Has ISRU made the game better?

[G'th]

Is that you, GregoriousT?

Nope, though I imagine I would agree with him. I am a HUGE fan of systems that can get as in-depth as that system could be, namely because the end result after all of the work is much more glorious compared to a basic, gameplay filtered version. I can throw up any random sattelite into any orbit and be satisfied with a "communications array" I created, but RemoteTech makes me work to have a functional system, and in turn affects gameplay if I don't do the work.

I'd rather have different refineries on different bodies gathering and processing different resources rather than one refinery that can do it all. Not only does it enhance gameplay in the way that I like (some call it tedium, I call it base building), but it also allows for more dedicated spacecraft that can utilize specific in-situ resources using smaller, more specific parts to accomplish it. Its the difference between one huge refinery that can get anything, and a probe that can dip into a gas giant to refuel without having to haul some gigantic weight along with it.

But of course, the really nice thing about such an in-depth system is that, much like what we have now, it wouldn't need to be used to succeed.

Edited June 11, 2015 by G'th

[Reactordrone]

I think I'd rather have 0.90 Isp engines and no ISRU but I can work with the nerfed engines and resources.

[magnemoe]

I love it, used kethane since 0.18 and did an kethane grand tour, back then.

Standard base in 1.02 is three 2.5 m stacks one with science lab, ISRU, landing can and other systems in center. hitchhiker and life support on the other side.

I usualy use an nuclear tug to take it to target, tug will act as an local tanker and support the small lander I also send.

As my goal is to collect all science I will need multiple landings. On my Duna mission I first landed base on ike, jumped around to get an science at location contract and got all the science on it.

Then used tug to get to Duna, back to orbit and refuel from tug before landing again.

Eve i landed on Gilly then used tug with an hitchhiker and science module (probe with docking port) to gather all orbital and high atmosphere science on Eve.

Tug will be used to handle and refuel Eve landers who need to be refueled both in LKO and at Eve.

Mining base on Minmus, has two tugs who run to LKO,

[DMagic]

Less appealing for me than I thought it would be, to be honest. I really want to like it, but there are a few things that just spoil it for me:

1. You can only scan from a polar orbit, so making an all-in-one go anywhere ship requires you to either send a separate probe or put the ship into a costly polar orbit. Why not allow scanning from any inclination and only reveal the appropriate portion of the map?

My first ISRU mission is still on its way to Duna, so I can't say much about the system overall.

But I do have [thread=96859]a solution to number 1[/thread].

[Alshain]

My first ISRU mission is still on its way to Duna, so I can't say much about the system overall.

But I do have [thread=96859]a solution to number 1[/thread].

Yep, ScanSat is more fun anyway. If I understand it, the decision for the instant scan was made with the assumption that because people didn't like the way Kethane did it, was that it shouldn't scan the planet piece by piece, but that I feel was the wrong takeaway. People didn't like the fact that Kethane wouldn't continue scanning while you went and did other things the way ScanSat does. If it had been implemented like ScanSat it would have been perfect.

EDIT: I should clarify, the main issue with this is there is no way to fail at it really. With ScanSat/Kethane if you don't get the right orbit, there will be gaps, even if it is a polar orbit. The instant thing just makes it too "blah" because it is either all or nothing.

Edited June 11, 2015 by Alshain

[LittleBlueGaming]

Yeah, I had played with ScanSat before I ever used the stock scanner. I was really disappointed when I setup my polar orbit and just got the whole planet in 5 seconds. I loved how ScanSat took time and I had to plan how I wanted to scan the planet ahead of time.

To me, that's an example of being way too concerned with playability and not nearly concerned enough with realism.

[Tankman101]

Oh boy, the scanner argument again!

As for ISRU, it increases the viability of nuclear tugs and other purely space ships. That's a big plus!

[basic.syntax]

4. Heat! This is more to do with the lack of real heat management parts, but it makes designing and testing ISRU systems much more difficult. Overheating leads to throttling, which leads to...

