[1.1.3] KSO (Kerbin Shuttle Orbiter) Legacy Packs & Development Updates

[Raptor22]

ah right sorry I meant the other way around. I messed up there.

[smotheredrun]

On 08/01/2017 at 9:18 PM, Raptor22 said:

ah right sorry I meant the other way around. I messed up there.

We all do that now and then.   I understood what you meant.

 

If anyone is interested in looking at the vehicles and seeing what they can do to help out making them work (wheels), please PM me. 

[smotheredrun]

Hello all, we're almost done the bug hunt.  RPM is causing some issues, so we'll see what can be done about that.

Work on the station parts is almost complete, just a few more balance things to do.

Life support patches are also being worked on; Kerbalism I believe is being left out at the moment. USI, TAC, and I think Snacks was the third one we're doing for now.  LS for the Station Parts is somewhat time comsuming for me, fortunately I have some wonderful user helping in that regard.

That said, please don't expect an update prior to 15 August as I'll be heading out camping next weekend and I don't want to drop an update and then take off... that doesn't sit well with me.  I'd also prefer not to leave the tireless helper out to dry dealing with all of the inevitable support questions.

Stay tuned

[DiscoveryPlanet]

does this mod work in ksp 1.3 ???
why this mod not updated yet?

[StarStreak2109]

2 hours ago, DiscoveryPlanet said:

does this mod work in ksp 1.3 ???
why this mod not updated yet?

coz ya havent git r dun yet

[smotheredrun]

On 9/10/2017 at 2:11 AM, DiscoveryPlanet said:

does this mod work in ksp 1.3 ???
why this mod not updated yet?

It "works" as is... mostly.  Still working on some balance issues (cost, mass, output, etc) and some small bugs.  Station parts work -- just need some balancing (working on it).  Another user and I are patching (them) and testing (us) the shuttles.  Reaction wheels are bloody crazy.

[TanksAlot05]

can you up date the mod to 1.3.0 i would love to see in the newest version. one problem is the Wheels do not work.

[shdwlrd]

18 minutes ago, TanksAlot05 said:

can you up date the mod to 1.3.0 i would love to see in the newest version. one problem is the Wheels do not work.

You have to press 's' once to align them. Once you do that, they work fine.

[Abpilot]

srsly 1.3 though dos it work?

[shdwlrd]

30 minutes ago, Abpilot said:

srsly 1.3 though dos it work?

As smotheredrun has said before, the mods do work, just not well. The vehicles work, just press 's' once to align the wheels. There are collider issues with some of the vehicles though. The only thing wrong with the station parts is that they're not balanced to current 1.3 standards. The super25 is a bear to fly, but it works. Don't bother with the dauntless until its updated. It's just broken. 

Don't expect anything to be in the correct categories. And don't expect tags to work. 

[Abpilot]

19 minutes ago, shdwlrd said:

As smotheredrun has said before, the mods do work, just not well. The vehicles work, just press 's' once to align the wheels. There are collider issues with some of the vehicles though. The only thing wrong with the station parts is that they're not balanced to current 1.3 standards. The super25 is a bear to fly, but it works. Don't bother with the dauntless until its updated. It's just broken. 

Don't expect anything to be in the correct categories. And don't expect tags to work. 

Ok so it's basically broken for now

[shdwlrd]

33 minutes ago, Abpilot said:

Ok so it's basically broken for now

It depends on your definition of broken.

If you think if something isn't functioning 100% as intended as broken, then yes, it's broken.

Or as with the case of older KSP mods. Can you at least load the mod and use the parts without any patches even though they don't conform with the current standards. Then they are not broken.

Right now it's just semantics. The KSO vehicles, station parts, and the super25 are useable. The dauntless crashes more than it flys, hence the reason I say it's broken.

[DStaal]

BTW: I just noticed that the kso_usi_ls.cfg file has a lot of ':FOR[USILifeSupport]' blocks, which will not work as intended.  You mean ':NEEDS[USILifeSupport]'.  ('FOR' *defines* the mod, 'NEEDS' *requires* the mod.  So, as written, this will always apply and make any other mod that has USI-LS support apply as well.)

[panarchist]

On 9/26/2017 at 8:30 AM, DStaal said:

BTW: I just noticed that the kso_usi_ls.cfg file has a lot of ':FOR[USILifeSupport]' blocks, which will not work as intended.  You mean ':NEEDS[USILifeSupport]'.  ('FOR' *defines* the mod, 'NEEDS' *requires* the mod.  So, as written, this will always apply and make any other mod that has USI-LS support apply as well.)

