| Stock MOTORBIKE Challenge | with pictures and explanations

[Guest]

On Two-Wheels

The Challenge

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So how about building a motorcycle within stock KSP limitation?

This means using landing gears, rover wheels, combining both.. or any other solution using stock parts!

Submit your craft here, so we can look at it then try to improve it.

Feel free to ask any question If what you read is unclear or cant find a specific info.

I'm really curious to see other methods than mine to achieve a vehicle that behaves like a real motorcycle.

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RULINGS: What is required to be considered a proper motorcycle?;

|1) An adapted engine with fuel.

> The bike has to accelerate quickly, just like the real thing, or might not be accepted

> Using offset tool on fuel tanks to lower the mass is a good idea.

> Wings helping stabilize and control the bike are accepted, infinigliders are not.

|2) Active Controls, (SAS wheels or/and RCS thruster)

> Your bike simply need a way to be operated, and be brought back to perpendicular level if it falls on its side

> No Spamming Needed! Too many reaction wheels will just fade away the chassis characteristics, the less the better

|3) Direction System, that is what's in charge of the changing the turn rate relative to lean angle,

> When you press "lean" (rolling Q/E) the tire surface should create a force that turns the chassis towards the same direction so that a centrifuge force is created by this turn rate and put the bike back to its level position, auto-balancing.

> See composite tires section if you don't know how to do that

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Save yourself some reading by downloading my

KerbAprilia PACK. This will give you 8 nice practical examples of a correct bike handling.

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http://youtu.be/jXY6L9GW4LU

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Technical Explanations Section

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COMPOSITE TIRES

A composite tire is what makes lean angle proportionally affect turn rate.

It is made of clipped wheels merging their tire, and their friction forces to create the desired behavior.

Building a successful set of 2 composite tire is no easy task, and require a lot of experimentation.

It is your choice to use several similar wheels OR mixing up different types.

The goal is to turn accordingly to your lean so that the bike balance itself

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FRAME

The Frame is what connects the front and back wheels together and provides good rigidity and protection to your design.

Be wary of the crash tolerance of every part you use and their placement, some like the small hardpoint are perfect for highly stressful tasks, like connecting the fork to the core

Strut Connector: should be used as reinforcement between crucial parts to ensure optimal mass transfer

Communotron 16: are the less impacting, but massless counterpart of Strut Connectors.

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SUSPENSIONS

KSP Wheels all have built-in suspension, whose purpose is to both absorb shocks (preload) and guarantee a constant contact between the wheel and the ground (dumping).

That's why it is important to consider their impact on a bike as a whole, because it will affect high leaning angle stability, breaking performance, quick direction changes and so on..

You should consider either maximizing built-in suspensions abilities either building your own suspension system that shall complement built-in ones.

Swing Arm: Use LV1R engine as a pivot point, due to their compressibility, and build a rotating arm for your wheels..

Fork: Use rounded compressible parts like the TR2V decoupler for absorbing heavy bumps within the frame..

Landing Gear: They provide a pressure point (a force) on strategic places, like between two modules of your craft, that will increase if pressed further, assuring maximum stability to your wheelsé..

There's all sort of systems possible. You are to make one that suits your own idea of how the physic engine behaves.

Experimental solutions are way cooler (if they work).

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| RANKING CRITERIAS | (WIP)

A) Optimal Speed (speed at which you can lean the most while being carried by centrifugal force)

Turn Rate at optimal speed & maximum lean angle (how effective is your turning ability?)

C) Amount of Active Controls needed to reach stability at optimal speed & maximum lean angle (the less the better)

D) Tank's Range How much deltaV does your bike contain? (the more the better)

E) Originality / Creativity

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Contenders Bike

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Helpful Mods (for building and testing):

HullCamVDS: http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/46365-0-90-Hullcam-VDS-0-90-update-Updated-16-Dec

ImprovedChaseCam: http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/80112-0-24-x-Improved-Chase-Camera-v1-4-0-%287-23%29

EditorExtension: http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/38768-0-90-Editor-Extensions-v2-5-27-Dec

Edited February 22, 2015 by RevanCorana

[Majorjim!]

