BDArmory ECM and Chaff

[TheDestroyer111]

I have been thinking about what the ECM jammer and chaff pods do in BDArmory, and I made many tests with that, and they don't appear to do anything. That is to say, locking on a craft with a working (enabled) jammer is just as easy as doing so for a craft with no jammer or a disabled one. Firing the chaff also doesn't do anything to enemy radars or AMRAAM/PAC-3 missiles, they still hit me no matter when or how much chaff I deploy. Does anyone know what do the jammer and chaff do, and why they don't seem to do anything other than consuming electric charge/releasing strips of metal?

[Nippie1995]

I dont know if chaff is the same as flare because then it would only work against heat-seeking missiles.

[TheDestroyer111]

Chaff does not work against heat-seekers. In reality, its used to decept radar-guided missiles by creating false radar signals. Chaff does not create much heat so it can't decept heat-seekers. Does anyone know what chaff does in BDArmory?

[TheDestroyer111]

Anyone reply, please?

[boontze]

I think BahamutoD initially said it would, when deployed, have a certain chance to confuse the radar guided missiles (e.g. aim-120) so you could try putting more chaff on your aircraft as he also said the chaff and flare effects stacked. (you'd get more of a chance of dodging a missile with 6 chaff rather than 2)

[Xyphos]

Different targeting systems require different counter measures.
Chaff won't work on heat-seekers, you'll need flares for that.
Likewise, Flares won't work on radar guided systems, use Chaff for that.
Both have a chance of succeeding or failing.

For Laser-Guided systems, IDK about this one, but I'd imagine something simular to Chaff but with a cloud of tiny mirrors.

Edited July 21, 2016 by Xyphos

[linuxgurugamer]

11 minutes ago, Xyphos said:

Different targeting systems require different counter measures.
Chaff won't work on heat-seekers, you'll need flares for that.
Likewise, Flares won't work on radar guided systems, use Chaff for that.
Both have a chance of succeeding or failing.

For Laser-Guided systems, IDK about this one, but I'd imagine something simular to Chaff but with a cloud of tiny mirrors.

Think of Chaff as a cloud of tiny pieces of tinfoil.  Anything which can block light is good for blocking lasers, so Chaff would work.  Also smoke, clouds, etc.

[FungusForge]

IIRC (its been a while since I've had BDA in an install), in the BDA settings config, there's a value for the chance for chaff to trick a missile. As has been mentioned however, chaff will not work on heat-seeking missiles. If you are trying to evade heat seekers, deploy flares, shut down your engines, and turn away. As for evading laser guided things, BDA has a smoke launcher that'll shoot out a lingering puff of smoke; using the smoke to break line of sight should save you from laser guided things. AFAIK, EVE clouds do not break line of sight, but I've never tested this.

 

 

[TheDestroyer111]

Hey, why are you telling me that different CM's are for different types of missile? I already know this, and why do you sound like you think I don't know? Anyway, there is no separate chaff effectiveness stat in BDA settings.cfg (there is something for flares and smoke though). Also, flares appear to have a roughly 100 percent chance of deceiving an AIM-9, while even if i quickly spam out all chaff in a dispenser, AIM-120 missiles always hit. Apparently, the only way to prevent AIM-120 from hitting is destroying the missile while it is still flying towards me (?!), destroying the aircraft launching it before it launches the missile, or breaking radar lock before missile launch. (or get onto a glitch that makes some landed vessels visible but not lock-onnable for radar) Also, does anyone know anything about how ECM jammers work in BDArmory? Enabling the jammer doesn't break radar systems and doesn't make locking target harder at all.

Edited July 27, 2016 by TheDestroyer111

[FungusForge]

Hmm, well after checking (again, I didn't actually have BDA in), I do stand corrected that it is flare chance factor, not chaff chance factor.

 

I've re-installed BDA however and have done testing. It does appear that the flares are noticeably more effective.

 

This link however, although based on reality, may help.

[TheDestroyer111]

On 7/28/2016 at 3:53 AM, FungusForge said:

Hmm, well after checking (again, I didn't actually have BDA in), I do stand corrected that it is flare chance factor, not chaff chance factor.

 

I've re-installed BDA however and have done testing. It does appear that the flares are noticeably more effective.

 

This link however, although based on reality, may help.

These tactics just don't work. Tested in KSP BDArmory and I also disproved the usefulness of this by using my drawing skill on milimeter paper (paper with a one-milimeter-sized grid on it). The higher G-maneuverability of a missile matters more than its turn radius. Also, i need to write it in caps:
WHAT ABOUT THE ECM JAMMER IN BDARMORY?

[FungusForge]

5 hours ago, TheDestroyer111 said:

These tactics just don't work. Tested in KSP BDArmory and I also disproved the usefulness of this by using my drawing skill on milimeter paper (paper with a one-milimeter-sized grid on it). The higher G-maneuverability of a missile matters more than its turn radius. Also, i need to write it in caps:
WHAT ABOUT THE ECM JAMMER IN BDARMORY?

Ok dude, chill out please. I'm trying to help, but I am neither a wizard nor the mod author, so I can't just instantly know the answer to your question.

 

Edit: In fact, somebody is actually looking into maintaining BDArmory, so if you can bear asking nicely, you should probably bring up your concerns with the AIM-120 to them.

Edited July 29, 2016 by FungusForge