.7.2, and when playing a game using Real Fuels the game becomes quite choppy performance-wise and absolutely no parts are loaded. It strikes me as odd that Real Fuels would cause this problem, but upon removing Real Fuels from my GameData folder, the above issues are resolved. I will post my KSP.log file with this post.

Log file:https://www.dropbox.com/s/18kur1vyis9gw27/KSP.log?dl=0

Real Fuels isn't out for KSP 1.0.5 yet. Read the change logs, they tell you that the most recent version is for 1.0.4

[fallout2077]

Real Fuels isn't out for KSP 1.0.5 yet. Read the change logs, they tell you that the most recent version is for 1.0.4

I know. I just figured I would post this bug just in case it would help when compiling a new version of RF for 1.0.5.

[ialdabaoth]

So it's just a change to line 328 of ModuleFuelTanks.cs, right? What's the new variable called?

[Padishar]

So it's just a change to line 328 of ModuleFuelTanks.cs, right? What's the new variable called?

Was the spelling typo just fixed (or was that typo by the poster rather than in the code)?

[Starwaster]

So it's just a change to line 328 of ModuleFuelTanks.cs, right? What's the new variable called?

Ho no no no.

There's a little more than that. The beginnings of thermal analytical handling are in place now.

In analytical mode, the boiloff function ceases its normal operation and instead relies on calls from the analytical code to tell it what thermal changes will occur that frame so that it can make adjustments.

- - - Updated - - -

(Deleted link to pre-release; it's as problematic to people as trying to run 10.7 with KSP 1.0.5, which the whole point of putting it out was to stave off that off)

Edited November 16, 2015 by Starwaster

[Citizen247]

I'm trying to test RealFuels with the stockalike configs on 1.05, with just Realplume, realfuels, configs and dependencies, but the game won't load. The loading screen hangs when trying to load engines.

My Log can be found at the link below:
[url]https://onedrive.live.com/redir?resid=F7341A7556FD45C4!33775&authkey=!AGn2IJeQYhauC8g&ithint=file%2ctxt[/url]

[Starwaster]

[quote name='Citizen247']I'm trying to test RealFuels with the stockalike configs on 1.05, with just Realplume, realfuels, configs and dependencies, but the game won't load. The loading screen hangs when trying to load engines.

My Log can be found at the link below:
[URL]https://onedrive.live.com/redir?resid=F7341A7556FD45C4!33775&authkey=!AGn2IJeQYhauC8g&ithint=file%2ctxt[/URL][/QUOTE]


Delete any ModuleAnimateEmissive folder in your GameData folder.

Delete any ModuleAnimateEmissive.dll files in GameData/RealFuels/Plugins that might be lurking there.

Delete any SolverEngines.dll files in GameData/RealFuels/Plugins that might be lurking there.

Copy the below text to a file named RemoveModuleAnimateEmissive.cfg
[CODE]
@PART
[*]:HAS[@MODULE[ModuleAnimateEmissive]]:FINAL
{
@MODULE[ModuleAnimateEmissive]
{
@name = FXModuleAnimateThrottle
animationName = #$ThermalAnim$
!ThermalAnim = DELETE
}
}
[/CODE]

If it still doesn't work after that then you'll have to wait for the real full update of Real Fuels. (if you do everything right in those steps it should work though)

I'm taking down the pre-release though. The whole point of it was to stave off people trying to run RF 10.7 with KSP 1.0.5 but it's problematic either way :(

Sorry guys.

[fallout2077]

[quote name='Starwaster']Sorry guys.[/QUOTE]

No need to be apologetic, Starwaster. It was an worthwhile attempt, and if anything good came out of the failed pre-release, its that a plethora of information was gleaned from it.

[Starwaster]

[quote name='fallout2077']No need to be apologetic, Starwaster. It was an worthwhile attempt, and if anything good came out of the failed pre-release, its that a plethora of information was gleaned from it.[/QUOTE]

Eh it was more of a time sink than anything else

[Citizen247]

[quote name='Starwaster']
If it still doesn't work after that then you'll have to wait for the real full update of Real Fuels. (if you do everything right in those steps it should work though)

I'm taking down the pre-release though. The whole point of it was to stave off people trying to run RF 10.7 with KSP 1.0.5 but it's problematic either way :(

Sorry guys.[/QUOTE]
The only place I found those files was in the solver engine plugin folder. On a hunch I deleted that and installed the latest version, and the game loads, but engines don't work.

I guess I'll be waiting for the official release, but thanks for your help. :)

ETA:
Actually, ignore me. I'm an idiot. I've screwed something else up elsewhere. On a completely clean install, using just the RealFuels and Stock configs, and the dependencies from CKAN, everything seems to work perfectly. Edited November 16, 2015 by Citizen247

[BevoLJ]

I know of the mm patch for LOX but before taking such a drastic action, I was curious if anyone knew of a simple solution to helping the FASA launch pumps deal with the LOX boil off on the pad prior to launch. When trying to aim for certain xfer windows, I keep running into issues where my FASA pumps can't refill the LOX tanks on my larger rockets faster than it is boiling off (both in and out of time warp). Is there a mm patch to increase the throughput of the FASA pumps?

[NathanKell]

That confuses me, because RF should be keeping temps cool during prelaunch regardless of pump status.

[BevoLJ]

I think it has something to do with KJR. Often when I launch a rocket (using KCT in career mode) it wobbles (Saturn 1 size or larger) when KJR is loading. That prompts the mission to start (clock in top left). If that clock starts then I almost never have LOX by time I am ready for my launch window.

What I have been doing is just finding the time, then reverting. Timewarping in the main screen to the appropriate time, then launching again. But with KCT adding scene changes (mem leaks) I'd like to find another option that requires less scene changes. Will probably just use the MM patch for now, but would rather find a fix like upping the pump throughput if possible so I can use RF as intended. =) Edited November 17, 2015 by BevoLJ

[fallout2077]

[quote name='Starwaster']Eh it was more of a time sink than anything else[/QUOTE]

That's too bad that no good came from all of the trouble. Hopefully next time will be more fruitful.

[Verdiss]

Is there supposed to be some sort of restriction on when one can access cryogenic tanks? I can't seem to select the cryogenic type, it's on the slider, but every time I click to it it switches away instantly.

[Laie]

[quote name='Verdiss']I can't seem to select the cryogenic type, it's on the slider, but every time I click to it it switches away instantly.[/QUOTE]

If you play RP-0, cryo tanks require "advanced construction".

[COLOR="silver"][SIZE=1]- - - Updated - - -[/SIZE][/COLOR]

Doing a few more boiloff tests...
My test regime is to hyperedit the craft into a 150Gm orbit round the sun (about earth-like), wait 1h for things to settle down, refill the tank through hyperedit, then gauge the boiloff.

Problem is that I seemingly can't get the same rate of boiloff twice. Riddle me this.

But even so, I can say with great confidence that attaching anything to a tank will dramatically increase the rate of boiloff. Like, engines, probe cores, RCS... don't get me wrong, my problem is not the increase, but that it increases by so much.

[Starwaster]

[quote name='Laie']Doing a few more boiloff tests...
My test regime is to hyperedit the craft into a 150Gm orbit round the sun (about earth-like), wait 1h for things to settle down, refill the tank through hyperedit, then gauge the boiloff.

Problem is that I seemingly can't get the same rate of boiloff twice. Riddle me this.
[/QUOTE]

The temperatures (internal/external) were likely different at the beginning of each test and then you dumped a whole lot of resource into the tank for the second test which changed its thermal mass and thusly altered the dynamics of the test.