[0.24.2] Taverio's Pizza and Aerospace v1.7.1 (22/09)

[bs1110101]

i just did it for you, though you should add the fuel icon that the mk1 has to the stock mk2 and 3

http://www./?xogu3dm8tvgcrj3

yes i know it should say 2 and 3, too lazy to reupload

Btw, can you make pulse jets for your mod and add a .cfg for the falcon 2 http://kerbalspaceprogram.com/0-18-2-falcon-ii-vtol-jetengine/

Edited May 10, 2013 by bs1110101

[rditto48801]

Okay, I am a little confused.

Since upgrading this mod to 1.3.3, I have noticed two things that stick out.

First, one rocket design I rebuilt (using fins with built in control surfaces) seems a little less responsive during ascent (more inclined to 'very slowly' tip over or otherwise less inclined to stay vertical, even despite MechJeb (1.9.8.) trying to keep it pointed up) than one using stock fins with manually attached control surfaces.

I was originally guessing the ones with built in control surfaces don't exert as much 'effective control' as the stock small control surfaces on the stock fins. Although another possible cause for the slow tilting might be related to the main lift stage of the rocket in question not having gimbling engines on the version using fins with built in control surfaces, compared to the more stable one that had a line centerline gimbling engine and stock fins with externally mounted control surfaces. Probably some simple thing I overlooked or didn't somehow notice before, or else not having gimbling engines on the first stage having a greater negative effect over rocket control during initial ascent than I originally thought.

Hard to keep track of what is what when using mod soup...

Hopefully it is just something that requires me to face palm...

Second, when trying to track down a possible cause for an unrelated game crash, I strayed across a lot of the following lines in one of my latest output logs...

farcontrollablesurface NOT FOUND!

Cannot find a Module of typename 'FARControllableSurface'

farwingaerodynamicmodel NOT FOUND!

Cannot find a Module of typename 'FARWingAerodynamicModel'

Are those basically 'harmless' and safe to ignore?

[Assassin_55]

I do find some of these parts very and I mean VERY useful for my shuttle creations I have been doing.

thanks for the parts

[Taverius]

Okay, I am a little confused.

Since upgrading this mod to 1.3.3, I have noticed two things that stick out.

First, one rocket design I rebuilt (using fins with built in control surfaces) seems a little less responsive during ascent (more inclined to 'very slowly' tip over or otherwise less inclined to stay vertical, even despite MechJeb (1.9.8.) trying to keep it pointed up) than one using stock fins with manually attached control surfaces.

I was originally guessing the ones with built in control surfaces don't exert as much 'effective control' as the stock small control surfaces on the stock fins. Although another possible cause for the slow tilting might be related to the main lift stage of the rocket in question not having gimbling engines on the version using fins with built in control surfaces, compared to the more stable one that had a line centerline gimbling engine and stock fins with externally mounted control surfaces. Probably some simple thing I overlooked or didn't somehow notice before, or else not having gimbling engines on the first stage having a greater negative effect over rocket control during initial ascent than I originally thought.

Hard to keep track of what is what when using mod soup...

Hopefully it is just something that requires me to face palm...

The lift values in vanilla are only loosely related to dimensions of the wings in question, so my values, which are derived directly from the dimensions thereof, vary somewhat in mass, lift & drag.

The Delta-Deluxe winglet on your rocket is an outlier, in that nova's original stats give it something like 55% more lift than it should have, so in my mod it has considerably less control authority than default.

On the other hand the stock swept wing gains something like 125% more lift, and its drag drops by 65%, so its not all bad

Yes, yoiu could add gimballing engines ... or use one the larger versions of the Delta-Deluxe, or try one of the all-moving winglets.

Second, when trying to track down a possible cause for an unrelated game crash, I strayed across a lot of the following lines in one of my latest output logs...

farcontrollablesurface NOT FOUND!

Cannot find a Module of typename 'FARControllableSurface'

farwingaerodynamicmodel NOT FOUND!

Cannot find a Module of typename 'FARWingAerodynamicModel'

Are those basically 'harmless' and safe to ignore?

Yup, can be safely ignored. Just the log lines telling you it read a Part definition .cfg and didn't find one of the PartModules called in it.

[taniwha]

Taverius: you tweaked the stock swept wing? Awesome. It was pretty good to begin with, but with 125% more lift (2.25x?) and less drag, it should be even better. I like it for my really small planes, but I was always disappointed with its performance (just getting it much above 10km was difficult, let alone 20km, though I did get one design into orbit).

I really like the the engines (and tweaks). I must have done something right because I have no trouble getting a (smallish) plane using a turbo-fan to ~1100m/s (+/- 30), and turning on the ram jets (without cutting the turbo-fan) gets me going fast enough that cutting the turbo-fan later is no loss. Getting to 2000m/s (orbital) above 40km without using oxidizer is really nice. And that's without spamming the intakes (1 per engine: shock cone for the turbo-fan, ram for the rams).

[Taverius]

Taverius: you tweaked the stock swept wing? Awesome. It was pretty good to begin with, but with 125% more lift (2.25x?) and less drag, it should be even better. I like it for my really small planes, but I was always disappointed with its performance (just getting it much above 10km was difficult, let alone 20km, though I did get one design into orbit).