So whats the challenge here? Also a vehicle with four wheels is a quad.

So far this seems like you are just trying to get 'airtime' for your quad bike.

[PSOliver]

It really only has 2 wheels on the ground at that moment though.

[Majorjim!]

It really only has 2 wheels on the ground at that moment though.

I disagree, but thinking about it now, Ive made many craft that emulate some real life thing but do it using different methods, so I take back my comment.

Have at it chaps, in fact I will work on an entry later.

MJ

[Guest]

So whats the challenge here? Also a vehicle with four wheels is a quad.

So far this seems like you are just trying to get 'airtime' for your quad bike.

It really only has 2 wheels on the ground at that moment though.

I disagree, but thinking about it now, Ive made many craft that emulate some real life thing but do it using different methods, so I take back my comment.

Have at it chaps, in fact I will work on an entry later.

So far this seems like you are just trying to get 'airtime' for your quad bike.

Well first thanks to urban dictionary I can sort of get the specific terms you like using xD

The challenge is, as I said, to build the best motorcycle you can then share it here.

Handling, top speed, range, all these matter. I'll try to figure out a more precise (point based) way to rank the submitted bikes, once I'd have received more than 2 in the first place (0 at the moment ).

Now, KSP has its limitations, and I'm quite content by my method but If you have another that's great! I don't think it has to come down to a puristic debate of bike physic, because in this case you'd need a gyroscopic effect on the wheels gaining speed!

It is different from a quad, or car, because it doesn't have a wide space between wheels, actually, they're clipped together, at a specific angle merging their physic behaviour (see composite tire section for more info on this)

Furthermore, good luck making a bike in KSP that turns when you lean it, with only 2 flat tire from the landing gear or asymetric ones, like the RoveMax M1 (the latter is possible but its asymmetry will affect overall handling)

I'm very interested in seeing the way you guys figure out how to bypass stock limitations to get this typical bike behaviour and all variations within it.

Thanks MJ for upping the thread, hope to see yours very soon too!

By the way I listened to your suggestion of loosening the suspension and made a new bike:

http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/111203-KerbAprilia-VII-Grasshopper-Suspensions-Now-with-a-seat-for-Jeb%21%21

Edited February 21, 2015 by RevanCorana

[Foxster]

I had to have a go at this being a biker myself....

I'm not sure if my entry meets all the requirements but it is quick (its at about 50% throttle in the vid) and stable on two(!) wheels...

The out-riders are just there in case the rider over-cooks it on a corner. It will then lay down safely and can be brought upright again.

Needs SAS on of course and the angled ion engine keeps it pushed down and more stable.

Craft file: https://www.dropbox.com/s/cdxo9mleg0mpkar/Bike%201.craft?dl=0

And here's Jeb giving it some large on the Mun! (Until he got too cocky)...

Edited February 21, 2015 by Foxster

[Foxster]

...and here's my Karley Davidson...

Craft file: https://www.dropbox.com/s/plth8k0kgbhyern/Bike%203.craft?dl=0

Its a proper two-wheel motorbike. Its quick and stable with SAS on. Powered by an ion engine.

[panzer1b]

Maybee once i fix it up a little (its extremnely prone to exploding randomly atm), ill show my motorbike styled armored car, modeled after the GAZ-49P "Dubna" scout car. Its basically a 2 wheeler, with one of the wheels made of 2 normal ones clipped together, and the front is just a single wheel, all of them powered wheels.

[Guest]

I had to have a go at this being a biker myself....

http://i395.photobucket.com/albums/pp38/FoxMouldy/Suffolk/IMG_0663_zps5d818974.jpg

I'm not sure if my entry meets all the requirements but it is quick (its at about 50% throttle in the vid) and stable on two(!) wheels...

http://youtu.be/vXbNAD2b79w

The out-riders are just there in case the rider over-cooks it on a corner. It will then lay down safely and can be brought upright again.