Yes, that was one of the first MM patches I ever wrote - it has a host of issues, which have never been fixed. I don't have time to update it, but anyone else who wants to, please go ahead. It also needs to be balanced to the current USI-LS - it was balanced to a prior version, and is probably overpowered compared to other items of equal mass and volume.

Edited September 30, 2017 by panarchist

[Ernos]

Is there a dev version available for 1.3?

[panarchist]

On 3/1/2017 at 10:30 PM, smotheredrun said:

Regarding shuttle naming:   As you mentioned, a long while ago you could swap shuttle names/rename/have different textures each with unique names.  I believe it may have been part of a firespitter thing? - a long time ago.  I asked almost verbatim what you just asked a few pages (5 or 10 back maybe? - search bar is your friend - even got a config tweak to make texture-switching possible), the response was that anyone who previously had other textures was free to share them.  To date, no joy on that. Maybe dig through the 0.90 KSO thread?

I got back to looking at the legacy parts after a long time away, and found my old 0.90 install, which has both the patch file and the alternate textures for the Dauntless / Resolute *and* the Ascension.  I modified the config file so that all 6 alternate textures are available through FSTextureSwitch. (same license as the OP) You'll need Firespitter .dll installed to use as-is.  Zipped file can be found here. Side note - the textures are still available on the first page of the 0.90 v.413 KSOS thread - you'll need to convert the links back to "real" download links (i.e. "www.mediafire.com" instead of "www.") in order to download them that way.

If anyone needs to find the fstextureswitch2 code in the old 0.90 thread, it's here: 

 

 

Edited October 4, 2017 by panarchist
Added link to fstextureswitch forum posts

[smotheredrun]

On 10/3/2017 at 1:47 AM, panarchist said:

I got back to looking at the legacy parts after a long time away, and found my old 0.90 install, which has both the patch file and the alternate textures for the Dauntless / Resolute *and* the Ascension.  I modified the config file so that all 6 alternate textures are available through FSTextureSwitch. (same license as the OP) You'll need Firespitter .dll installed to use as-is.  Zipped file can be found here. Side note - the textures are still available on the first page of the 0.90 v.413 KSOS thread - you'll need to convert the links back to "real" download links (i.e. "www.mediafire.com" instead of "www.") in order to download them that way.

If anyone needs to find the fstextureswitch2 code in the old 0.90 thread, it's here: 

Thanks @panarchist!  Is there a way to convert these .tga files to .dds "to make them smaller and use less resources?"  Or is there an issue with licensing or something else?

In other KSOS news, I have been away from KSP and my gaming system in general for the last few weeks.  Wedding season is far from over for me and Hallowe'en parties, college/university parties are back into full swing.  Combined with my other career an family, it has been a crazy month and a half.

@shdwlrd has a new set of patches for me to test and has done a fantastic job bug hunting with RPM and a laundry list of others (if memory serves, the vehicles also got a good once or twice over).  Hoping to have Friday off before my gig to do some serious testing of pretty much anything and everything in the mod pack in both 1.3 and 1.3.1.  The next phase is to pass on these fixes to the OP and the original testing team (out of respect).  Once blessings have been secured and any boatmen appropriately bribed, the KSOS can officially live again.

 

 

[panarchist]

1 hour ago, smotheredrun said:

Thanks @panarchist!  Is there a way to convert these .tga files to .dds "to make them smaller and use less resources?"  Or is there an issue with licensing or something else?

I'm providing them in the format they were posted in. Given the licensing terms of the original, I'm not comfortable posting converted versions - you'd have to ask Nazari or Helldiver about that.

Regarding a release of 1.3 / 1.3.1 compatibility patches, did shdwlrd happen to figure out how to fix the KSO25 Super's weight issue? Adding or subtracting fuel and oxidizer in the fuselage shifts the Center of Mass in the wrong direction. Makes it a real challenge to land. I cooked up some alternate weights for the Dauntless which work a lot better and make it much more flyable - still haven't rebalanced the USI-LS patch, though.

[shdwlrd]

11 hours ago, panarchist said:

Regarding a release of 1.3 / 1.3.1 compatibility patches, did shdwlrd happen to figure out how to fix the KSO25 Super's weight issue? Adding or subtracting fuel and oxidizer in the fuselage shifts the Center of Mass in the wrong direction. Makes it a real challenge to land.