I really like the the engines (and tweaks). I must have done something right because I have no trouble getting a (smallish) plane using a turbo-fan to ~1100m/s (+/- 30), and turning on the ram jets (without cutting the turbo-fan) gets me going fast enough that cutting the turbo-fan later is no loss. Getting to 2000m/s (orbital) above 40km without using oxidizer is really nice. And that's without spamming the intakes (1 per engine: shock cone for the turbo-fan, ram for the rams).

Well, I didn't really tweak them so much as have a long pm thread with ferram4 until I arrived at some formulas I could use to make the wings have pseudo-realistic values and performance in the stock model.

I just measure them out and plug the numbers into my spreadsheet now

---

In other news, 1.3.4 is out with a few small fixes and a rework of the Basic Jet values.

[taniwha]

Still, I'll have to give my stock swept-wing planes a go with your changes.

[B787_300]

So is this 0.20 compatible yet or are you waiting for FAR to update?

[Taverius]

0.20 compatibility is coming.

It won't work with FAR until FAR itself works with 0.20, mind.

Edit: 1.3.5 is out. Since overriding of values with the new db system is broken, I'm still overwriting the stock files for now.

Edited May 23, 2013 by Taverius

[B787_300]

db is Database?

[Taverius]

Yus. Hopefully it'll work in 0.20.1

[Taverius]

1.4 is out with stuff that was previously in pack I'd made with DYJ - a UAV core and some very small jets - yet another refinement of the wing stats, and a couple of other things.

[Photonically]

Love the new tapered wings Looks like the attach node on the small radial intake is bugged now - it floats a little way off whatever you place it on.

[Taverius]

Ah! If forgot scale = 1. I'll check all the parts tomorrow and post an update

[White Owl]

I was playing around with cfg files, and found something fun with your resized landing gear. Change one line to:

MODULE
{
    name = ModuleLandingGear
    startingState = RETRACTED
}

Now the gear will start in the retracted position. Great for shuttle-style vertical launches, piggy-back launches, etc. For some reason the change doesn't work on the vanilla small gear bay, but it works just fine for all your resized gear bays.

[CannonMan]

Where did all the fuselages go for this release? There is only drone stuff. Although I do like the drone stuff. Cheers!

[Taverius]

I was playing around with cfg files, and found something fun with your resized landing gear. Change one line to:

MODULE
{
    name = ModuleLandingGear
    startingState = RETRACTED
}

Now the gear will start in the retracted position. Great for shuttle-style vertical launches, piggy-back launches, etc. For some reason the change doesn't work on the vanilla small gear bay, but it works just fine for all your resized gear bays.

Neat! I'm not gonna change that in the pack though, that will have to wait for Tweakables, whenever that is. No idea why it wouldn't work for the default size one.

Where did all the fuselages go for this release? There is only drone stuff. Although I do like the drone stuff. Cheers!

Its all there, but because of the broken features in 0.20's database system I can't make them sort right after the stock parts until that's all fixed. You'll find them at the end of the Propulsion and Structural tabs.

Well, I could, but I would have to add the models to the Squad directories, and I don't want to do that. That should all be fixed/possible in 0.20.1, hopefully.

---

In other news, 1.4.1 is out. Small update, just fixing the small airscoop attach node and and rebasing the extra files for TouhouTorpedo's updated Mk4 and Mk3 packs.

[KareemOWheat]

Edit: Delete me!

Edited May 29, 2013 by KareemOWheat

[Brun]

First off, just installed this mod and I'm loving the new parts. That said, I'm not seeing the rescaled Landing gear (plus a few other parts like the tailplanes), which were a huge reason why I picked this mod up in the first place. Am I missing something? I looked at your part.cfg and I see them there but they don't show up in the SPH.

[smunisto]

Hey, Tav, can you tell us if the mod is compatible with the new 0.20.2 patch? Do we just download the mod again and overwrite the updated squad parts again?

[Mekan1k]

Yeah- it is compatible. I have been playing with it for more than a day, and it checks out so far.

(Yes, I know I am not Tav. But I use most part mods, save Kethane [for now], so I think I can confidently say this mod is fine. Very few mods broke on the 0.20 to 0.20.2 conversion Just load your game without mods, start the default laccount, then exit out, copy the gamedata, internals, parts, plugins, plugindata, resources, saves, and ships into the ksp_win folder, turn on KSP again, then play.)

[Mekan1k]

Things missing in the pack- small aerospikes, small turbojets, and small jet engines. I know they were in the 0.19.1 release, but not in the more recent ones.

Tavarius, could you go check this?

[taniwha]

Mekan1k: they're there. Did you, by any chance, use the legacy Parts directory?

[Mekan1k]

Nope. I used the most recent update.

[Taverius]

You might have not installed right, or maybe you're using the ModuleManager version of FAR? I'm not sure what happens if you do that, since I setup the rescales of the default parts in the same file as the originals.

I never did have small aerospikes, though I can see why they might be useful. I'll add them for the next version.