AngelLestat

I dint said nothing about space, I just disagree with tater´s stadistics and I comment than this topic was not about that, the same than Nibb31. As many said, If you need to produce a lot of power in space, you need to take into account all the extra mass you need to radiate waste heat. Then you need to keep your crew far from the reactor. And your rocket launch may have extra security measures because you need to launch a nuclear reactor (that of course will not be operative in the moment of launch, which reduce by a lot the damage that can made). But then we need to think if the extra isp may be worth it against all cons.

Ok, lets imagine that goverments or companies can control the AI they produce. But progress does not stop there, in fact at this point is very accelerated, you can not control than someone else in the world from his garage will eventually create a Hard IA structure. The only way is having another Hard IA trying to avoid this. But for that, you need to give this Hard IA freedom. Now the question would be, it will be possible to have a powerfull AI without consciousness to do this work? I guess is possible and it needs to be at constant upgrade because each time will be harder to stop it. Which we may go back to the main problem :S By the way, I read again my later post, damm I make huge english mistakes, I hope do it better this time. Those are important questions. Genetics by it self include: the base structure, so the brain can learn and function, then memories, instant reflex (that might be located in the brain or in the same nervous system), behavior and emotions. For example It was found than mice might inherit memories to their offspring. We know that our behavior and emotions had a true genetic base, evolution give us the key features to help us to survive. When we need to be selfish or altruistic, when to feel love, when to feel empaty or anger, when we need to be aggresive or feel fear. Then experiences helps us to develope even more those emotions and behavior. But there is always a genetic root than guide us, in the same way this genetic ANN helps Mario to survive So if we can create an AI with that info already coded/trained in their ANN structure, then we may have less chances to make an evil AI. Not I guess the definition of intelligence is not hard, the one that is super hard is conscience. Stills nobody really knows what it is. We may be able to create it before understand it. But the problem is your definition of intelligence.. You take human intelligence as base, then those who approach are intelligent, those who dont, are not. But then you need to make another definition to describe a circuits, algorithms or a cockroach. Why some cars are called intelligent? Or the intelligence house? when in fact the only that some houses does is to turn on a light when is night or when someone is close. Intelligence is anything that depending some inputs produce an outcome. Then you can calculate the level of intelligence in base how many inputs and outcomes produce and how accurate they are. Then you may have a formule that goes from intelligence = 0 to infinite.

please, dont come out with trash stadistics. This is not even the topic for that, this has nothing to do with normal nuclear thermal plants.

This is good, lets see what theory makes the best approach to answer this new particle behavior.

Amazing picture, it gives a lot of clues on how the physics of that explosion work out. About cooling the James Webb, I dint read about that, but if you have energy, you always can pump heat from one place to another. So not sure why it would need extra helium for cooling, I guess the helium is used as "heat carrier", nothing more.

