The Martian by Andy Weir

[sp1989]

It is not so much what is good for the children in the case of "language" being used - let's face it, they know of and use far worse, especially when their parents are not around -, but that they were able to see the movie because of the rating is what counts for me. If they have to lower the frequency of cursing, so be it.

But yeah, his inappropriate messages to NASA and the tantrums of Ms Potty-Mouth from PR ... ah well, I will always have the book.

(Did I mention that I love R. C. Bray as a narrator of audiobooks? )

Precisely! Kids know and say worse but the MPAA is an ancient organization with leadership just as old, naive, and prude. They say that a pg-13 can only have 2 f-bombs. No frontal nudity but butts are ok. The book realistically is a pg-13 book even with all of the cursing. In this day an age I think the distinction should be drawn at nudity. Even though realistically as well kids see much worse too on the internet. However if we are going to have ratings swearing is the least of the MPAA concern. Over sexualization that is a problem also extreme violence. I'm not talking about like die hard violence. I'm talking the likes of the SAW series. I think long story short realistically there are things kids see and hear everyday. Swearing, the oversexualization of everything from Halloween costumes to bubble gum and fighting and violence in video games and on tv. The Martian should have been closer to book swear wise and still been considered pg-13

[Red Iron Crown]

Discussion of the ratings system is a bit off topic, please let it drop.

[sp1989]

It's funny we are talking about this now lol this is from Andy Weirs Facebook. "We're working on a "school-friendly edition" of The Martian for release some time in 2016. Basically, it's just a version of the book with the profanities removed or replaced with softer words so schools can put it in their curricula without people objecting. (Don't worry, the normal version of the book won't be affected. This is just a special version for schools.)

So the publisher sent me a printout of the book with every swear word or potential phrase schools might not like highlighted in yellow. I'm making my edits in red. Sometimes I eliminate the offending word entirely, other times I use a replacement word that's PG-13. But sometimes, I stand my ground!"

I was gonna post the picture but it is a picture of a phase from the book and there are quite a few f-words. It's the "hey look boobies" part and its highlighted as a profanity. Andy Weir commented next to it "this stays in at all costs"

[TheSaint]

It's funny we are talking about this now lol this is from Andy Weirs Facebook. "We're working on a "school-friendly edition" of The Martian for release some time in 2016. Basically, it's just a version of the book with the profanities removed or replaced with softer words so schools can put it in their curricula without people objecting. (Don't worry, the normal version of the book won't be affected. This is just a special version for schools.)

So the publisher sent me a printout of the book with every swear word or potential phrase schools might not like highlighted in yellow. I'm making my edits in red. Sometimes I eliminate the offending word entirely, other times I use a replacement word that's PG-13. But sometimes, I stand my ground!"

I was gonna post the picture but it is a picture of a phase from the book and there are quite a few f-words. It's the "hey look boobies" part and its highlighted as a profanity. Andy Weir commented next to it "this stays in at all costs"

It was one of the funniest parts of the book, I was laughing for quite a while. They highlighted "boobs", he said that the joke stays at all costs. I'm sure they will work out a compromise.

That said, I would love to see a kid-friendly edition of The Martian, my eight-year-old would love it.

[Dispatcher]

I disagree. There was a very noticeable lack of f-bombs, compared to todays movie industry and, especially, compared to the book. One extreme example would be Annie Montrose, but overall I feel the language was held back too much in order to keep the low age rating.

Clearly the movie isn't a carbon copy of the book; otherwise we'd have [spoiler alert for the book ... a particular crater and a dust storm; as well as an event with the rover in which it doesn't follow its normal mode of travel ...] a longer movie. However, I think you are right about actually watering down the language to grab the PG-13 rating. I don't think Weir is stupid; more ticket sales means more money in his pocket.

[sp1989]

Clearly the movie isn't a carbon copy of the book; otherwise we'd have [spoiler alert for the book ... a particular crater and a dust storm; as well as an event with the rover in which it doesn't follow its normal mode of travel ...] a longer movie. However, I think you are right about actually watering down the language to grab the PG-13 rating. I don't think Weir is stupid; more ticket sales means more money in his pocket.

I think if Andy Weir had his choice he would have left the cursing in. I think the decision was more on Ridley Scott, Drew Goddard, and the production company made the decision to water down the language. Unfortunately I don't think the movie does as well with an R rating. Again maybe people don't care about ratings anymore but PG-13 is the safe choice to appeal to a wide audience.

[vixr]

Didn't see the movie yet, the book was really good...

[KerbMav]

Didn't see the movie yet, the book was really good...

The movie takes you on a ride along many central points of the book, of course not everything is preserved and some things are a bit out of context, but it is a very enjoyable movie with great pictures and complements the book well.

