Discussion thread - BD Armory AI tournaments

[colmo]

Made a badge - it currently links this thread until the actual challenge is up. Wish I could figure out how to show the plain code so one could just paste it anywhere, but the forum just turns it into the actual image. So it should be set manually. It's 107 px high - same as the common K-Prize one, and just a tiny bit taller than the Jool-5 badge. Link for the image:

http://i.imgur.com/o37n8ol.png

That looks fantastic, all you need is to surround the image URL with bbcode image tags (quote this to see them)

I've added it to OP.

That plane made out of wings may fall foul of a part limit - we are constrained to keep airframes to something that will maintain decent performance.

[PixelStory]

Will this be hosted on a DMP Server?

[erasmusguy]

Tournament style. Each player gets 2 planes and those 2 planes fight off against another players 2 planes. Only 4 planes are ever spawned at once. Losers are eliminated and winners fight other winners until only 1 person is left

Of course, this is heavily generalized. Each "series" of games would be 5 or 7 rounds (depending on what is decided upon), and each round would be a single face-off. It is kind of like how Stanley Cup playoff hockey works.

So no, there would only ever be 4 planes spawned at once. There would just be a lot of fights which would have to get done, rather than 1 big one.

What I would like to see would be a manufacture tournament and a pilot tournament like in motor-racing. Pilots can use whatever plane they like and, points are awarded to, both the winning pilot, and who made the plane.

[colmo]

Will this be hosted on a DMP Server?

No, this is an AI tournament, not multiplayer.

What I would like to see would be a manufacture tournament and a pilot tournament like in motor-racing. Pilots can use whatever plane they like and, points are awarded to, both the winning pilot, and who made the plane.

The same format could be used for piloted tournaments also, though they'd be either 1 v 1 using DMP (still very buggy with BD Armory, early days yet), 1 v AI, or 2 v 2 AI using a BurnTogether wingman. I've no plans to try them but others are welcome to.

[PixelStory]

How will people record and/or stream the event then?

[Noname117]

I've been thinking 2 people will stream the event, with the event itself taking place over 4 days. I've volunteered to be one of the streamers, but I am missing a second one.

[PixelStory]

I've been thinking 2 people will stream the event, with the event itself taking place over 4 days. I've volunteered to be one of the streamers, but I am missing a second one.

Okay, but how do you record if you cant get on the world?

[Evanitis]

Okay, but how do you record if you cant get on the world?

I think you missed the point somewhere. We, the participants send the craft files. BD's artificial intelligence will fly the planes, and do the fighting. Hell it even could be done on an offline computer, without any recording or streaming. We'll only watch it to cheer for our teams.

I'll totally force my non-gamer GF to watch. She'll hate me, but I'll redirect that hate towards the KSP people.

[colmo]

I think you missed the point somewhere. We, the participants send the craft files. BD's artificial intelligence will fly the planes, and do the fighting. Hell it even could be done on an offline computer, without any recording or streaming. We'll only watch it to cheer for our teams.

I'll totally force my non-gamer GF to watch. She'll hate me, but I'll redirect that hate towards the KSP people.

I could happily do this test myself on my ancient PC, but given it is already tripping krakensbane with 4 planes in the air, I don't think it would do well if I was recording too, short of speeding up the recording afterwards again. Streaming is even worse.

For an audience, it helps if it's done by someone who's a) entertaining and an old hand at streaming/recording.

[Evanitis]

Same here - already made a separate BD only KSP install to maximize performance on my potato-computer. It's ok for testing planes and the system, not so much if I tried streaming or recording too - not to mention doing so in a reasonable resolution.

That's one of the reasons why this AI tourney is appealing - the outcome doesn't depend on my PC performance or piloting skills (it would be hard to decide which is worse ).

[Darren9]

I think I'd prefer to see it run on than a fixed 16 or 32 man knockout. You'll only face either 4 or 8 opponents max out of 16 or 32, there's a long wait for everybody to be ready and a complexity to run the whole thing between a number of people in a reasonable time. We could have "winner stays on", the first entry fights the second, winner fights the third and so on. A badge/rank/hall of fame for how many wins in a row an entry achieved before it was knocked off the top by a better one.

It can start sooner, run longer, more flexible, and you only need to worry about getting the next fight done. Just one of who's available and able to record to say "I'll do the next 1/2/few now" and the organiser say "do it" and it'll be done and on to the next. It can go on for as long as there's new entries and could allow some epic winning streaks, you could also re-enter new designs only when your current entry is defeated.