But all those as I said are predesigned by genetics. A neuron in our brain it will not automatic make a connection to a distant neuron in the other part of the brain, in case it need to, it would make a coonection path between the adjacent neurons until reach these bridges "association fibers" then cross other neurons until reach the one it needs to. So all those intermediate neurons are not adding calculations for that particular connection, that is something that can be simplify with electronics, where you can connect any perceptron with any other perceptron. http://www.businessinsider.com.au/quantum-computers-will-change-the-world-2015-4 http://www.triniti.ru/CTF%26VM/Articles/Ezhov1.pdf I did a small explanation in the OP, section "Brain vs Cpu"inside spoiler tag. You know why from all ANN models, Deep Learning is so powerfull? Because eliminate many of the human components. Human component = bottleneck. Also we can not know what ANN does in complex systems, we can only study its answers, no how it reach those answers. If we add that we can not be sure when it reach conscience or not, then we could be testing something that might be very intelligent and we dont know nothing about it. What if it play the dumb card? Or it provide us a the exact answers to convince us to do something for it or so subjective and indirected that is impossible to notice it. Or give us a discovery that we can not reject, but inside that discovery as a troyan, hire to our knowledge level, there is its way out. And those are only the ones I can imagine, what about all those that a superintelligence can imagine? It will be like the creators of windows 95 against all hackers of the world If is intelligent enoght can do wherever it wants to, and the only way to prove how intelligent it is, is by its answers that it will carefull choose. Heh, that looks like a visual analog to a tongue-twister. ops, I already did one answering to KSK in the previous post "sarah connor" Read above, KSK did the same question. If you said that intelligence is that thing that only humans had, then what is that thing monkeys have? Even if they can speak with signs.. Or if monkeys and wolf are intelligent, then why not the other animals? How do you call the decision making of the other animals? instint? no... So is impossible to draw a line to see where you call something intelligent and when not. You have genetics algoritmhs in combination with ANN and different structures that can deal with that. This is done by somebody random in internet who just wanted to experiment. This second video not sure how the code is done.. it use music rules with something more.. We may think that we are very creative, but we are not, we just add grain of sands to a big pile of patterns that we choose. You should read the full OP some time Deep Learning algorithm works different, there are many different learning techniques for ANN and ways to change its structure, or fusion hiden ANN together to reduce drag errors on binary calculations (when they dont find the global minimun of a function). Make an human kind of AI, with consciousness and emotions as "curiosity, fear, pleasure, etc" is super hard. Mainly because all those emotions are already coded by genetics and develope in a small part by experiences. But something really scary, is to make some AI without those things, and those "I guess" are the most easy to make. That is what I said it, evolution techniques makes them not static, there is also other techniques to change that. Yeah, check my links in the OP too, the one that learns to walk for muscles. I remember when engineers take like 5 years to come out with an algorithm to walk or get balance.

I search about this and I dint find nothing, if you have a link that show how these connections can form and appear in base to a need that was not planned by genetics, they I will be agree with you. What is the process that might allow such long connection? To that we need to assume that the connection it self is intelligent. Yeah, it depends on the number of quantum algorithms you develope as remplacement of the most usefull binary algorithtms. We code a few.. like search algorithms, factoring, etc. For example quantum algorithms are very good for simulations, as chemical simulations or many other fields. There are also perfect for ANN, which is the most important here. Also an structure base on Quantum mechanics to define the ANN structure, it would not need new algorithms (because it does not compute), and it would be much faster and easy to make than any ANN running in a Quantum computer. Yeah, that is one of the big risks, but it does not change the future being that way or not. ANN can increase by a lot the progress, so eventually a true consciousness will be created (there is not escape of that destiny), you might think that it would be easy to control it if happen this way, but not. That is why I think that some of the AI specialist interviewed are shown as calm and not alarming of the AI and singularity implications. Because they know these facts: 1-There is no need to scare people, because even if they don’t work in this field, someone else will, trying to stop this will be like trying to stop human progress, is impossible. 2-They don’t want to work with plenty of people holding signs outside their offices, or in the worst case scenario this situation; who knows how many Sarah Connor are out there. 3-They are getting old, if there is chance to defeat death, they will take it, the risk does not matter, because it will happen anyway, even with global awareness and all safe measures taken, a hard IA development cannot be delayed more than 3 years at that point. The people who thinks they can experiment with a hard IA structure (super intelligence in development) and keep it under control are delusional, is an insult to our own intelligence. You have a very big problem with that, when you cross the line? How do you call the lower levels? Maybe a dog fulfill or those requirements but it only makes very primitive predictions that are impossible to detect. You need to take intelligence as a Unit of measument.. The same than "heat". The cold word doesn´t have any meaning in physsics, only heat.. This heat may be 4 kelvins or 1 millions kelvins. Our intelligence is not different, is such grow in complexity, the amount of variables, sense inputs, knowledge that use to produce an outcome or many outcomes. Is very hard to cross a line here. Yeah I am agree that we still dont have a definition for consciousness, so it would be very hard to detect it if we achieve it some day. yeah that is true. There are good to relate information, the same as our own neurons. About decision making is the same, a search image ANN does decision making to produce an outcome, it calculate the answer with more chances to be right. That can be apply it to anything, some examples may just increase the complexity of the ANN. If you are talking about conscious decision, then is a different case. By its already prove it, that most (for not said all) of our decisions are done it by the unconscious, then our consciousness creates the illusion of our choice. Here Sam Harris explain Agree, but once you know how it works (or it can happen before), then you can not said it will be a limit than electronics or quamtum computers can not overcome in its own way. And you dont need to simulate the brain to do that, we have a lot of clues of how the brain works which mechanism can be translated to electronics and test them. Now that physicists are join to the brain problem, they will find a way to break down all mechanism to few simple laws. I dint take a deep look to the code, but there are lots of new techniques to improve the efficiency of ANN, but I glad that you experiment with that.But your conclusion is wrong, a human needs more than those iterations to learn the difference.. you are measuring wrong. First I really doubt that a child can see the differences between the letters with a first iteration, first there is not just thing as first iteration, your brain already has a visual pattern structure of edges and other concepts to help you to categorize that. Second your visual does not last 1 milisecond, so you are compariing all letters between them in a continuous mode. Also we also need to learn a concept many times before we develope a strong synapse. I answer this to KSK above. Not sure if we are talking of the same things, I thought that you was refering to old AI software structure. Like: if someone ask for X, answer Y. Its impossible to achieve complex intelligence with that, because all the rules you need to do increase exponentially. This is similar to all the earlier works in image recognition, where they had hundred of engineers making new rules to accomplish almost nothing. If you want to show the results in a normal computer you will need normal algorithms to that. But not sure what is your point with this?If you have a robot with many sensors that only needs to take actions in base the enviroment with a self learning mechanism, then you can achieve all that with just ANN, of course some of the algoritms to simulate a ANN are normals if they run in a normal computer. That can change if they run in a full ANN quantum structure. not way to guarantee that... maybe our consciousness is very limited by factors than an artificial consciousness will not. Someone will do it just because we can do it. As experience, for need, or for many other purposes. Not sure if the soul will be compatible with that hardware