[Guest]

It's funny we are talking about this now lol this is from Andy Weirs Facebook. "We're working on a "school-friendly edition" of The Martian for release some time in 2016. Basically, it's just a version of the book with the profanities removed or replaced with softer words so schools can put it in their curricula without people objecting. (Don't worry, the normal version of the book won't be affected. This is just a special version for schools.)

So the publisher sent me a printout of the book with every swear word or potential phrase schools might not like highlighted in yellow. I'm making my edits in red. Sometimes I eliminate the offending word entirely, other times I use a replacement word that's PG-13. But sometimes, I stand my ground!"

I was gonna post the picture but it is a picture of a phase from the book and there are quite a few f-words. It's the "hey look boobies" part and its highlighted as a profanity. Andy Weir commented next to it "this stays in at all costs"

I love that part!

[KerbMav]

I love that part!

A typical Watney, probably was thinking:

"Oh really, I have to watch my language? Or else? You gonna confine me to my room??"

[trewq12]

hi guys What's this is the martian movie? I'm sorry, I'm just need info for this movie

[trewq12]

Good movie. hehe

[kirill31]

The Martian

Edited December 18, 2015 by kirill31

[KerbMav]

Just 13mins of Martian science stuff with a wink and a grin.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9s9UXXAmlTg

[Temstar]

For those of you who read the book, can you explain a bit about the MAV to me?

In the movie, the MAV is depicted as a six man capsule on top of a two stage rocket. When the upper stage burns out the capsule separates from it.

But what's the idea here? Is the MAV capsule also the capsule the crew will use to return to earth once Hermes is back in earth orbit? Seems like a waste if that's the case, having to haul MAV capsule with its earth reentry rated heat shield all the way to mars, land it on mars, then haul it all the way up to martian orbit then haul it all the way back to earth for splashdown. Wouldn't it be much easier to ditch the MAV in martian orbit and do the Hermes crew exchange with a spacecraft launched from earth when Hermes returns?

[KerbMav]

5 hours ago, Temstar said:

For those of you who read the book, can you explain a bit about the MAV to me?

The MAV was not hauled to Mars by Hermes, it was sent there on its own way before the crew set out. It lands on Mars and generates its own fuel from the Martian atmosphere, only bringing enough hydrogen to do so. (Should the MAV fail, the mission would be scrapped/delayed, as Hermes does not carry a Mars-orbit-surface transfer vehicle.)

The only complete MAV launch we do see is Mark's at the end, when the MAV has been stripped down to its bare necessities, even ditching the OMS (Orbital Maneuvering System). Whether the OMS was part of the capsule (possible, as the thrusters Martinez used to keep the MAV upright during the initial storm seemed to fire from the capsule itself) I do not know, but it seems that way by how it seperates in orbit.

We also have no information on the means of the crew to return to Earth's surface. As Hermes will enter an orbit, it might be possible that a seperate vehicle is launched - although that would need a dedicated launcher, a waste in and of itself if you ask me. Maybe they use the same vehicle that brought them up at the beginning of their mission, maybe NASA has a new space station with an orbital shuttle to pick them up and return them with a resupply vehicle - the book says nothing about this. (iirc, bits)

The stories Ares mission follows basically the same profile as https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mars_Direct#Mission_scenario with some differences regarding the introduction of the Hermes.
And I found this here https://www.docdroid.net/Zxk9zKw/the-martian-ares-3-mission-guide.pdf.html

Edited January 6, 2016 by KerbMav

[Temstar]

I know of course MAV did not come with Hermes - given that MAV for Ares IV was already on planet when Hermes was still busy with the Ares III mission. However if the crewed part of the MAV only needs to dock with Hermes and then discarded in Martian orbit then the separation between the capsule and its upper stage seems a bit pointless - that would be like having a separation event between the Apollo LM and its ascent engine before docking with the CSM.

I figure if I was to design the mission then when Hermes return to earth after mission complete then there will be an exchange of crew with something like an Orion (or a smaller manned spacecraft, if Hermes actually returns to LEO) where the Ares III crew will hand the ship over to the Ares IV crew for refurbishment before their mission, and the Ares III crew will then ride the capsule back to earth.

Actually I just remembered something - at the very end of the movie it showed the Ares III crew looking at live TV coverage of a launch for Ares IV and it showed an Delta-IV Heavy launch, so the crew exchange could very well be done with something like an Orion. Seen as the Ares III crew is already on the ground, if the Delta-IV Heavy was carrying a manned spacecraft that would probably be an exchange of crew between Ares IV crew and caretaker crew that mans Hermes between Mars trips.

Don't get me started on MAV's OMS, if it's powerful enough to resist a storm that could topple the ship then surely it would be powerful enough to make up that 20m/s.