Either way we need to get a launch procedure set in stone, hyperedit can only set a location, not point the craft in a certain direction? And if you activate the craft engine/autopilot one after the other the one you turned on first always gets up sooner and turns to fight first, that's why I was experimenting with the Smart Parts radio, they all launch at the same moment, no arguing.

I also got some info from Bahamotd about the AI scan interval/defensive that I'm prepared to share Set a longer scan interval and save some missiles for later since it doesn't affect defensive capabilities at all? Or just two large guns and a load of flares with a high turn rate since there's no defence against bullets?

Thanks! I didn't know about this contest, sounds interesting. The flares and defensive maneuvers are a separate coroutine that runs independently of the guard cycle, so it won't be affected. For ai pilots, the scan interval determines finding/choosing targets, and how often to shoot, but if it finds a vessel and its not pointing at it, it will remember the target, turn towards it, wait till it has a good firing solution, then fire and reset the cycle at that point. (Eventually I want to make the firing and scanning independent from each other as well.. but for now, thats how it works)

[zekes]

If this is a contest, sign me up!

MiG-31 Foxhound

Designer: Zekes

Status:COMPLETED

Cost: $99,322.00

The Big Brother of the MiG-25 - one of the fastest and heaviest armed interceptors in the world.

Max Speed is 1230m/s (NOTE: Heating should not be a problem, I recommend turning the heat UI off or the game crashes from it)

Max Altitude is 23,000m level flight

Press "4" for flaps toggle, "G" for gear.

Download: http://www./download/fy...k/Mig-31.craft

[Mad Rocket Scientist]

If this is a contest, sign me up!

http://i.imgur.com/kGD10Mc.jpg

MiG-31 Foxhound

Designer: Zekes

Status:COMPLETED

Cost: $99,322.00

The Big Brother of the MiG-25 - one of the fastest and heaviest armed interceptors in the world.

Max Speed is 1230m/s (NOTE: Heating should not be a problem, I recommend turning the heat UI off or the game crashes from it)

Max Altitude is 23,000m level flight

Press "4" for flaps toggle, "G" for gear.

Download: http://www./download/fy...k/Mig-31.craft

Oh, no! Now I've got to compete against that, too?!?!?!

[Darren9]

^ I'm not sure that'll meet the part limit Zekes, even though it's not set yet, that looks like a more than it will be

[colmo]

In related news, BD is implementing real heat seeking for Sidewinders. This could impact craft designs, some being more stealthy than others. Fascinating.

Edited July 21, 2015 by colmo

[Mad Rocket Scientist]

Can I use Vulcan turrets on my two whiplash design?

[ZLM-Master]

Yop !

This contest seems to be fun ! I had some tweak to make when final rules was done , but here's the two crafts i'd like to use .

I think the second wasn't fit your rules !

Download(+)

Download(+)

I stay tuned Over...

Edited July 22, 2015 by ZLM-Master

[colmo]

If this is a contest, sign me up!

http://i.imgur.com/kGD10Mc.jpg

MiG-31 Foxhound

Designer: Zekes

Status:COMPLETED

Cost: $99,322.00

The Big Brother of the MiG-25 - one of the fastest and heaviest armed interceptors in the world.

Max Speed is 1230m/s (NOTE: Heating should not be a problem, I recommend turning the heat UI off or the game crashes from it)

Max Altitude is 23,000m level flight

Press "4" for flaps toggle, "G" for gear.

Download: http://www./download/fy...k/Mig-31.craft

We'll likely have a part limit for practical reasons, so that may need some streamlining!

Can I use Vulcan turrets on my two whiplash design?

We're still hammering out how to balance weaponry. The hidden Vulcan turret is surely the default cannon for fighters. I suspect the other one will be rather difficult to incorporate without major compromises.

Yop !

This contest seems to be fun ! I had some tweak to make when final rules was done , but here's the two crafts i'd like to use .