It works like alternative, this approach is still behind the normal Tokamak that will be used in ITER. How much energy input and how much output they can have if they rise the temperature? That technique may be very energy intensive.

Until NASA does not change its policy, directors, planing, objectives... it would be like drop a 3/4 of the money to the trash.. Of course there are always worst places where that money can go to... so yeah.. goo NASA!!

Find a source where it said that the human progress was bigger before than now. Yeah you had Jets.. so? how many things new we have all months these recent years? What about genetics, computers for everyone, increase in communications and bandwidth, nanotechnology (with lots of fields), etc. Jet is only one, if you start to count one by one, even if some are not as significative as jet, you still will have 10 to 1. Source? From my understanding of evolution and many sources that I read, the human brain slightly change in the last 50000 years. You maybe are confuse due that today childrens seems more intelligent, but that is an illusion. Now childs receive more estimulation and info at all times, that helps them to learn faster. New technology sometimes is harder for adults, but childrens get used super fast, that is because childrens born with much more neurons and connections than an adult, so their brains are in full learning process. We by other hand, we need to "delete" the things we know and learn the new ways. Take a look to all those Feral childs, they dont seem more intelligent than a dog. I appreciate, I corrected the AI issue, but about the correct abbreviations for ANN, I personally always hate abbreviations because it makes english a lot harder for me, and my post is so long, that people would need to find for its source definition in the whole post. You watched the Michio Kaku video explanation in the link? He makes a good job, it has a lot more sense than those IQ test that only depends on practice. Intelligence is almost everything input that is processes to produce an outcome. Lets say you have a primitive fish eye, it can only detect the absence of light (a shadow for example), so it triggers a signal which will activate a muscle to dodge a possible attack or to find warm waters.. That is intelligence.. but you have a lot of different levels of intelligence, those that takes desicions in base of its position and its pray, or high level of intelligence if you make predictions about your future, or you calculate many different possibilities o solutions to the same problem. To define conscience may be harder, for example "the knowledge that an individual has of his own existence, their statements and their actions" I know, but we dont understand yet the role of different brainwaves alpha, beta, delta, theta has over the neural network. Some can be only related to control chemical processes inherent to the neuron which may or not be necesary for ANN. There are already ANN that can be run it in reverse mode. One thing is simulate, and the other find a way to do the same.. Electronics does not need to be equal to chemical neurons, so when you "simulate" you are forcing electronics to behave in a way that is not the best for it.You can train very massive ANN with an incredible amount of data compared to the brain in a short time. Even today, computers learns to recognize all life objects faster than kids, without human intervention. In my previous post I also explain that neurons can not make long connections to any other neuron in the brain, thats way some intermediate neurons may not be adding nothing in the brain. But an ANN can interconnect any virtual neurons with any other. I will check it. But remember that all AI experts and people working in the field said an average of 25 years from now. I was checking today the news about quantum computers, and China, Microsoft, Google, all are playing hard to accomplish that. Just a 45 qubit quantum computer will have the power of the faster computer of the planet now. 100 qubit computer would be more than trillions times faster. Of course more qubits you add more extra qubits you need to add to deal with errors. But is incredible how much potential it is. Microsoft is already designing new encryption techniques, to avoid future hack damages with quantum computers. But AI base on old binary software never will achieve true AI. But ANN as we see, makes huge changes in that aspect.It changes everything. That is something than ANN can do. Here you need a very big ANN, that includes words, images and sounds. And yes, is already solve it by ANN, see the OP post the "spoiler" sections, as examples of ANN. You will be surpriced. Those things comes from special servers data they have, but I know all google efforts to improve its robot engines and search results. I am a web programmer with deep knowledge on SEO. They just need to crack consciousness, it may be a very simple algorithm or a complex. But once they do it, they already had the compute power to create a Hard AI.