Anyway one thing I thought was really cool was that throw away line by the deputy head of CNSA who said something like  "I've had our engineer run the numbers and our Taiyangshen boosters is powerful enough to boost their payload to Mars". I thought that was actually a very important thing that's probably not apparent to someone who's not familiar with orbital mechanics or play KSP - although Hermes and Iris docked above earth, the Iris probe was actually already on a course in the general direction of Mars after it separated from it's booster (plus any delta-V added by Iris's own engines). If Hermes shutdown its engine then Iris and Hermes will actually drift side by side for a very long time to near Mars orbit. Conversely if Hermes wasn't able to dock with Iris for some reason then Iris might still be able to land on Mars to supply Mark while four of the five crew kill themselves to allow that girl to return to Earth alone on the Hermes.

IIRC, the original launch vehicle for Iris was some kind of Atlas V, one of those big ones with lots of SRB but not a three core one.

Edited January 6, 2016 by Temstar

[KerbMav]

17 minutes ago, Temstar said:

if the crewed part of the MAV only needs to dock with Hermes and then discarded in Martian orbit then the separation between the capsule and its upper stage seems a bit pointless

Ares III crew will hand the ship over to the Ares IV crew for refurbishment before their mission, and the Ares III crew will then ride the capsule ship back to earth.

at the very end of the movie it showed the Ares III crew looking at live TV coverage of a launch for Ares IV and it showed an Delta-IV Heavy launch, so the crew exchange could very well be done with something like an Orion. Seen as the Ares III crew is already on the ground, if the Delta-IV Heavy was carrying a manned spacecraft that would probably be an exchange of crew between Ares IV crew and caretaker crew that mans Hermes between Mars trips.

Don't get me started on MAV's OMS, if it's powerful enough to resist a storm that could topple the ship then surely it would be powerful enough to make up that 20m/s.

Anyway one thing I thought was really cool was that throw away line by the deputy head of CNSA who said something like  "I've had our engineer run the numbers and our Taiyangshen boosters is powerful enough to boost their payload to Mars". I thought that was actually a very important thing that's probably not apparent to someone who's not familiar with orbital mechanics or play KSP - although Hermes and Iris docked above earth, the Iris probe was actually already on a course in the general direction of Mars after it separated from it's booster (plus any delta-V added by Iris's own engines). If Hermes shutdown its engine then Iris and Hermes will actually drift side by side for a very long time to near Mars orbit.

Reduces the mass for the OMS to handle, makes the whole thing more agile during docking?

Yes, I guess the caretaker crew solution would be most likely.

Mark had to ditch the OMS to lower the weight of the MAV, so it could not help with the 20m/s. And the same as with Iris (see below) Mark would have been on a trajectory to solar orbit, right? So no quick and painless death by crashing back onto Mars, no?

The Taiyangshen was able to reach Mars and could have resupplied Mark, yes. But as Hermes fires its ion engines constantly, I am unsure that Iris would have reached Mars following the launch into a rendesvouz orbit with Hermes?

[Temstar]

3 hours ago, KerbMav said:

Reduces the mass for the OMS to handle, makes the whole thing more agile during docking?

It could be but it seems unlikely since staging is a significant source of potential failure and you would want to avoid it as much as possible. Plus as we know from KSP docking doesn't really require that much agility, as long as you can translate in three axis without rotation it shouldn't be very hard.

If I were to guess, I would say the OMS name implies that it's either designed to provide a final burst of delta-V to put the capsule into low mars orbit to join with Hermes, or maybe the OMS is reserved for emergency situations like the start of the movie were the MAV's two rocket stages might need to do a dog leg during boost to align inclination with Hermes and OMS will make up the difference to get the capsule into orbit. This would require the Ares IV MAV ascent scene to include a shot of the OMS firing after separation from the upper stage. The CG artists might have had this in mind when they designed the movie MAV but was probably cut due to time. Plus I suppose to the average movie going audience they probably won't get that excited over weather it's a two stage or three stage vehicle ;).

You're probably right that if Iris is launched to rendezvous with Hermes then it can't also coast to mars. There's a scene after CNSA decided to give NASA the rocket where Vincent Kapoor was on the phone with someone where he said something like "we can jettison any kind of landing system, we're only sending rations to mars, we can crash land on mars" just before Rich Purnell barged into his office. That might be clue that the Chinese rocket is a bit underpowered compared to Iris's normal launch vehicle.

Edited January 6, 2016 by Temstar

[KerbMav]

43 minutes ago, Temstar said:

You're probably right that if Iris is launched to rendezvous with Hermes then it can't also coast to mars. There's a scene after CNSA decided to give NASA the rocket where Vincent Kapoor was on the phone with someone where he said something like "we can jettison any kind of landing system, we're only sending rations to mars, we can crash land on mars" just before Rich Purnell barged into his office. That might be clue that the Chinese rocket is a bit underpowered compared to Iris's normal launch vehicle.

