Contract Progression Question

[CloudlessEchoes]

Hello,

Do contracts in 1.0 still make it so you might miss some? For instance, I'm doing a normal career game, and I've never gotten a contract to explore the Mun. Is this because I might have done some Mun exploring before the contract came up? I think I got an orbit or flyby contract first and did that.

Right now I have a Minmus flyby contract. If I made a probe and orbited it instead, will it preclude me getting an "explore Minmus" contract? I'd like to be able to do them all!

[ghpstage]

The old Explore Mun contract seems to no longer exist, having been replaced by partial contracts of flyby, orbit, return from flyby and landing. I suspect the same is true of Minmus, but I have seen the old Explore Duna contract so perhaps it only applies in the Kerbin SOI.

There are a lot more of this type of contract now, and while you can't really miss most of the old altitude record type ones (the 2500m/s record is an exception that keeps vanishing without completion for me) theres a lot more to miss and the mission control seems very unpredictable in which contracts it hands out when.

Edited May 4, 2015 by ghpstage

[Anquietas314]

The old Explore Mun contract seems to no longer exist

On my save I get both sets of contracts, although the partial ones are by far the most lucrative, even for Mun and Minmus.

[ghpstage]

On my save I get both sets of contracts, although the partial ones are by far the most lucrative, even for Mun and Minmus.

Interesting. Any idea how to get the old ones to appear? I've yet to see any but it may be because i've moved forward as quickly as I could.

[Anquietas314]

Interesting. Any idea how to get the old ones to appear? I've yet to see any but it may be because i've moved forward as quickly as I could.

As far as I can tell you just need to do the world first contracts in the right order without accidentally sending things into Mun or Minmus's SOI too early and similar. I don't know the specifics though.

[Arsonide]

The Explore contracts are still present, but there are more contracts for the pool to choose from now, with world firsts, tourism, and grand tours. That means they have a slightly lower chance to appear now. It has always been random. The Explore contracts can also skip planets.

The partial World First contracts pay the same amounts (they have 25% of the objectives, and 25% of the rewards). They never skip planets. They can also theoretically be chained by one vessel more than four times, so indeed they are more lucrative. There are also hundreds of them, they require less time invested, and they are easily layered on other missions, so missing them is less of a problem.

[RebelCid]

There are a lot more of this type of contract now, and while you can't really miss most of the old altitude record type ones (the 2500m/s record is an exception that keeps vanishing without completion for me) theres a lot more to miss and the mission control seems very unpredictable in which contracts it hands out when.

I thought that reputation plays a large role in the assigning of contracts? Example: Higher rep = higher variety and harder and more lucrative contracts and lower rep = easier and less lucrative contracts?

[Anquietas314]

The partial World First contracts pay the same amounts (they have 25% of the objectives, and 25% of the rewards).

In that case, I think there's something you should have a look at...

This was just the easiest way to get them on the same screenshot. They show the same values in the stock contracts screen

When I said they were more lucrative I meant in terms of just raw rewards, not chaining etc. I saw similar results with the Mun and Minmus contracts. This is on the "moderate" settings for career mode.

Edited May 4, 2015 by armagheddonsgw

[MrCynical]

The "explore minmus" contract seems to be missing. The flyby, orbit etc contracts show up, but the old style explore contract never shows up in my game. The old explore contracts show up for all other celestial bodies, but it jumps straight from the explore mun contract to the explore Duna and Ike ones.

[Arsonide]

In that case, I think there's something you should have a look at...

http://i.imgur.com/Kemtcbn.png

This was just the easiest way to get them on the same screenshot. They show the same values in the stock contracts screen

When I said they were more lucrative I meant in terms of just raw rewards, not chaining etc. I saw similar results with the Mun and Minmus contracts. This is on the "moderate" settings for career mode.

On average, they are 25% of the Explores, it varies with objective.

The "explore minmus" contract seems to be missing. The flyby, orbit etc contracts show up, but the old style explore contract never shows up in my game. The old explore contracts show up for all other celestial bodies, but it jumps straight from the explore mun contract to the explore Duna and Ike ones.

It is there, it's just random. There's no guarantee that it will appear.

[Anquietas314]

On average, they are 25% of the Explores, it varies with objective.

Err, no... they're all pretty much about the same payout ratios as those in the screenshot in my experience. Certainly for Mun/Minmus, and Pol seems to fit the same pattern (flag POLe bug )

[MrCynical]

It is there, it's just random. There's no guarantee that it will appear.

Not convinced by that explanation. In every career game I've played in this and previous versions the explore contracts have appeared for every single body in a relatively logical progression, and once they're on the list they never expire. Minmus in 1.0 is the first one that's just not shown up, even with me sitting there waiting for it. Given there are other threads reporting this - and its always the Minmus contract that's reported as missing not any other body - I think there's something off with that specific contract.

[Aviara]

I started two new games since 1.02 and in both it seems that after World's First "Orbit Kerbin" I'm not getting "Fly-By the Mun", which I got on my other save I started with 1.0! On my seconds save after 1.02 on the other hand I do get a "Ferry tourists" mission from World's First. Are World's First random now or is it a bug or is there something else I'm missing??

[Kelderek]

I think the "explore" contracts should be automatically enabled as soon as you enter the SOI of the associated body. The career should start with no explore contracts at all until you achieve orbit, and then it should automatically show you "Explore the Mun" and "Explore Minmus" together. As soon as you leave Kerbin's SOI you should automatically get "Explore Eve" and "Explore Duna". Make it a small chance to also see either Duna or Eve contracts sometime after you visit Mun or Minmus, but before you leave Kerbin's SOI. If you arrive at a planet's SOI, then you should automatically get the explore contracts for all of its moons. Gradually add the outer planet explore contracts as you venture away from Kerbin.

You could still make it so there is a random chance to see the explore contract a little earlier, but arriving at the SOI should give it to you automatically as well as the contracts for all of its moons.

[Arsonide]

Not convinced by that explanation. In every career game I've played in this and previous versions the explore contracts have appeared for every single body in a relatively logical progression, and once they're on the list they never expire. Minmus in 1.0 is the first one that's just not shown up, even with me sitting there waiting for it. Given there are other threads reporting this - and its always the Minmus contract that's reported as missing not any other body - I think there's something off with that specific contract.

Here is a more detailed explanation: the contract system picks randomly from the list of contracts it has available to it, including Explore contracts. The list of contracts available to the contract system have prerequisites before they can be added to this list, and those prerequisites can include progress milestones, technology research, or facility upgrades. As the player progresses through career, this list gets bigger, and therefore the chance of any particular contract type appearing gets smaller.

Explores will not appear once you have visited a planet, and given that your average player spends quite a bit of time in the Kerbin system, they have a decent chance of visiting Minmus before its Explore contract pops up, especially if they have unlocked rescue contracts, tourism, base and station contracts, etc.

So to summarize, the chance for this to appear is equal to any other particular contract, unless you've visited Minmus, in which case the chance is zero, but by the time you visit Minmus, you've unlocked enough types of contracts to make this chance much lower, resulting in players perceiving that this chance is any lower than it is for other planets, when it is not. The reason this isn't a perceived issue for the Mun, is because the player will not unlock as many contract types before that has a chance to appear. It similarly isn't an issue for Duna, because the player will pause for a long time before going interplanetary, giving Duna a greater chance to appear in time even given the lower chance to appear.

Edited May 5, 2015 by Arsonide