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[1.2] USI Survivability Pack (Formerly DERP) [v0.6.0]


RoverDude
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Two comments:

1. The alternate textures you provided are .png whereas the originals are .tga. Thus, using them requires editing the models in a hex-editor.

2. CLS users (myself included) may consider the evacuation feature to be a "cheat", in that it allows instant non-EVA transfer regardless of the presence of CLS "passability" between the modules. I would appreciate an option to disable this feature, or (ideally) to make it "CLS aware" (i.e., if CLS is installed, evacuation is only possible if the escape pod shares a "Living Space" with the module being evacuated).

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"...may consider the evacuation feature to be a "cheat"..."

While it is a nice mod that fills a needed niche simply and efficiently, it cheats in more areas than just CLS. For its size it carries too much life support and fuel, it needs a heat shield with its current surface configuration of hatches, nozzles and stuff. I am going to 'go with the flow' on the viability of an structure/material that could withstand not only the inertial physics of spaceflight, reentry and changes from a vacuum to heavier atmospheric pressures while being 'inflatable' since this is supposed to be another planet/race and technology environment and is a concept found in other mods.

It is a nice concept and mod. It could also function as a Soyuz style orbital pod on a space craft that is not deployed till in orbit. But, IMHO, it has a bit too much resources for size and is not externally reentry friendly.

Edited by jpkerman
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This is amazing. I love it already and I haven't even downloaded it yet! Thanks RoverDude!

As for it being 'cheaty' I envision this (with is great Life Support supply) to be a little ship that can take kerbals away from a doomed space station, or from a ship that dont'have the dV to reach home... but not capable of surviving re-entry on Kerbin. Even if it is technically capable of it I think it's a perfectly useful module without using it for that!

Edited by TurielD
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Two comments:

1. The alternate textures you provided are .png whereas the originals are .tga. Thus, using them requires editing the models in a hex-editor.

2. CLS users (myself included) may consider the evacuation feature to be a "cheat", in that it allows instant non-EVA transfer regardless of the presence of CLS "passability" between the modules. I would appreciate an option to disable this feature, or (ideally) to make it "CLS aware" (i.e., if CLS is installed, evacuation is only possible if the escape pod shares a "Living Space" with the module being evacuated).

1. Incorrect. Delete the TGAs, copy in PNGs, and you're all set. It's in the Readme. I'll drop in TGA's but I have to push then through PartTools as hand editing the TGAs caused horrible problems, and it was a quick gift for the folks that wanted it.

2. Will put it on the features request, but short term I'd say just not use the feature, it's one you have to very explicitly toggle via an action group (it's the only way to get to it, by design). That being said, the evac feature is one that falls pretty squarely in the realm of what this mod will most likely be used for ;)

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"...may consider the evacuation feature to be a "cheat"..."

While it is a nice mod that fills a needed niche simply and efficiently, it cheats in more areas than just CLS. For its size it carries too much life support and fuel, it needs a heat shield with its current surface configuration of hatches, nozzles and stuff. I am going to 'go with the flow' on the viability of an structure/material that could withstand not only the inertial physics of spaceflight, reentry and changes from a vacuum to heavier atmospheric pressures while being 'inflatable' since this is supposed to be another planet/race and technology environment and is a concept found in other mods.

It is a nice concept and mod. It could also function as a Soyuz style orbital pod on a space craft that is not deployed till in orbit. But, IMHO, it has a bit too much resources for size and is not externally reentry friendly.

Ah, cheat is such a strong word. But given balance was one of the items on the to do list, now is as good a time as any to cover it :)

Let's cover life support first. Note that food is very limited - this is because Kerbals won't starve for 30 days. So I used the space for water and oxygen. The basis was the tiny TAC-LS cans, which would easily fit inside the pod even in a deflated state (they would be stowed behind the hatch). Granted, we won't cover fun stuff like lower activity levels and the fact that they'd be drinking their own urine soon enough ;)

Fuel wise, I am carrying 18 liquid fuel and 22 oxidizer. I actually agree that that volume is high, and will be tweaking accordingly now that I have it side by side with one of the Oscar cans (probably about half of that).

