Rewarding underwater exploration

[NoobTool]

With the advent of usable hydrodynamics, I think including things like interesting underwater topography (underwater mountain ranges, canyons, maybe even a cave or two), underwater biomes, and maybe underwater Easter eggs in places like Kerbin, Laythe, and Eve would add a new and interesting wrinkle to gameplay. I've recently designed a few submersible vessels that are a lot of fun to skim along the ocean floor. They would be even more fun if there were some more interesting rewards for this type of exploration.

[Wjolcz]

Some people are already unhappy about the amount of spaceplane parts and you want to see underwater exploration? Probably won't happen.

Edited October 14, 2016 by Veeltch

[NoobTool]

39 minutes ago, Veeltch said:

Some people are already unhappy about the amount of spaceplane parts and you want to see underwater exploration? Probably won't happen.

Given that there are multiple real world destinations in our solar system with liquid oceans, and that exploring these environments is likely to be a goal for not-too-distant future exploration missions, I would have difficulty understanding why anyone would be unhappy about adding meaningful exploration of liquid environments in game. It would add new challenges and new rewards.

Love that profile pic btw

Edited October 15, 2016 by NoobTool

[Jonfliesgoats]

Buoyancy in different liquids may hard to do but it could be worthwhile.  I think exploring Titan's lakes or Laythe's  oceans would be pretty cool.

[swjr-swis]

3 hours ago, NoobTool said:

I think including things like interesting underwater topography (underwater mountain ranges, canyons, maybe even a cave or two), underwater biomes, and maybe underwater Easter eggs in places like Kerbin, Laythe, and Eve would add a new and interesting wrinkle to gameplay.

I would agree, but first we need 1) a set of pressure-resistant parts/upgrades in the game that can survive going deeper than 400m, and 2) some rethinking about whatever causes underwater rovers to travel at a maximum breakneck speed of 0.7m/s  at full throttle on a steep downhill.

[NoobTool]

20 minutes ago, swjr-swis said:

I would agree, but first we need 1) a set of pressure-resistant parts/upgrades in the game that can survive going deeper than 400m, and 2) some rethinking about whatever causes underwater rovers to travel at a maximum breakneck speed of 0.7m/s  at full throttle on a steep downhill.

 

1 hour ago, Jonfliesgoats said:

Buoyancy in different liquids may hard to do but it could be worthwhile.  I think exploring Titan's lakes or Laythe's  oceans would be pretty cool.

I think it's entirely possible with current stock parts. I'm not necessarily suggesting adding a bunch of submarine parts. This craft is positively buoyant, so it has to stay moving to stay submerged, but it's quite a bit of fun to pilot under the surface. I'm hoping to get it to Laythe soon, should be a fun mission.

I took it down to -1000m off the coast from KSC.

Eve would be more difficult since jet engines don't work there. A negatively buoyant submersible would likely be more suitable for Eve.

Edited October 15, 2016 by NoobTool

[Jonfliesgoats]

How do jet engines run underwater?  I would like to see electric propellers or other oxidizer systems for non-rocket engines.

cool image, btw!  It reminds me  of an old TinTin book I read as a kid "Red Sea Sharks".

[NoobTool]

15 minutes ago, Jonfliesgoats said:

How do jet engines run underwater?  I would like to see electric propellers or other oxidizer systems for non-rocket engines.

cool image, btw!  It reminds me  of an old TinTin book I read as a kid "Red Sea Sharks".

Right, the jets shouldn't be running underwater, but if I wasn't ready to suspend a bit of scientific correctness for the sake of gameplay, I don't think I would be playing KSP. Using current stock parts keeps things simpler, although I'm not as opposed to more parts as some people are.

[Jonfliesgoats]

I am not knocking it.  I think it's really cool that you have a submarine flying underwater.  There is a lot of science to be done down there, or there should be.

I think it would be cool to have the ability to explore buried oceans on any of our ice moons around Jool like Europa or Enceledus IRL.

[NoobTool]

1 hour ago, Jonfliesgoats said:

I am not knocking it.  I think it's really cool that you have a submarine flying underwater.  There is a lot of science to be done down there, or there should be.

I think it would be cool to have the ability to explore buried oceans on any of our ice moons around Jool like Europa or Enceledus IRL.

