Radiators useful?

[Tiaga]

I've built a few ships in 1.04 with nuclear engines and I forgot to add radiators every time. Never had an overheating issue with long burn times so far. Did they add radiators and then made them pointless by reducing the heat generation? I've read a few people have problems with reaction wheels overheating but I haven't seen it.

[Charzy]

Pretty much.

[SoWeMeetAgain]

I've built a few ships in 1.04 with nuclear engines and I forgot to add radiators every time. Never had an overheating issue with long burn times so far. Did they add radiators and then made them pointless by reducing the heat generation? I've read a few people have problems with reaction wheels overheating but I haven't seen it.

it's not my video, but it's so damn good ... watch 'til the end, pay attention to the hilarious captions

[magnemoe]

I have had some issues with my LV-N tugs before radiators, mostly in rtg and the small solar pannels blow up after the burn as temprature in rest of rocket continue to rise.

[Laie]

it's not my video, but it's so damn good ... watch 'til the end, pay attention to the hilarious captions

The video is hilarious, but that bug is just plain mean. Do we know any more about it, is part clipping required or will it happen without?

[SoWeMeetAgain]

The video is hilarious, but that bug is just plain mean. Do we know any more about it, is part clipping required or will it happen without?

http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/126574-1-0-4-Cargo-Bays-Causing-Objects-Adjacent-to-Belly-to-Overheat-and-Explode-on-Pad-or-Runway

a lot of people experience it in different ways :/

[regex]

Did they add radiators and then made them pointless by reducing the heat generation?

Yep.

"Here's some radiators to help with overheating. BTW we reduced the heating to easy-mode. Enjoy your new useless parts."

[SoWeMeetAgain]

Yep.

"Here's some radiators to help with overheating. BTW we reduced the heating to easy-mode. Enjoy your new useless parts."

the heat radiators are actually really useful for reentry - if you have some of those near the bottom of your spacecraft and you enter pointed retrograde they will emit all the heat created by the friction with the butt end of your spacecraft, no explosions (not even fins)

[regex]

the heat radiators are actually really useful for reentry - if you have some of those near the bottom of your spacecraft and you enter pointed retrograde they will emit all the heat created by the friction with the butt end of your spacecraft, no explosions (not even fins)

I'm surprised that the people who were up in arms about the LV-N heating aren't mad about this little tidbit of "realism". Oh wait, now we can reenter the entire spacecraft and ~:%reusable space program%:~. #elonmusk #KSPpr0

[SoWeMeetAgain]

I'm surprised that the people who were up in arms about the LV-N heating aren't mad about this little tidbit of "realism". Oh wait, now we can reenter the entire spacecraft and ~:%reusable space program%:~. #elonmusk #KSPpr0

I agree noticed it because usually I burn the last stage as a improptu heat shield, but lo and behold it survives now

[Wjolcz]

That sucks.

What about drills? Do they heat up less too?

[selfish_meme]

The video is hilarious, but that bug is just plain mean. Do we know any more about it, is part clipping required or will it happen without?

I noticed it as well, earlier, no one cared but it was in a fairing

[Overland]

I dont quite think their useless..

if you invert the texture to black.. they make a great cowcatcher for my longhood road shunter.. and look great on the side of the hood too.. space? nope.. no idea.. but they rock for trains

[Aragosnat]

Actually. Tested the nuke out on Kerbin. Found out that with 2 400 LF tanks 1 lander can and one thermometer. The thermometer heated up pretty fast. Next tried same thing but with small retractable thermal control system. Found out it heated up a little bit slower and did not get as hot and started to cool down sooner as well as faster after the engine was shut down. The only two places where they might really be needed are Eve (Gilly Included) and Moho. As both of those places are closer to the heat source. Also. The static one. I think is useless too. Does make a good window cover.

Thing is. While in space. The radiators do pull heat away from the engine(s) faster then without. Which in turn heats up the area they are attached to faster. Have not tried the medium and large radiators. Best guess worl be they would be even slower and cool down even faster. Have not gotten the drills. But, likely they will take longer to over heat too and cool down faster with them.

[FlowerChild]

if you invert the texture to black.. they make a great cowcatcher for my longhood road shunter.. and look great on the side of the hood too.. space? nope.. no idea.. but they rock for trains

Space cows are much harder to catch due to the high velocities that tend to be involved, so they're really not as useful in that context.

[luizopiloto]

this radiators are useful...