Thrust is at 30, same as a single Roco 48-7s, but that I will be tweaking down to about 10. Still plenty for this, and more in line with the size of a pair of the 'ant' engines for the quad. Vac ISP is 400, will see about keeping it at that range.

Monoprop is 10, could stand a slight tweak down to five or so when comparing the quad tanks.

FYI I had the same concerns with the model when dealing with reentry, but in the end when dealing with moving colliders and hatches, went with simplicity and figured I could get a pass on that bit of suspension of disbelief. In a do-over I'd probably move the hinges and handle behind/under the overhang of the hatch lid, etc.

RE inflatability, etc. I would submit to you the humble moose. If we can propose sending a human back to earth in an inflated bag with a quarter inch flexible heat shield filled with expanding foam, all in a suitcase-sized package, then I don't think having an inflatable reentry vehicle is too much of a stretch ;) Hell, if anything I'd say the Moose was a lot more Kerbal than what I ended up with (though it was the inspiration for the mod).

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This is amazing. I love it already and I haven't even downloaded it yet! Thanks RoverDude!

As for it being 'cheaty' I envision this (with is great Life Support supply) to be a little ship that can take kerbals away from a doomed space station, or from a ship that dont'have the dV to reach home... but not capable of surviving re-entry on Kerbin. Even if it is technically capable of it I think it's a perfectly useful module without using it for that!

Amazing Part Roverdude! You are one busy bee :) thanks for the alt texutures that are included as well, they match a bit more IMHO :)

Thanks, and yep, it started out as more of a canister life raft carryover (including sealed food), but ended up being a moose-life raft hybrid. And tbh, even with DRE I've landed some terrifyingly fragile things by being pretty careful, most without heat shields.

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So I did some tweaks.

Moved water down to 11, Food to 1. Only because you can survive three days without water in the TAC-LS default config.

LF/Ox is now 1.35/1.65 with 420 ISP @ 10 thrust. Still have no issues deorbiting a stable Kerbin orbit.

Monoprop is 2.5. Ablation is 100, and it looks like I have to tweak the RealChutes config and add a secondary chute because I keep getting Kerbals killed with G-forces ;)

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This is impressive, what do you think about a smaller version, without engines or a parachute, that could be used as a Personal Rescue Enclosure?

That's precisely why there are two parts ;) You can use the capsule as a rescue enclosure (which was the original design). It will keep a Kerbal alive for 15 days inside. Granted, it will be a horrible 15 days as he wallows in a bubble filled with his own filth, but hey, better than puffing into smoke ;)

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Hmm...

After reading this, I would propose a different (probably bigger) version... This would be for interplanetary missions, where quick response to emergency situations is unlikely.

Basically the same kind of setup, but a larger undeployed volume (expanded base height), sacrificing (most of the) deorbit capability for extended life support consumables. The rationale behind it is basically keeping the crew alive long term in orbit for rescue, rather than de-orbiting the crew.

Also, one thing bothers me... how does this meet it's electrical power needs? One would assume there's at least an emergency beacon going when occupied... and various other electrical needs. Fuel cell might be a possibility, though a H2 + O2 fuel cell would allow for better duration on the water.

Another random thought... does the same 'evac' button that dumps the crew to pods also top off any/all resources in the pods? Makes sense in that these pods should be the last to be used.

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Hmm...

After reading this, I would propose a different (probably bigger) version... This would be for interplanetary missions, where quick response to emergency situations is unlikely.

Basically the same kind of setup, but a larger undeployed volume (expanded base height), sacrificing (most of the) deorbit capability for extended life support consumables. The rationale behind it is basically keeping the crew alive long term in orbit for rescue, rather than de-orbiting the crew.

Also, one thing bothers me... how does this meet it's electrical power needs? One would assume there's at least an emergency beacon going when occupied... and various other electrical needs. Fuel cell might be a possibility, though a H2 + O2 fuel cell would allow for better duration on the water.

Another random thought... does the same 'evac' button that dumps the crew to pods also top off any/all resources in the pods? Makes sense in that these pods should be the last to be used.