I think that had to do with the time constraints, that it was easier and faster to crash the probe than implement a landing system.
They just had to decide to either intercept Hermes or shoot for Mars.

Damn, all this nerding makes me want to watch the movie again.

[Temstar]

I quite like the design for Iris:


Looks like a cross between ESA's ATV and Japan's H-II, except with some MONSTER engines for a cargo ship:

H-II


ATV.

I wonder what power system Iris run on though, maybe RTG?

[KerbMav]

57 minutes ago, Temstar said:

I wonder what power system Iris run on though, maybe RTG?

Probably just batteries, it just had to get up to Hermes and no life support etc. was needed.

[Columbia]

I got the book, read it (sped through it in three days) and instantky loved it. I bought it while overseas, so I finished it on a plane, and watched the movie soon after (in-flight entertainment system.)

I liked the movie, but I was pretty disappointed by the lack of flaws in the journey like the book had. (Dust storm, flipping over..) but dwelling on it more, it might have lasted way too long for its own good had every detail been included. There were other minor things that the movie changed (Crew left Sol 18 instead of Sol 6, etc. etc.) but they're tiny nooks and crannies that a sane person probably shouldn't pay attention to. 

The design of the space suit.. looks funky. It is described in the book that his face isn't visible, while it is in the movie. Then again, not seeing Watney's face for a big portion of the movie wouldn't look good. But it seems far less bulky than described, too.

Seeing the rover finally made sense of things in my head. When I read the book, I didn't think of it as one with a full interior and everything, but one that looks like a modified Apollo rover. 

Hermes was also pretty big -- way larger than I expected. In my head, the Hermes looked like.. well, a bunch of solar panels, a Hitchhiker, and a Mobile Lab in KSP. Turns out it was far bigger.

Acidalia Planitia looked far different than I expected too. For a crater, I doubt it would have many mountains if at all. It's described as being really flat, so...

Movie was overall great (OST was also nice), but I think someone who hadn't read the book beforehand would've enjoyed it far more.

 

[SpaceXray]

10 hours ago, Columbia said:

I got the book, read it (sped through it in three days) and instantky loved it. I bought it while overseas, so I finished it on a plane, and watched the movie soon after (in-flight entertainment system.)

I liked the movie, but I was pretty disappointed by the lack of flaws in the journey like the book had. (Dust storm, flipping over..) but dwelling on it more, it might have lasted way too long for its own good had every detail been included. There were other minor things that the movie changed (Crew left Sol 18 instead of Sol 6, etc. etc.) but they're tiny nooks and crannies that a sane person probably shouldn't pay attention to. 

The design of the space suit.. looks funky. It is described in the book that his face isn't visible, while it is in the movie. Then again, not seeing Watney's face for a big portion of the movie wouldn't look good. But it seems far less bulky than described, too.

Seeing the rover finally made sense of things in my head. When I read the book, I didn't think of it as one with a full interior and everything, but one that looks like a modified Apollo rover. 

Hermes was also pretty big -- way larger than I expected. In my head, the Hermes looked like.. well, a bunch of solar panels, a Hitchhiker, and a Mobile Lab in KSP. Turns out it was far bigger.

Acidalia Planitia looked far different than I expected too. For a crater, I doubt it would have many mountains if at all. It's described as being really flat, so...

Movie was overall great (OST was also nice), but I think someone who hadn't read the book beforehand would've enjoyed it far more.

 

@Columbia glad you enjoyed it! The OST was ok, and the David Bowie soundtrack was very fitting too. Sad that he passed away this year ;(

[Wjolcz]

I really, really enjoyed the book. It was really fun to read even though it wasn't 100% scientific and realistic. Let's be honest, would anyone want to read a boring mission report without any drama in it? I wouldn't.

About the film: I really like Matt Damon as an actor. He performs really well. I didn't like "Prometheus". Was fun to watch but definitely didn't have the feel of the first Alien movies. Also plot holes. OST and the special effects were spot on tho. Now you may think 'But what does "Prometheus" has to do with "The Martian?"' Same director, obviously. "The Martian" as a film didn't have the same feel as the book, which is something I was expecting after I've seen what has been done to "Prometheus". It lacked the funny parts and some things were changed. I don't mind the fact that they had to remove some events from the film, but the Pathfinder could at least get fried just like in the book. Or the storm That Watney encountered on his way. By only mentioning and showing how he puts the solar panels there and going back would take like 1 or 2 extra minutes? It was a really smart move and I feel like the whole movie was kind of stripped off all of those smart moments.

The Book: 9/10

The film: OK/10