[Geschosskopf]

I'm surprised that the people who were up in arms about the LV-N heating aren't mad about this little tidbit of "realism". Oh wait, now we can reenter the entire spacecraft and ~:%reusable space program%:~. #elonmusk #KSPpr0

Given that it was completely UNrealistic to have LV-Ns heat up in the first place, the jibberjabber demanding radiators for them was totally misguided.

So yeah, the only use I've found for radiators is in reducing reentry heat, and the fact that this actually works just illustrates a fundamental flaw in the whole heat system. As I understand things, one of the things in the heat system is that a reentering ship heats up the air it hits, which then flows back heating the rest of the ship more than it would have been otherwise.

Why is this a problem with radiators? Because heat is only supposed to move from hotter areas to colder areas. So, if heat from the air is getting into the ship, this means the air is hotter than the ship. Therefore, the ship should not be able to dump heat back into the air through the radiators. They would instead pump even more heat into the ship and make the situation worse.

THIS IS BROKEN.

[FlowerChild]

Given that it was completely UNrealistic to have LV-Ns heat up in the first place, the jibberjabber demanding radiators for them was totally misguided.

Only if you believe that realism is a game design goal onto itself, which at least some of us don't believe to be the case.

[Geschosskopf]

Only if you believe that realism is a game design goal onto itself, which at least some of us don't believe to be the case.

Oh, I'm totally in the camp of NOT desiring "realism" in KSP, in the sense of defining "realism" to mean "just like Earth". Trying to impose Earth-like conditions in KSP is doomed to fail (if not in the 1 spot you did it, then everywhere else in the game where you apply the same rules you bent to make the 1 place work) unless and until RSS becomes stock (gods forbid).

But that misses the point, which is that the only possible reason for making LV-Ns get hot was to make it much harder to use them. IOW, force players to do something else, thereby reducing player freedom. Which is just a bad game design decision. Especially if you're willing to wink at true realism from a safe distance in a game whose toy-sized system was built specifically to make gameplay easier.

[FlowerChild]

But that misses the point, which is that the only possible reason for making LV-Ns get hot was to make it much harder to use them. IOW, force players to do something else, thereby reducing player freedom. Which is just a bad game design decision. Especially if you're willing to wink at true realism from a safe distance in a game whose toy-sized system was built specifically to make gameplay easier.

I tend to disagree on that point, as I think if it provides an interesting design constraint, that takes precedence over player "freedom".

I also do not agree that restricting player freedom is inherently a bad game design decision. Rules inevitably restrict player freedom, and to my mind, are largely what differentiate a game from a toy. Hence, I view restricting player freedom as being a necessary component of good game design rather than the opposite.

And lastly, I don't think miniature Kerbin is necessarily intended to make the game easier as much as it may be intended to make it faster paced by reducing time to orbit. I do agree however that it creates unique design challenges in the process, that aren't always for the better.

Edited June 27, 2015 by FlowerChild

[Korizan]

Hmmm the differences between a radiator and a heat sink.

A heat sink like on your CPU basically reduces the heat by making the surface area very large.

A radiator on the other hand uses a fluid to conduct that heat to another area where it can be more effectively cooled once again via a very large surface area.

The exact same mechanic except the results are very different.

So if the radiators in KSP are acting as heat sinks then they would cool down the part they are connected too.

If the radiators are actually radiators then you would have to designate which part you are cooling and that part would be cooled.

And then there is the rest of the ship which would get heated up / cooled down depending on materials, surface area, and distance from the heat source.

So the question is, are the radiators in KSP a radiator or a heat sink.

And the LV-N heating doesn't reduce freedom but rather adds balance otherwise you could argue it is overpowered.

OR you could say cause and effect, everything has a trade off.

[klgraham1013]

But that misses the point, which is that the only possible reason for making LV-Ns get hot was to make it much harder to use them. IOW, force players to do something else, thereby reducing player freedom. Which is just a bad game design decision. Especially if you're willing to wink at true realism from a safe distance in a game whose toy-sized system was built specifically to make gameplay easier.

Restriction is inherent to game design. Without rules it's not a game.

[waterlubber]

Frankly, I always used Porkjet's nuclear engines, but I'm fine with the LV-N. Put radiators on anyway if you're upset.

[322997am]

I use radiators for my space plane wings and cockpits during re entry to prevent it from exploding. Once I deorbited an aeris 4a and the wings overheated and blew up. So I think the radiators are for spaceplanes.