Problem with editor placement tool?

[SpacePaper]

Help, I'm trying to place structural panels using mirror symmetry across the entire vessel, but it only allows me to do this for its parent part.

It looks like this. Shouldn't there be a button under it saying "Parent" or "Vessel"? 

Thanks.

 

[Rocket In My Pocket]

Hey, welcome to the forums!

There is a hotkey to switch between parent or vessel mode, but I'll be darned if I can remember it off the top of my head.

Check the settings menu for it.

[Dark Lion]

I'm pretty sure F toggles part/vessel symmetry while in part placement mode, but I've never understood it's function exactly, because I've never seen it actually change anything. Thus, I don't really use it. 

[SpacePaper]

The keyboard shortcut (F) doesn't seem to be working either.  The Parent/Vessel option seems to only work with radial symmetry, and it doesn't seem to be doing anything. 

[Kerbinchaser]

Always wondered about this. Hmmm. 

[Spricigo]

On 11/02/2018 at 6:58 PM, SpacePaper said:

Help, I'm trying to place structural panels using mirror symmetry across the entire vessel, but it only allows me to do this for its parent part.

You can't. 

But you can do is to make a "cell" and place it multiple times. If you are in PC hold ALT while clicking a part to copy it (and it's child parts).

[Dark Lion]

On 2/13/2018 at 6:13 AM, Spricigo said:

But you can do is to make a "cell" and place it multiple times. If you are in PC hold ALT while clicking a part to copy it (and it's child parts).

That's been my solution too, but I've had that little trick invoke the radial-only kraken on the craft I was building...

[Spricigo]

@Dark Lion may you explain the "radial-only kraken"? I'm completely lost in this one.

 

[SpacePaper]

I've already done that, but it simply doesn't allow for placement across the "cell" and its placement.

I never expected this thread to get this much attention. 

[HvP]

The larger part you are trying to attach your small plates to is not on the center of axis. The root part you lay down first defines the center of axis, and the other parts will get mirrored to either side of that.

But I assume you put down two large plates first, then attached two more on one side of those. KSP sees this arrangement as:

* One large plate as root part; one large plate attached along the center-line behind it; one large plate attached radially to each of those in the center, but only on the left side; no plates mirrored on the right side of the center-line.

In other words, KSP treats your first column of large plates as the center line. So KSP can't mirror your smaller plates because as far as it understands there is nothing to attach them to on the other side.

As an experiment, try this. Place down a long I-beam first as your root part. Now attach the large plates to the side of that in mirror symmetry. You can now attach your small plates to the edges of the large plates in mirror symmetry because it will all be mirrored around the I-beam along the center line.

Edited February 15, 2018 by HvP

[SpacePaper]

10 hours ago, HvP said:

The larger part you are trying to attach your small plates to is not on the center of axis. The root part you lay down first defines the center of axis, and the other parts will get mirrored to either side of that.

But I assume you put down two large plates first, then attached two more on one side of those. KSP sees this arrangement as:

* One large plate as root part; one large plate attached along the center-line behind it; one large plate attached radially to each of those in the center, but only on the left side; no plates mirrored on the right side of the center-line.

In other words, KSP treats your first column of large plates as the center line. So KSP can't mirror your smaller plates because as far as it understands there is nothing to attach them to on the other side.

As an experiment, try this. Place down a long I-beam first as your root part. Now attach the large plates to the side of that in mirror symmetry. You can now attach your small plates to the edges of the large plates in mirror symmetry because it will all be mirrored around the I-beam along the center line.

Thanks! So that's how you fix it... 

[Dark Lion]

22 hours ago, Spricigo said:

@Dark Lion may you explain the "radial-only kraken"? I'm completely lost in this one.

I'm sure it's not called that exactly, but I'm fairly confident most KSP-ers have run into the problem while editing as well, especially those of us which build large or aesthetically. I'm also not 100% sure about how to reproduce the bug in question, as it seems to be rather random to me still. I digress. The "radial-only" kraken I refer to is the dreadful moment in which you realize the editor will no longer allow you the use of mirror symmetry on your vessel, regardless of the pre-existing usages. Even an attempt to hover over those already mirrored parts shows oddly radial pattern of placement in which one of the twin parts might even float above the desired attachment point or otherwise throw off your CoM due to the game recognizing the wrong mirror axis for the craft.

If you're still completely lost, the OP's pic shows an example of the latter instance I describe [wrong mirror axis.]

In my experience, copying part groups to mirror across the vessel *which have already use mirrored parts within the group you've copied* seems to be the catalyst to sorta "locking" the editor into a radial-only use of symmetry.

[Spricigo]

Thank you for the explanation, Dark Lion. Got it now.

Personally, never stumbled upon that one, probably a combination of building mostly small, with few part and with EditorExtensions.