Anyone know what this option does?

[TopGull]

I decided to try out the 1.2 prerelease last night by starting a new career game, and it looks like the difficulty options have been expanded quite a bit. While I was digging through them I noticed an inconspicuous toggle button on the advanced options page, in the lower left corner, which said something like "allow upgrading part stats when more advanced parts are researched."  I haven't seen this before, except maybe as a rumor or in the suggestions forum somewhere.  Has anyone else noticed this option?  Any ideas on how it works exactly, and which parts it applies to?

[Red Iron Crown]

A framework for making upgradable parts has been added to the game. Currently it is not implemented for any stock parts.

[Pecan]

19 hours ago, Red Iron Crown said:

A framework for making upgradable parts has been added to the game. Currently it is not implemented for any stock parts.

To explain further - modders (or Squad at some future date) could make it so a 'Reliant' engine, or whatever, cost less, masses less or has better thrust/Isp when you research later, better engines.  It's a realistic model of R&D - old tech is either completely discontinued or becomes cheaper/better itself to remain useful - but 'difficult' in game terms as it will make it very hard to share craft files and designs.

[FullMetalMachinist]

1 hour ago, Pecan said:

but 'difficult' in game terms as it will make it very hard to share craft files and designs.

I don't think it will be. I saw someone say in the 1.2 forum that the upgrade level is stored in the .craft file.

[DerekL1963]

14 hours ago, FullMetalMachinist said:

I don't think it will be. I saw someone say in the 1.2 forum that the upgrade level is stored in the .craft file.

I suspect that he means "difficult" in that if I (who have upgraded parts) send you (who doesn't have upgraded parts) a .craft file, the vehicle will load - but the performance will be different, potentially radically so depending on the nature of the upgrades.   That's a considerable departure from the current model where if it loads, it works identical across saves.

[Rodhern]

3 hours ago, DerekL1963 said:

I suspect that he means "difficult" in that if I (who have upgraded parts) send you (who doesn't have upgraded parts) a .craft file, the vehicle will load - but the performance will be different, potentially radically so depending on the nature of the upgrades.   That's a considerable departure from the current model where if it loads, it works identical across saves.

I read the post from Fullmetalmachinist as if the craft file will say, for instance, a Reliant level 3 part. That way that craft design always uses that particular engine model. The downside is that you would then have to tell in the editor if you want your old design updated. To me it seems reasonable that you have to tell the editor to go ahead and update parts, otherwise the CoM of your craft may shift, and a good rocket become a poor one, just from researching higher level tech.

[DerekL1963]

1 minute ago, Rodhern said:

I read the post from Fullmetalmachinist as if the craft file will say, for instance, a Reliant level 3 part. That way that craft design always uses that particular engine model. The downside is that you would then have to tell in the editor if you want your old design updated. To me it seems reasonable that you have to tell the editor to go ahead and update parts, otherwise the CoM of your craft may shift, and a good rocket become a poor one, just from researching higher level tech.

That presumes that you *can* upgrade - if all you have is Reliant level 2...  you can't upgrade and either you can't load the file, or the system auto downgrades and the craft doesn't work as advertised.  And that makes life more difficult as the complexity of the craft file (from the point of view of users trying to exchange them) goes up exponentially as it's no longer enough to say "my craft uses engine x, and probe core y, and fuel tank z".  Instead you have "engine x, version 1, 2, or 3" and "probe core version 1, or 2" and "fuel tank version 1, 2, 3, or 4".  (We already see that problem occurring because of mods.)

[Rodhern]

1 minute ago, DerekL1963 said:

That presumes that you *can* upgrade - if all you have is Reliant level 2...  you can't upgrade and either you can't load the file, or the system auto downgrades and the craft doesn't work as advertised.  And that makes life more difficult as the complexity of the craft file (from the point of view of users trying to exchange them) goes up exponentially as it's no longer enough to say "my craft uses engine x, and probe core y, and fuel tank z".  Instead you have "engine x, version 1, 2, or 3" and "probe core version 1, or 2" and "fuel tank version 1, 2, 3, or 4".  (We already see that problem occurring because of mods.)

If all I have is "Reliant level 2" won't it just say "locked parts" in the loader? I don't see the difference there, as opposed to any other part I haven't researched yet.

As for the complexity of the craft file; I agree it would make the craft files even more complex (but then indirectly we have a lot more parts if older parts are counted multiple times).

Btw. what do we guess unchecking the box does; always assumes the parts are the basic level parts?

[Hodari]

If anything, the problem wouldn't be when one person has a level 3 upgrade in their mod and the other person doesn't.  The problem would be when one person has a mod that gives a level 3 upgrade, but someone else has a DIFFERENT mod which also gives a level 3 upgrade, but that other mod's level 3 upgrade does something different.  Still, I'm sure there are ways to handle that sort of thing.

[Norcalplanner]

PorkJet has made a mod which uses this for a few of the 1.25m rocket engines.  You can find it here:

If you install the mod, you'll have the option to upgrade certain engines over the course of your career game.  For example, the LV-909 Terrier in my 1.2 prerelease career currently has 80 kN of thrust in vacuum, compared to the stock 60 kN.