[PURGE THREAD]

[ihtoit]

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Edited January 30, 2016 by ihtoit

[Noname117]

I'm honestly not sure if limiting the altitude to 500m is the best thing to do. Sure, it is possible (and I intend on doing it), but trying to go any lower makes timewarp difficult if you don't have an autopilot mod, and what you are suggesting here is essentially a circumnavigation of Kerbin (Although you could take non-circumnavigation routes, the length would be the same). I'd say remove the height ceiling entirely and set it as just a "as low as you can go" challenge, mostly so that me and @lemon1324 aren't your only participants. Maybe make the current rewards 4 times what they currently are or something (since all of them are really hard to achieve unless you have insane concentration and time). Also do note that the only way to win this challenge if 500m is the ceiling is to stay over the ocean when not over the ice caps, since large parts of Kerbin go above 500 meters. Do remember that an equatorial under 1000 meters flight (897m was my max altitude) only actually has a couple of routes you can go roughly equatorially.

 

I still feel like I need to talk more. If you still want a max ceiling, maybe make it 5000 meters? There's some minimal mountain dodging you have to do at that altitude, but not too much. When you go down to 2000, you're dodging mountains. When you go down to 1500, be prepared to dodge hills and raises in terrain as well. When you go down to 1000, you're carefully picking your route over terrain, and getting quite close to the ground at some points. When you go down to 500, you're just dodging terrain entirely. More of a reason to raise the cap or just delete it.

Edited January 29, 2016 by Noname117

[ihtoit]

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Edited January 30, 2016 by ihtoit

[Noname117]

5 minutes ago, ihtoit said:

this is a polar circ, and it is entirely possible to do it below 75m, considering the ice fields are 1m altitude and the KSC runway is 69m up: fly South over the water to the South pole then follow the lowlands/coastal areas to the North pole (or go the other direction). There is also a 75m equatorial route: fly over the water East around the peninsula, swing North East into the lagoon via the Rift, across toward the crater then South through the inlet, continue East following hte coast, across the mouth of the large bay then follow the KSC Peninsula coast back to base from the South. The following is merely a suggestion for an ultra-low-altitude circumpolar air route (it's all below 100m).

-Snip!-

 

I hate to break it to you, but you're not getting accurate data out of your map. I highly recommend the height-map on http://www.kerbalmaps.com/ as you can zoom in and see the exact altitude for a certain point. This means that I can tell you for certain that the altitude of the flight path you have shown goes a bit over 75 meters. First of all, having the runway at 69 meters makes takeoff and landing very difficult. 6 meters is not a lot of leeway (Think of 5 mk1 rocket parts side by side. You don't even have that height to lift off). In fact, my first basic-jet circumnavigater sits at 72 meters while on the runway.  That's 3 meters of leeway to work with, which is not a lot. Its possible to take off in these conditions, but not easily, and landing would be near impossible.

Flying over the ocean you'd have 75 meters of leeway. That's 10 S3-14400 tanks stacked on top of each other, which is reasonable but still not a lot. You'd have to be precisely flying at this altitude, and timewarp would not be an option (as it would be too easy to exceed said altitude or crash with it on). My low altitude circumnavigations have all exceeded 7 hours game time (as far as I know I'm the only one who is doing them at below 10K), so the flight would be long assuming you don't quicksave.

The icecaps are at 30 meters, so you have even less leeway there, Still flyable, but just barely.

At this point if you want to reach the south pole while staying under 75 meters you have to turn around and fly the same route you came in on, except flying past KSC and crossing the ocean to the south pole. If you try to go the way you are suggesting, you will quickly find that much of the land there is above 200 meters, with the lowest points on one pass going above 300 meters. Going below 300 meters on that route is probably near impossible, and if you do you are still going to be really close to the ground. That essentially means that all of the awards you set can only be achieved if you are going on the purely ocean route I suggested.

I'm not saying pole to pole is impossible with the suggestions you have given, but it is so hard to do so that nobody's going to actually compete. The lowest aerial circumnavigation run I know of was my 897 meter run, though I do have an even lower run planned for the future. These runs typically take 4 to 5 hours even with timewarp on, and most people won't do that. In fact, everything 200 meters and below is probably only achievable if you use an autopilot mod. And even for the runs possible without autopilot I highly doubt anyone (other than me and maybe other people who have done basic jet circumnavigations) will even attempt the challenge. I highly recommend getting rid of the ceiling cap because the challenge is to circumnavigate at the lowest altitude anyways, so competition remains without the cap.

 

Also, if you want to see just what it takes to circumnavigate at these low altitudes (I don't think I've yet done one above 5000 meters):

From left to right: NAM-6B, aircraft which circumnavigated at 897m maximum altitude with one engine out (The lowest aerial circumnavigation I know of). Was built for 2 challenges. NAM-7C, which proved that Juno circumnavigations are possible at reasonably low altitudes. NAM-1-D3, which will likely be the aircraft I circumnavigate with next (aiming for a lower altitude than the NAM-6B). If I do this challenge, this will likely be the aircraft I fly. NAM-1-A, which proved that basic jets could circumnavigate past version 1.0. Also my longest flight, staying in the air for over 9 hours ingame time. NAM-1-B, which did a circumnavigation similar to the NAM-1-A's but at lower altitude and in faster time.

Those planes show what it takes to circumnavigate at such low altitudes. Fuel crammed into every corner and powered with basic jets. Usually having good aerodynamic qualities helps (Though the NAM-1-A and -B did commit some aerodynamic sins with the way the current KSP engine works).

 

As I will repeat one last time, circumnavigating at low altitudes is hard and time consuming, nobody has actually done a circumnavigation below the ceiling you have set, and the only way to do most of the awards you set would be to double back on yourself. Removing the altitude cap allows more people to join, and will promote some more competition. Plus, some reasonable records will likely be set first with people gradually flying their aircraft lower and lower.

[Vanamonde]

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