Right, I was simply advocating for simplicity. It would be easier to add in the topography etc., than to add in the topography plus a bunch of new parts (I really just want to pilot this thing through a trench on Laythe). Although, I would like to see a stock electrically driven propeller, or maybe even an electric ducted turbofan that would require a certain intake capacity (although not the intake air resource) plus an electric power source to operate. The electric power requirement should be relatively high though, you would want it to be prohibitive (although maybe not impossible) to power it with solar panels / rtg's.

Edited October 15, 2016 by NoobTool

[Jonfliesgoats]

Great ideas!

[NoobTool]

25 minutes ago, Jonfliesgoats said:

Great ideas!

Thanks!

Although, thinking a bit further, I suppose you would need a separate resource for the ducted electric turbofan to keep it from working in space or at insanely high altitudes (intake medium maybe?). But now we're getting away from the whole simplicity idea.

Edited October 15, 2016 by NoobTool

[pandaman]

Personally I would like to see a few 'submarine' parts, but not too many.

A couple of sizes of ballast tanks, electric and/or LF+O propellers (also 'aero' versions for use in non oxygen atmospheres, but that a different argument). Then increase the standard pressure tolerance on some parts, like structural and science type things, and possibly tweakables for some existing parts that increase pressure resistance for increased mass, or a small selection of dedicated high pressure parts.

[Kerbal101]

This.

[Guest]

Well, there was a time when flying subs were a thing...

[SR]

It would be quite simple:

1 allow ore to form underwater and in sea biomes

2 Create a new underwater science Biome with a slightly higher science multiplier than the surface.

[pandaman]

Underwater exploration is a 'thing', we do it here on earth, and there are plans to do it on other bodies too.  So it makes some sense for the game to have stuff to explore underwater, and a few tools to make it possible.

[NoobTool]

It seems that this thread has become focused on submarine parts, which is cool, but wasn't my original intention. Without interesting things to find under the surface, being able to travel under the surface quickly becomes boring. No amount of submarine parts would prevent the novelty of being able to dive under the surface from quickly wearing off if all there is to be found is vast expanses of largely flat nothing. The only reason I would travel to Dres (I have not yet been), would be to bring a rover designed to explore the rather epic canyon that waits there. The same is true of the Mohole on Moho (is this still a thing btw?). Adding interesting topography, landmarks, easter eggs, biomes, etc. under the surface would make going there rewarding. Without these things submarine parts are largely moot, since there would be little reason to use them.

[RocketSquid]

There needs to be ore, easter eggs, and unique science underwater. We also need ballast tanks that can be filled with water or emptied.

[pandaman]

@NoobTool.

I agree with you there.  Stuff to explore and the equipment to do it go hand in hand.

The basic code framework for the exploration tools is here, we just need a few new parts and/or tweaks to existing ones to finish that aspect.

Likewise, adding biomes, ore and anomalies etc to the seabed is adding extra data and detail into the existing planets etc. The code that deals with how it works on game is already in place.

I'm not saying that either of these are 'easy' or quick to do, they obviously will take a lot of work both designing and balancing, but (as far as I inderstand it) the underlying code structure for their functionality is already now in game. 

 

[EpicSpaceTroll139]

This is definitely a good idea. One neat thing is that you can currently make submariplanes. An Aeris 3A can fly underwater even.  Whether we get new parts to do it with or not, it would be awesome if there was stuff underwater to find. Wrecked pirate ships anyone? (Perhaps with evidence of a Kraken attack?)

[NoobTool]

It's good to know that I'm not the only person who would like to see this.

[BT Industries]

22 hours ago, NoobTool said:

It's good to know that I'm not the only person who would like to see this.

No your not!!

I figure it shouldn't be to hard to add some interesting objects at the ocean floor using Kerbal Konstructs.

Say a shipwreck, coral reef and some interesting ruins??? (Kerlantis anyone).

BTW you should check out...

He is adding new water mechanics to the game (pressure and such).

It's still very much WIP.

But he mentions adding some new stock-alike water engines as well!!!

[Kerbonaut905]

On 16.10.2016 at 2:09 AM, Kerbal101 said:

This.

Isn't RoverDude part of Devteam now? So we might see underwater DLC atleast riiight?