This particular problem has melted away. From the 1.0.1 patch notes:

Resources:

* Replaced overheat mechanic of the ISRU and drills with a skill-based mechanic.

* Removed Overheat Throttle mechanic.

I have a feeling it may return, if RoverDude's 1.0.3 present turns out to be heat management parts

[RoverDude]

3. Diminishing surface deposits are foolish. If bases are meant to be encouraged then have those deposits stay rich forever.

4. Heat! This is more to do with the lack of real heat management parts, but it makes designing and testing ISRU systems much more difficult. Overheating leads to throttling, which leads to...

5. It's sloooow. I run my missions sequentially, so I end up waiting for tanks to fill. Time-based mechanics are supposed to be a no-no (MPL notwithstanding), and the scanning is instantaneous, I would much rather the tanks just filled at rates similar to fuel transfers, or instantly after checking to see that sufficient power generation is onboard.

6. It's energy intensive. We finally have some decent use for electricity but the demands are so high that current generation is not enough. Solar is intermittent and limits locations, RTGs drive the part count nuts, and fuel cells consume the very resources I'm trying to produce, which exacerbates 3 and 5 above and is worse still for asteroids.

[zarakon]

I don't really use it much, because I think it's just too much effort in most cases

It was fun to put one on a class D asteroid and find that I could get a rather huge amount of delta-v out of it, enough to put the asteroid almost anywhere

[Two]

if you think the ISRU is 100% needed to go interplanetary in 1.0 you probably are not that good at this game >.> seriously even a grand tour is doable without an ISRU.

I never said you couldn't. But you can't do a grand tour with 3200 dV without an ISRU.

It was fun to put one on a class D asteroid and find that I could get a rather huge amount of delta-v out of it, enough to put the asteroid almost anywhere

That is actually a brilliant idea... That'll be my next goal.

[Laie]

Naturally my own opinion on ISRU is biased, tho I would point out that ISRU mods were very popular prior to their stockification in 1.0

I was quite hyped and looking forward to it myself. I can't really tell you why I'm now so unhappy. I *think* it's because it works everywhere, all the time... that for a one-time fee of carrying ~8t/20parts, you can top off the tanks wherever you go. But I don't trust my own opinion in that matter.

[katateochi]

I really like what ISRU has done for asteroid retrieval missions. I used to find it to be far too costly to be worth bringing an asteroid back to LKO, but ISRU has totally changed that and made asteroid missions more enjoyable.

[Dilli]

In my opinion ISRU does improve the game:

1. It (with the lab) make bases/space station more functional and enjoyable.

2. It makes long term exploration missions more practical.

I don't think it is an "I win button" or unbalanced, as the same results can be achieved by launching massive monstrosities into orbit (computer and funds permitting) which either have enough d/v to go anywhere or refuel craft.

[percyPrune]

My 2p worth - Great addition, although I have only deployed a few rigs on Kerbin so far as I'm still learning about the process. (In between doing other contracts.) The latest iteration is here: http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/29533-What-did-you-do-in-KSP-today/page1609n

That rig is working a 6.5% deposit day and night and producing all its own power + a decent amount of saleable product at the same time with no nukes and solar panels only for initial startup/restore, and I'm sure that the design could be optimised further. I'm sure that most of you could even lob it onto another planet easily enough, even if I can't!

It's just that, like rocket building, it needs some trials to figure out a workable configuration.

For those who complain that the kit is too large/ too energy intensive: Have you seen the size of oil refineries and hydrogen/oxygen plants IRL? They are huge and consume megawatts of power which is why, I suppose, that we Earthlings haven't worked out how to send them into space yet. Kerbals are truly blessed with such an easy to use resource!

As to scanning, the ground scanner works even without a satellite scan. I found the current deposit just by driving around KSC with one in the back of a truck, long before I unlocked the orbital scanner. If you add one to every lander/rover you might end up lucky and strike it rich.

Now people have had time to play with the mechanics, perhaps it's time for a 'resource processing' showcase/ craft file thread?

Happy prospecting. Remember: "There's ore in them there biomes"