The Grand KSP 1.1 Discussion Thread

[A_name]

Probably been asked, but there's a lot of pages to go through. I downloaded from the KSP store, how can I know if I have the x64 version?

[basic.syntax]

5 minutes ago, kithylin said:

...they even -REMOVED- some physx acceleration for wheels and using their own "whatever" instead...

TL;DR: wheels are deceptively complicated.

Check out this long post by the lead developer over on reddit, for some of the reasons KSP has to go its own way.

[Jacke]

11 minutes ago, kithylin said:

Yep I can officially confirm, KSP -DOES NOT- use nvidia physx for physics calculations. For some reason they chose not to take advantage of the most important performance aspect of Unity 5, and I read in the changes up there that they even -REMOVED- some physx acceleration for wheels and using their own "whatever" instead.......................

 

I will still not understand why KSP does not take advantage of advanced technologies like this that already exist. Especially for a super physics-heavy game like KSP. One would think they would want all the advantages they could get in terms of performance, especially "free" ones by just tapping in to existing technologies.  Such a sad day.

Probably because the physics of a spacecraft simulator where there's spacecraft made of many parts is far from the common use cases in the design of NVIDIA's PhysX.  I'm willing to give Squad the benefit of the doubt on that one...for now.

But rolling out a release with so many critical issues on basic features, like relative UI features scaling (text is way too small and I haven't been able to find a way to enlarge it independently), major issues with landing legs and wheels, major drag issues on struts, WEAKER JOINTS ?!?  I know there was a lot of stuff to transform and fix on the way to 1.1.  But how were these missed ?!?

Edited April 20, 2016 by Jacke

[smjjames]

9 minutes ago, jrolson said:

What's with the massive amount of lag in the VAB when scrolling up or down? 

It;s something I tried warning them about.

http://bugs.kerbalspaceprogram.com/issues/8865

[kithylin]

8 minutes ago, A_name said:

Probably been asked, but there's a lot of pages to go through. I downloaded from the KSP store, how can I know if I have the x64 version?

Open windows task manager while KSP is running, and if you have a second monitor there put it there and watch, or alt-tab out and look at it. Go to process lists and if you see "KSP_x64.exe" running, then you have the 64-bit version. If you see "KSP.exe *32" then you have the 32-bit version.

[Jacke]

1 minute ago, kithylin said:

Open windows task manager while KSP is running, and if you have a second monitor there put it there and watch, or alt-tab out and look at it. Go to process lists and if you see "KSP_x64.exe" running, then you have the 64-bit version. If you see "KSP.exe *32" then you have the 32-bit version.

Also, for 64-bit, the version number shown on the initial screen will read "v1.1.0.1230 (x64)".

[WolfGeek101]

11 minutes ago, A_name said:

Probably been asked, but there's a lot of pages to go through. I downloaded from the KSP store, how can I know if I have the x64 version?

As far as I'm aware, everything is x64 now. No more worrying about mods!

[Znath]

My land train is vastly weaker now.

If I hit any bump over 10 degrees at over 20m/s it's a 50 50 chance that it'll break.

If I lower to the electric rover wheels... they instantly break.

The vehicle turns like a cow on rollerskates too...

 

I like the increased performance of the game.  I'm running at insane frame rates on highest settings now.

But.... the loss in my vehicle performance is miserable.  I'll be limping back to KSC....

[justspace103]

hey guys so on mac i read that on mac the 64 bit version is by default if the OS is updated, but it doesnt say the (x64) in the corner of the screen.

[kithylin]

5 minutes ago, Znath said:

My land train is vastly weaker now.

If I hit any bump over 10 degrees at over 20m/s it's a 50 50 chance that it'll break.

If I lower to the electric rover wheels... they instantly break.

The vehicle turns like a cow on rollerskates too...

 

I like the increased performance of the game.  I'm running at insane frame rates on highest settings now.

But.... the loss in my vehicle performance is miserable.  I'll be limping back to KSC....