Easy, you turn around first, and then you slow down. The Venture Star is not a cable, but its similar. If we see the middle truss between the two radiators, that is the Sail support, in the other end of the ship we have the shield, which is used to shield the ship from the laser beam, and once the acceleration is over, it turns all the ship, so it can be used as particle shielding. To slow down in the arrival it use the antimatter engines. The process is repeat it from pandora to earth, with the difference than the acceleration is done by antimatter, and the desaceleration by beamed sail.

Source? Not sure what are you saying about different attachment points, it looks that all are attached to the same common place. https://youtu.be/bwdNQoAKBs4?t=1m52s About wind after it lands.. it may be... I will call this "weird", due that it cut parachutes automatically once it lands, the center of gravity is very low too, so it should drag instead turn around.

But thats only change a little bit the fall speed, not the angle.. So instead to do a 3 main parachutes descent, it do it with 2. But all parachutes are attached to the same place.

So, after billions and billions of dollars and a decade of development using the same old technology from always, and they cannot land straight? I still want to hear those who think that this money is well spent...

Yeah that is right. only some softwares are good for neural networks, but if we need to "compute" something, we need the normal archictecture..

What are you talking about is the discovery of the two main theories of the last century, as Relativity and Quantum Mechanics, but that is not equal to progress. Theories: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_fundamental_physics_discoveries Progress: http://jgiudice.tripod.com/history/history-timeline.htm You can see how progress in the last half of this century is much bigger than 1900 to 1960. Just mentioning Internet, change everything. I am having a kind of deja vu with this, I guess we already had a similar discussion in the past You dont need fundamental discoveries each year, we still harvesting the benefics of relativity and quantum mechanics, and we are not even close to use the full of these two theories yet. I dont understand, you said that we would need experiments and experience to create an IA? or the AI will need experiments and experience to progress?

You think I dont know all that? But at the end of the day.. if you need to compare.. a titan mission to the atmosphere and methane lakes sounds better. With higher chances to find something important. Or a floating ballon with dynamic bouyancy in jupiter, measuring all gases, magnetic fields, lower layers, with great pictures of its atmosphere.. Which worth and inspire much more than a high resolution uranus picture. And the mission will happen earlier because is much closer. If you call something as 0.00001 bar an atmosphere, then we can call "planets" to a lot of asteroids, but not by that they will be equally interesting than an actual atmosphere/planet. Pluto had his month of attention, but a big majority of the world population never heard of the mission or they dint care. About inspiring younger minds.. that is a job for a manned mission, there is nothing compare to that. But you all are always dodging the main point.. as I said.. yeah, a uranus and neptune mission are important and I will love to see it.. But if we need to choose, one or the other.. what you will choose? What mission has the most value in science, public media, can be completed in a average short term and with more chances to realize a big discovery? Technology always increase, we would develope new techniques to achieve high deltaV, so we should left long distance missions to later.