I know the root cause for that, but it's not correctable. The command model will have to be changed/divided to be able to correct the CoM shifting, but to keep the CoM in front of the main landing gear. I did a CoM offset to where the CoM wouldn't shift with fuel depletion, but the overall CoM moved to behind the main gear.

[panarchist]

8 hours ago, shdwlrd said:

I know the root cause for that, but it's not correctable. The command model will have to be changed/divided to be able to correct the CoM shifting, but to keep the CoM in front of the main landing gear. I did a CoM offset to where the CoM wouldn't shift with fuel depletion, but the overall CoM moved to behind the main gear.

Yeah, that's what I was afraid of. I was able to fix the Dauntless by increasing weight in the command section and decreasing it in the cargo bay, but the Super is all one part so that wasn't an option.

[shdwlrd]

1 hour ago, panarchist said:

Yeah, that's what I was afraid of. I was able to fix the Dauntless by increasing weight in the command section and decreasing it in the cargo bay, but the Super is all one part so that wasn't an option.

It makes adjusting the super25 a bit trickier than I anticipated. Some of the options I available to correct the CoM shift falls out of the realm of plausibly. I don't want to do that. I don't want it to seem cheaty. I wasn't able to remove the CoM shift completely for the dauntless. I was able to reduce it to a manageable amount. (About 1/2 meter shift from a 2-3 meter shift.) I removed the LFO and MP from the wings and added it to the cargo bay and adding a bit of weight to the command section. (Why it was in the wings, idk.)

[panarchist]

1 hour ago, shdwlrd said:

It makes adjusting the super25 a bit trickier than I anticipated. Some of the options I available to correct the CoM shift falls out of the realm of plausibly. I don't want to do that. I don't want it to seem cheaty. I wasn't able to remove the CoM shift completely for the dauntless. I was able to reduce it to a manageable amount. (About 1/2 meter shift from a 2-3 meter shift.) I removed the LFO and MP from the wings and added it to the cargo bay and adding a bit of weight to the command section. (Why it was in the wings, idk.)

I went with the following:

thrustmaxkso = mass = 0.8 (this puts performance / mass in line with stock engines)

cgholdkso = mass = 1.25

KSO_Cabin = mass = 4

leftwingkso = mass = 0.8

rightwingkso = mass = 0.8

rearkso = mass = 1

tailrudderkso = mass = 0.125

omskso = mass = 0.16 (this puts performance / mass in line with stock engines)

and left the ailerons and the landing gear at their original weights. That moves the CoM just enough to make the craft stable in nearly every normal flight situation, regardless of tank loading. It's also a lot more believable in terms of relation to the STS orbiter, though not entirely. The cabin mass of 4 is pushing it, but I consider it warranted since the cabin can hold 6 kerbals.

Pretty sure Helldiver and Nazari had fuel in the wings because it's common in aircraft. The STS orbiters obviously did not have fuel in the wings, but then they didn't have fuel, period. The OMS pods had hypergolic propellants for OMS and RCS, but they were intended to be detached and serviced / replaced as necessary. Not so with the wings.

[shdwlrd]

21 hours ago, panarchist said:

Pretty sure Helldiver and Nazari had fuel in the wings because it's common in aircraft. The STS orbiters obviously did not have fuel in the wings, but then they didn't have fuel, period. The OMS pods had hypergolic propellants for OMS and RCS, but they were intended to be detached and serviced / replaced as necessary. Not so with the wings.

I have a feeling that's the reason too, but LFO is very heavy. When the KSO shuttles where made, I bet no one realized how heavy LFO actually was. With the aero changes with 1.0 not well documented yet, that made a mess of things. Some of the methods now used for balancing parts where not known until 1.2 when Squad brought on the army of moders. Now everything is documented, it's a lot easier to find answers to questions.

I didn't know that the RL STS orbiter didn't use LFO after I played around with Pak's shuttle mod. Afterwards I lookup and learned a lot about the STS and Buran. There are still a bunch of technical tidbits I don't know, so thanks for teaching me something new about it.  

[smotheredrun]

#%$@&!!!!  It's awesome to see people put their heads together and come up with something meaningful.  Sorry, it's been a long week and silly week.  Just glad I'm not actually in the offices with some of these people.  Be too tempted to change engineer's and architect's minds..... with my hammer.... 

Great work @shdwlrd and @panarchist!

 

[KerbalTween]

Anyone?