How to reach correct satellite coordinates?

[fireblade274]

SO I've been trying for 25 min now to get my satellite into the correct polar orbit around Kerbin; I thought it would be as easy as matching the specified blue line with my teal line, but i'm in side what I call "Reasonable Deviation" and it wont complete the contract for me. Do I honestly have to be going the right direction around it or something??!

https://www.dropbox.com/s/xm35dh986gg2mm9/2015-08-12_00001.jpg?dl=0 YOU would call this correct right?

Edited August 13, 2015 by fireblade274

[Phil deCube]

Are you going backwards?

[fireblade274]

What is backwards lol

how do I know if im going the right way I should be

Really either way should be acceptable

this is why i never do these missions lol

[Randazzo]

There are moving dots on the target orbit to denote which direction you should be going. You are nearly in a 90 degree inclination. If the target orbit is 270 degrees, you're going the wrong direction.

If you are going the right direction and it still won't complete, go back to the space center then return to the probe via the tracking station. It should complete then.

[fireblade274]

Yep the moving dots defiantly made it clear! Thanks guys

[Alshain]

Lol, they have got to fix that. I have no idea how, but we see this problem FAR too often.

[Wemb]

Nah - all part of learning. In any case, when you've managed to screw up an asteroid capture in this way, you stop worrying about mucking up satellites.

The probes I send out for satellite missions are incredibly over-spec'd fuel wise - this is so I can return them after I win the satellite contract and park them next to by orbital lab and EVA out collect the science off them. It also means I can, if necessary turn them around and reverse the orbit if I muck up. If you're in a suitably high orbit, this may not be as expensive as you may think it is if you're used to working in low Kerbal Orbit (where it's very expensive in terms of dV to reverse orbit)

Wemb

[radonek]

Lol, they have got to fix that. I have no idea how, but we see this problem FAR too often.

How could that be fixed? Polar orbits does not have universaly recognized retrograde direction. You lift of, say, northward, then you can get to same orbit aiming southwise half a day later. IMO only thing that can be done is to visually hint you at proper direction. Which the game does.

[Starhawk]

Besides, each of us only does it once, right? Right??

Happy landings!

[Mastikator]

Nah - all part of learning. In any case, when you've managed to screw up an asteroid capture in this way, you stop worrying about mucking up satellites.

The probes I send out for satellite missions are incredibly over-spec'd fuel wise - this is so I can return them after I win the satellite contract and park them next to by orbital lab and EVA out collect the science off them. It also means I can, if necessary turn them around and reverse the orbit if I muck up. If you're in a suitably high orbit, this may not be as expensive as you may think it is if you're used to working in low Kerbal Orbit (where it's very expensive in terms of dV to reverse orbit)

Wemb

The learning curve should only be steep because rocket science is hard, not because the UI is difficult to understand. They could add big arrows along the orbital trajectory that show the direction of the orbit.

[xtoro]

Lol, they have got to fix that. I have no idea how, but we see this problem FAR too often.

The learning curve should only be steep because rocket science is hard, not because the UI is difficult to understand. They could add big arrows along the orbital trajectory that show the direction of the orbit.

I don't see how they could make it any clearer. I mean, there's dots moving around the orbit! I for one would hate big arrows that would further clutter up screen.

[Mastikator]

I don't see how they could make it any clearer. I mean, there's dots moving around the orbit! I for one would hate big arrows that would further clutter up screen.

Not always easy to see or understand. It wasn't for me. A game with real difficulty does not need artificial difficulty to make the experience more arbitrary

[xtoro]

Not always easy to see or understand. It wasn't for me. A game with real difficulty does not need artificial difficulty to make the experience more arbitrary

Is it maybe a screen resolution thing? Because the first time I saw the colored orbit I was wondering what it was and immediately noticed the moving dots while looking at it. Maybe on lower res the dots don't show up as well?

[Kryxal]

Maybe highlight the AN and DN if they exceed 90 degrees? In any case, a great big hint that YOU'RE GOING THE WRONG WAY would be good.

[FancyMouse]

I always look at AN/DN. Way easier than tracing dots. It's not about resolution, it's that it's quite often I can't distinguish which direction it goes because of a particular view angle towards the orbit plane, which annoys me and eventually I just look at AN/DN without looking at dots.

[Sobriquet]

The learning curve should only be steep because rocket science is hard, not because the UI is difficult to understand. They could add big arrows along the orbital trajectory that show the direction of the orbit.

I agree. Keep the system complete as is. Please add GIANT ARROWS showing the direction of required orbit. Would be even more awesome if it could be shown before I take the contract.

[DMagic]

How could that be fixed? Polar orbits does not have universaly recognized retrograde direction. You lift of, say, northward, then you can get to same orbit aiming southwise half a day later. IMO only thing that can be done is to visually hint you at proper direction. Which the game does.

Make the dots arrows; they don't need to be big, just obvious.

There is still the issue of properly setting up your orbit to match the target orbit, but that is a gameplay challenge, not a UI problem.

[Pecan]

Arrows won't help in the slightest, this is a problem of people not reading the manual.

Which, of course, is a problem of not having a manual.

Hey Squad! You know that manual I've written? The one you can't decide whether to give me screenshot copyright-clearance for?

(*whisper* well actually, contracts aren't covered in that one - and they never will be if you stop me publishing!)

[Alshain]

How could that be fixed? Polar orbits does not have universaly recognized retrograde direction. You lift of, say, northward, then you can get to same orbit aiming southwise half a day later. IMO only thing that can be done is to visually hint you at proper direction. Which the game does.

I didn't mean change the mechanic, I mean make the direction indicator more apparent. It isn't about orbits, it is about software ergonomics. Maybe if they used arrows instead of dots, the human brain would more intuitively grasp the intention. They don't have to be big arrows, sometimes the slightest change makes a big difference in ergonomics.

There is a story that Valve will tell you about the Portal development and testing. When they first did focus groups, they received a load of comments on how it was unrealistic and unbelievable that someone could fall such great distances. So they simply added the initial scene where you could see Chell's legs and the attached bars on the back of her legs and never heard a complaint about it from the focus groups again.

It is a funny thing how the mind works, and that is why there are people like me who make their careers out of predicting the intuitiveness of software. At best bad ergonomics are an annoyance to the users, at worst it can destroy a software, just ask Microsoft... it killed Windows 8. My specialization is in user software rather than gaming elements so I can't offer a lot of ideas on fixing this in KSP, but I can tell you it is an ergonomic issue.

Edited August 14, 2015 by Alshain