The LS supplies are added when the pod is unpacked (Eventually I'll do some trickery where I lower the part's mass, changing mass for resources). They are effectively being 'unsealed' - so cannot be consumed unless the pod is cracked open.

RE larger version - you could easily add in additional modules in between the propulsion module and the lifeboat module.

Electricity is provided by a tiny atomic slug a-la RTG, but 1/10th the size (humans have made these fellows in the sub-3kg range, so logical that Kerbals would have something similar). Lights would absolutely kill it, but it's enough (barely) to keep a Kerbal alive. Of course, he'd still be in a bubble... in the dark.

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1. Incorrect. Delete the TGAs, copy in PNGs, and you're all set. It's in the Readme. I'll drop in TGA's but I have to push then through PartTools as hand editing the TGAs caused horrible problems, and it was a quick gift for the folks that wanted it.

Ah, I see, my mistake.

2. Will put it on the features request, but short term I'd say just not use the feature, it's one you have to very explicitly toggle via an action group (it's the only way to get to it, by design). That being said, the evac feature is one that falls pretty squarely in the realm of what this mod will most likely be used for ;)

I understand, and I do think it's a neat feature, it's just that enforcing "passability" for non-EVA transfers is basically the only existing purpose for CLS, and I happen to enjoy that game mechanic.

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I actually got a moment to play with it and here's a not so idle thought:

Why have a liquid fuel engine at all? I found that I failed to clip the atmosphere from a 300km orbit, exausted my fuel, but I still have a few units of monopropellant, which I can't use to alter the trajectory because there's no nozzle pointing straight back.

Well, make the main engine consume monopropellant instead and stop splitting fuel reserves, for an engine of this size this is perfectly normal.

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I actually got a moment to play with it and here's a not so idle thought:

Why have a liquid fuel engine at all? I found that I failed to clip the atmosphere from a 300km orbit, exausted my fuel, but I still have a few units of monopropellant, which I can't use to alter the trajectory because there's no nozzle pointing straight back.

Well, make the main engine consume monopropellant instead and stop splitting fuel reserves, for an engine of this size this is perfectly normal.

I like that idea - let me fiddle with it :)

...Oh, and a problem.

Going to tracking station from an inflated pod, and then returning, you come back to a deflated pod with a kerbal mysteriously squished inside. :)

Whoops - better persist a variable it looks like....

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Oh, and sorry for triple posting, but I got the bay attach method to work.

PodEngine.cfg needs to change like this:


node_stack_bottom = 0.0, -0.12, 0.0, 0.0, -1.0, 0.0, 1
// Yes, node direction is significant here.
...
MODULE
{
name = KASModulePartBay
BAY
{
attachNode = bottom
type = DERPConnector
}
}

MODULE
{
name = KASModuleGrab
evaPartPos = (0.0, 0.0, 0.0)
evaPartDir = (0,0,-1)
storable = True
storedSize = 40
attachOnPart = true
}

PodCapsule.cfg needs to change like this:


MODULE
{
name = KASModuleGrab
evaPartPos = (0.0, 0.0, 0.0)
evaPartDir = (0,0,-1)
storable = True
storedSize = 40
attachOnPart = false
bayType = DERPConnector
bayNode = top
bayRot = (0.0, 0.0, 0.0)
}

Instead of "Attach", you use "Store" like you would do when attaching a container to a container bay. Tested, attaching in VAB still works, attaching in the field works without positioning and insta-snaps to the correct location. :)

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@RoverDude: good job, one "issue": the part is named DERP, seems to be in version 0.1.3, 1st post title state 0.1.2, download link is Lifeboat_0.1.3.zip (unless it's not the good one) :huh:

No changelog, confusing names, I guess there is a room for little improvements here :).

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@RoverDude: good job, one "issue": the part is named DERP, seems to be in version 0.1.3, 1st post title state 0.1.2, download link is Lifeboat_0.1.3.zip (unless it's not the good one) :huh:

No changelog, confusing names, I guess there is a room for little improvements here :).

No worries, running through some housekeeping anyway

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