 

 

.... As with all major updates to KSP, you're going to have to re-build everything to get it working right, espically large updates like this one with significant changes to everything. In general with KSP updates we're supposed to wipe everything, including all saves, and do clean installs. Mostly just to weed out any possible corruption from old KSP settings/items/ships as potential "Problems" with the new builds. Everyone should be accustomed to this by now if you've been playing KSP long enough.

[War Eagle 1]

Wheels won't work if they are clipped into other parts
Also when they are not clipped i got a max speed of 5 m/s (in a tank that in 1.0.5 pushed 20)

[smjjames]

17 minutes ago, Jacke said:

Probably because the physics of a spacecraft simulator where there's spacecraft made of many parts is far from the common use cases in the design of NVIDIA's PhysX.  I'm willing to give Squad the benefit of the doubt on that one...for now.

But rolling out a release with so many critical issues on basic features, like relative UI features scaling (text is way too small and I haven't been able to find a way to enlarge it independently), major issues with landing legs and wheels, major drag issues on struts, WEAKER JOINTS ?!?  I know there was a lot of stuff to transform and fix on the way to 1.1.  But how were these missed ?!?

They decided to rush it, that's how they missed it

[Znath]

2 minutes ago, kithylin said:

 

 

.... As with all major updates to KSP, you're going to have to re-build everything to get it working right, espically large updates like this one with significant changes to everything. In general with KSP updates we're supposed to wipe everything, including all saves, and do clean installs. Mostly just to weed out any possible corruption from old KSP settings/items/ships as potential "Problems" with the new builds. Everyone should be accustomed to this by now if you've been playing KSP long enough.

Yea... it's just a little irritating to have a single vehicle circle 90% of the globe including the north and south poles  just to get the next update and it turned from a robust vehicle into a fragile glass unicorn.

[smjjames]

Just now, Znath said:

Yea... it's just a little irritating to have a single vehicle circle 90% of the globe including the north and south poles  just to get the next update and it turned from a robust vehicle into a fragile glass unicorn.

Given how big the update is, theres no guarantee that a vehicle in 1.1 will be as good as it was in 1.0.5.

Maybe you were using KJR before?

[kithylin]

3 minutes ago, Znath said:

Yea... it's just a little irritating to have a single vehicle circle 90% of the globe including the north and south poles  just to get the next update and it turned from a robust vehicle into a fragile glass unicorn.

Change the time steam updates your games to a time when you're never awake (Asleep) and thus your computer's offline, and then the game will never update.. and you can stay in 1.0.5 forever.

[Jacke]

3 minutes ago, kithylin said:

Change the time steam updates your games to a time when you're never awake (Asleep) and thus your computer's offline, and then the game will never update.. and you can stay in 1.0.5 forever.

You can also copy the executable directory contents (default location on Windows "C:\Program Files (x86)\Steam\SteamApps\common\Kerbal Space Program" even for the x64 executable) to another folder and have that copy for as long as you want.  I do that to a pristine unmodded download from Steam and then copy it again for modding.

Edited April 20, 2016 by Jacke

[Cydonian Monk]

So I guess we can no longer set "Max Persistent Debris" to Unlimited? That's a bit disappointing. (Or does it work that way if I set the value in the settings.cfg to -1 or something?)

[Znath]

Putting it plainly it's absolutely not.

The vehicle is 10 times worse now.  I can only hope it's a bug and they'll rebuff strengths of landing gear or something later..?

 

Either that or it's quite possible my circumnavigation mission is killed by this update.  I was cresting hills at like 45m/s before and landing hard.

Now I can barely hit the incline of a hill at 20.  With it as bad as it is right now, going the last 10% around the world may take as long as the first 90.

 

[Dooz]

This update was released way to soon, still tons of bugs that I encountered In the prerelease.

Such as the lighting darkening when a heat shield Is inflated and EVA'ed kerbals frequently being attacked by the krakken.