Needs SAS on of course and the angled ion engine keeps it pushed down and more stable.

Craft file: https://www.dropbox.com/s/cdxo9mleg0mpkar/Bike%201.craft?dl=0

And here's Jeb giving it some large on the Mun! (Until he got too cocky)...

http://youtu.be/0VjSivai2pg

Nice Twin!

I have a DRZ400SM and an Aprilia RS125 so I can sort of grasp how both a sport and a cross bike handles..

Your craft 1 and 2 are interesting but they dont turn the right direction when you lean it (example: you lean right it goes left which further lean angle which further incorrect turn rate, etc > unstable)

I mean it doesn't balance itself after each turn (centrifuge force deviates its current direction instead of putting it back level), actually it is due to the landing gear flat tire shape.

This was requirement 3 of the challenge ruling (direction system).

...and here's my Karley Davidson...

http://i.imgur.com/PaGmUOK.jpg

http://youtu.be/pHlQ0jxMhDw

Craft file: https://www.dropbox.com/s/plth8k0kgbhyern/Bike%203.craft?dl=0

Its a proper two-wheel motorbike. Its quick and stable with SAS on. Powered by an ion engine.

I like the look of this KarleyDavidson.

The wheels are ligned up well and seem to turn the right way when you lean it (I say seem because it is very slight turn rate and doesn't significantly increase with angle of lean).

The Ion engine is a bit of a turn-off for a vehicle that is meant to be fast accelerating though and take some of the fun factor aways, I'd prefer to see Ion engines as auxiliary engine for long missions, in which a docking port for refueling is also an option.

I'll tell you how many challenge points you had for this one pretty soon (editing OP).

Thanks for your entry!

- - - Updated - - -

Maybee once i fix it up a little (its extremnely prone to exploding randomly atm), ill show my motorbike styled armored car, modeled after the GAZ-49P "Dubna" scout car. Its basically a 2 wheeler, with one of the wheels made of 2 normal ones clipped together, and the front is just a single wheel, all of them powered wheels.

Explosions? Who said explosions? I like explosions!

Sounds interesting

I don't quite understand though, is it a bike with composite tires? Or something else?

As long as it turns accordingly to the leaning direction (lean left, turns left) I'll add it to the OP contender album.

Edited February 22, 2015 by RevanCorana

[KandoKris]

I think I might have a couple bikes that together should tick most the boxes

The one on the left is moto 1, its the only one with 2 wheels while the other (fatboy)has 4 but there close enough to look like 2

Both are rocket bikes but speed is of course limited by the tyres.

Moto 1

FatBoy

Edited February 28, 2015 by KandoKris

[Mareczex333]

Well...

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[Foxster]

Sorry to be pedantic and all but...

Motorcycle

/ˈməʊtəˌsaɪkəl/

noun

1. Also called motorbike. A two-wheeled vehicle, having a stronger frame than a bicycle...

[Jean Deaux]

I know you guys are fixed on two wheels, but I know of plenty three wheeled motorcycles. So, not really worried about an entry as much as I had fun making this thing and felt like sharing.

[Guest]

Thanks for your entries all!

Be careful not to miss the point which is to create a design that behaves like a motorcycle.

→ That turns when you lean it, and comes back to level.

I tried to draw something to explain this easier but it's not exactly clear...

Also, I need your craft files in order to test and rank them.

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For the last submissions:

@KandoKris Here are some very fine and interesting looking bikes buddy. Bravo!

That Jebby wheely... he's a hooligan no way!

@Mareczex Very cool fairing indeed, Where is his helmet though? Safety first!

@Jean Deaux Creative tricycle, nicely done, unfortunately this doesn't lean at all, nor steer when you lean. Therefore this is not part of the challenge.

I made a new KerbAprilia, better than all before, good example of composite tires, suspension and frame.

Check it out: KerbAprilia 8