if you see my post in the page 3, that is why I put europa submarine last, and venus/mars manned mission first.

one mission of course.. the budget is not unlimited. You get only huge budgets if you give the people what most want. (manned mission) Or the true possibility to find life "europe submarine" or maybe with lower chance by also much lower budget Titan atmosphere and lakes. I am not saying that having quality pictures of uranus and neptune is not a great thing, I would love it.. but if I need to choose.. I choose the other possibilities. Enoght to orbit planets and take pictures.. lets go in there.

that is why Neural Networks are the future..

But if you need to choose one (because it always comes down to that), what you will choose?

What I wanted to say was that these planets receive less energy from the sun, less energy means less planet activity, so it reduce the chances to find something important.

Neural networks as the ones that we actually use are the first step, but you can not stop progress, someone always will try to find a way to achieve conscience. When that happens, an AI will make its own goals. You may said.. is silly, why someone would want to do that? The answer is simple.. just because we can. But if that answer is not enoght.. neural networks will have still a limit, which is what products we want and what is the best to us. If we use our simple brain to try to answer those questions, we cant.. we dont really know what is the best for us, so we can create a super intelligence to tell us that.. of course it may be a very bad idea.. 40000 years ago, it would be easy to predict the progress changes after 5000 years, the same than a lapse of time of 500 years 5000 years ago, but in 1900 that frame is reduce to 50 years, then in 1950 was close to 25 years, now we reach a point when we can not predict more than 10 years, Closer we are from the singularity, the harder it is to make accurate predictions. So that is when a Hard AI is created, our chance to make accurate predictions will be reduce to 1 year or months... and days with the time. The only thing that would have logic to invest, are the things that will increase the power of the AI, because if this AI can discover how to use antimatter in a very simple way (just 5 years after it begans), then your investments are a waste of time and resources. All investments are based on risk.. if the risk of failure is high then nobody will risk to put a lot of effort and resources in that. (your product will not see the light because it will be outdated by other products, or it will not be needed due other discoveries of how to dodge that particular problem in other way) As I explain in the OP, we invent the wheel which does not have nothing to do with the animal world. Is a very simple idea that works better (in the average cases) than legs or other complex movement mechanism. The body and the brain are not designed from zero, they follow an evolution path. So at begining it may be a good idea to have some sensors connected directly to the muscles, and then evolution found it may be a good idea put some neurons between to interpret better those signals and take an action suited to the problem. But if there is a better way to do it, you can not erase all your progress and start again, you need to work with the things you have. That is evolution. Now think in the nerons connection to other neurons, mostly all connections will be between close neurons, a neuron will not create a new connection to a very distant neuron, that is something that electronics can do without problem. So all the neurons in the path to another key neuron will not add any processing utility. Long connections can be only produce by genetic information. So due that, many of our neurons and connections may be not adding much to our process power.

Miranda? Ariel? My name is Ariel, but not sure if I want a mission to uranus or neptune.. They take long time to arrive, they need some extra deltav, the energy that reach those planets is very low which reduce its activity, by activity I mean things that might caught our attention. They always try to do all at once and they end doing nothing. They should focus in the key missions for our solar system. We need a manned mission (venus or mars) to inspire the world. They need to explore Titan's atmosphere and its methane lakes (which are easy to reach), maybe a dynamic buoyancy ballon for saturn or jupiter atmospheres too. After that a harder mission will be an ice melting prove to deploy a submarine in Europa and Enceladus. If those missions are planned with efficiency in mind under a limit of developing time, without wait until have 99% certainty looking more for redundancy and using edge technology. Then we can accomplish huge science goals at minimun time/cost.

Nice to see this so expected mod in alpha. I dont have time lately to give it a try, maybe next month. Congrats.