[Dispatcher]

I'm glad I start new games with each update.  Sounds like several people here have invested a lot of time and effort into (what are now) earlier versions of the game; with varying results.  Good luck to those who are continuing their previous saved games.

[Arsonide]

3 hours ago, swjr-swis said:

I think these are the defaults, I never changed them as I was mostly testing other stuff. I honestly have no idea which way and by how much those values have to be changed for better clipping behaviour; I just know those are the values to tinker with.

Those three values are indeed new, and they are percentages of the wheel radius, so if you wanted to set the clip sphere to half (for instance) set the offset to 0.5, which will move the center of the clip sphere down the suspension axis by 0.5 times the wheel radius, plopping it in the middle of the wheel base and the wheel center. Then set the range to 0.5 as well. I also recommend bumping up to the multiplier to 1.1 if you do this, which gives an extra "envelope" of space around the sphere, of 10%.

Know this though, the clipping sphere is the size that it is for a very big reason. Reducing it to half size will not result in "better clipping behaviour". It will allow you to place things closer to wheels without them disabling for your protection, but due to a Unity bug, it will also probably create phantom forces when the vessel unpacks. This is highly dependent on how the vessel is set up though, so there is a chance that if you are careful, you can avoid this.

These settings were added so people could adjust this behavior if they wanted, but there is a very big downside to doing so.

[smjjames]

The whole wheel clipping thing might be confusing people in general though if they don't know what it's all about.

As I've shown though, you can actually break and bypass that by using more than 20 wheels. Though I'll have to see if what I made still work with these settings.

Edited April 20, 2016 by smjjames

[Znath]

Something I've noticed with my test vehicles trying to cope with this patch...

Small landing gear seem to pulse occasionally partially through the ground as they try to follow it.  Even while stationary, the landing gear jitter and the vehicle never 100% stops moving some of the time, even on a gentle 5 degree slope.  This is on a vehicle with more than ample gear to support the weight.  Slowly the vehicle jitters and turns while "stationary" with brakes on full.  Upon "disabling" the suspension, this problem more than doubles.

 

It seems to me this IS a bug.  This involves the landing gear, for some reason, being unable to move properly as a suspension system. 

 

The turn rate is pure insanity I'm not sure if that's related to this, but likely is.

I've also noticed the "wheel stress" thing never shows anything even upon impact.  Sometime it just .. breaks cause "whatever"

The game also annoyingly seems to stutter once in a while... (seems at roughly 50 second intervals)

Edited April 20, 2016 by Znath

[Bosun]

I still cannot download x64 from the store for Windows.  I've been trying for hours, and it'll start, but then immediately say Network Error and stop downloading.  

 

[Terensky]

6 hours ago, ProximaCentauri12 said:

What was the logic in releasing this update when the landing gear and landing legs are still so pathetically broken (amongst a plethora of other bugs that were in the bug tracker and evidently never fixed)?

The heaviest "landing legs" in the game can't even hold up a single metric ton of loading without sinking into the ground.
Unlike the pre-release, there's no way to back out of this broken build and revert to 1.0.5 for the purpose of having a relatively unbroken game.

Arsonide explained somewhere that the landing legs behave as wheels (indeed they are) and this behaviour is to be expected. So it's not considered a bug (as now). So I guess it's also normal, though in my opinion not desiderable, that vessels on landing legs slide on slopes, even if I must admit that in the latest release the legs slide way less than before, usually coming to a stop after a short while. It's still possible though that a kerbal on EVA touching one will be launched in air (I did try with the LT-2 on the Mun, don't know if LT-1 and LT-05 have the same problem). And it's also possible to turn a landed vessel on legs easily using SAS with Q and E key: if I remember correctly this was not easy to do in 1.05.

Edit:

Found the relevant thread:

http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/index.php?/topic/137333-1228-lt-2-landing-strut-on-the-mun/

Edited April 20, 2016 by Terensky