I think the second wasn't fit your rules !

https://wgwdbq.bn1303.livefilestore.com/y3pRoN37onL6KYlHaTtanHoWGT8E8BaCLkk6SpXG6_zxGdHxIiRZleOkD5ke5HHpmMWU2RmpP_pYMDX6xwwSxGuCPh0_xXnac6_4c0tPvlLeUwKv9h6CCkE2m7Cx6h57sKwebs-Tmh-ddXzfrPsRjDgdh8UUsEDD2ge8Fq-PrakvUs/Dassault%20-%20Rafale%20C%20-%20Type%20B%20Stats.jpg?psid=1

Download(+)

https://vwxaag.dm2301.livefilestore.com/y3pnhLJaSB-XoKJj7y3shfSbOXGfUifxE_J7eUfumVHw7j11LOXnwB0ZZBEEKqRMf2aHa0peVn3cYV9q0x2xZKiwP3hldWyTR8N3ZWem8eIePhJoISyQ3sY71g8-poEpOfSWYJ8_7s4Hxq3-5qnPNh0VDN_bgVYQk0u_L4n7YJXidQ/Airwolf%20Stats.jpg?psid=1

Download(+)

I stay tuned Over...

https://vwwkgq-sn3302.files.1drv.com/y3pqRRW_7cdwSxQ_k765kQOfz-F5RzZzUXAkOK8opOZ4AkymrgAgOLK61t5Fb-bifPLeX7vqjgKY4x3KrsgFmG9dyjNlqhR2mL8e6QDpo7PKOFJqiKIhpX7DMMtPhci1EIfe4fMSwlKxTY8D4PEq-jb_pgIfx2mHvaox_65dTYOiwg/Avatar%202.gif?psid=1

It's likely you'll need to tweak the weaponry of the fighter to fit air-to-air purposes, but otherwise should be fine, though the extra parts added for looks (e.g. the second cockpit) will hamper performance, and the helicopter won't work - BD Armory can't fly helicopters (unless you're very clever and can design one that does).

Edited July 22, 2015 by colmo

[t3hJimmer]

I cant wait for this challenge to kick off. I just installed BD Armory today, and I'm having a blast blowing stuff up! It's going to be interesting to see the design people come up with.

[Noname117]

Can I use Vulcan turrets on my two whiplash design?

I would assume you could, but I''m thinking that turreted guns in this challenge should be locked (AKA have their min/max pitch and range be set to 0), essentially making them just forward firing guns.

Though now I'm thinking: What if we required an aircraft with a turreted gun being used as a turreted gun to have an extra crew member to operate it? This balances the advantage of having a turreted gun by making the aircraft weigh more and perform worse. I'm also thinking about only allowing engineers to operate the gun, so the extra pilot advantage also gets nerfed.

[Mad Rocket Scientist]

[...]

We're still hammering out how to balance weaponry. The hidden Vulcan turret is surely the default cannon for fighters. I suspect the other one will be rather difficult to incorporate without major compromises.

[...]

I got installed, and... wow. It easily blows the other fighter out of the air, of course, I'm using 3 of them, but still.

I would assume you could, but I''m thinking that turreted guns in this challenge should be locked (AKA have their min/max pitch and range be set to 0), essentially making them just forward firing guns.

Though now I'm thinking: What if we required an aircraft with a turreted gun being used as a turreted gun to have an extra crew member to operate it? This balances the advantage of having a turreted gun by making the aircraft weigh more and perform worse. I'm also thinking about only allowing engineers to operate the gun, so the extra pilot advantage also gets nerfed.

That is a great idea! Can I clip cockpits?

[ZLM-Master]

It's likely you'll need to tweak the weaponry of the fighter to fit air-to-air purposes, but otherwise should be fine, though the extra parts added for looks (e.g. the second cockpit) will hamper performance, and the helicopter won't work - BD Armory can't fly helicopters (unless you're very clever and can design one that does).

Yep , i build it firstly for multi-role purpose & most weapon on it are useless in dogfight . My stock Rafale got only 60 parts .

The BD-Armory aroud 80 . I'll entry a "Contest Edition" to fit with your rules with this plane base . Most of my aircraft got more than 150 Parts even in stock , erf !

You'll probably surprised to see how my Copters shoot down some of my aircraft in less than 30s . & ofc i got some totally crazy with auto-pilot on ! ( Like go straight onto the ground or flying backward !) The main issue with copter is the main rotor , one hit there & it"s finish for you ! But i have [tweckscale] parts on most of my copter to fit with stock aero/aesthetic , that's why i probably not entry my Copter , even if it's fly well !

Ok , i go to work & stay tuned

[Mad Rocket Scientist]

When do you think this will start? I'm going away from KSP for a while, should I post my craft now?

[erasmusguy]

Is there a set of rules for this tournament (like how many of each type of weapon you can use) and would it be done as a stream so we can watch?

[Noname117]

I want to to be done on stream, and the rules are still being finalized. The only problem is that I cannot find a second streamer, which we would likely need to fully stream the competition.