[1.5.0 <-> 1.8.1] Kerbalism v3.2

[Doffeh]

I have run into a bit of an annoyance with Kerbalism. In the VAB / editor kerbalism GUI that shows estimations for durations of various resources, I am seeing estimates for electrical charge with active transmitting costs. It did not initially show this, and it's mostly a mild annoyance, but surely there is a way to toggle this off? (See https://i.imgur.com/Kt5YF69.jpg if it is unclear what I am refering to) Obviously this is the GUI only, so it's just a small problem, but surely there is a toggle on/off somewhere, but where's it? I was told (on IRC) there should be (and used to be) a button somewhere to toggle it, but I don't see it, not on pods or antennas or anything.

[lordcirth]

27 minutes ago, Doffeh said:

I have run into a bit of an annoyance with Kerbalism. In the VAB / editor kerbalism GUI that shows estimations for durations of various resources, I am seeing estimates for electrical charge with active transmitting costs. It did not initially show this, and it's mostly a mild annoyance, but surely there is a way to toggle this off? (See https://i.imgur.com/Kt5YF69.jpg if it is unclear what I am refering to) Obviously this is the GUI only, so it's just a small problem, but surely there is a toggle on/off somewhere, but where's it? I was told (on IRC) there should be (and used to be) a button somewhere to toggle it, but I don't see it, not on pods or antennas or anything.

The button is "Simulate in Planner" Yes/No in the right-click menu of the antenna, if I recall correctly.  Perhaps with the Signal system being removed in 1.5, this has changed?

[Doffeh]

6 minutes ago, lordcirth said:

The button is "Simulate in Planner" Yes/No in the right-click menu of the antenna, if I recall correctly.  Perhaps with the Signal system being removed in 1.5, this has changed?

Don't think I ever saw this button, in the previous version or 1.5, (https://i.imgur.com/UiL24Ig.jpg), it didn't become a problem before it started to simulate it, which I am not sure when it began doing. It may have been when I updated to 1.5. Has anyone seen this button lately?

[Scotskerb]

Is it possible you could edit the way magnetospheres and solar panels work to make them compatible with multiple stars?

[PiezPiedPy]

@Doffeh The simulate button was removed with Signals, I think it needs to be added back in IMO, maybe in the planner.

[dylsh]

I am trying to complete the contract, put a kerbal into orbit for 30 days. The craft never loses power, yet I have a problem with CO2 levels rising to the point that my kerbal dies. Is anyone else having this problem? If it helps, I am using a mk1 Command Pod as my spacecraft.

[N70]

20 hours ago, Scotskerb said:

Is it possible you could edit the way magnetospheres and solar panels work to make them compatible with multiple stars?

I tried, and asked a good lot of the Kopernicus devs... no offense to any of em, but only like one or two understood what "solar flux" was

[Scotskerb]

9 minutes ago, N70 said:

I tried, and asked a good lot of the Kopernicus devs... no offense to any of em, but only like one or two understood what "solar flux" was

Ah

[lordcirth]

31 minutes ago, dylsh said:

I am trying to complete the contract, put a kerbal into orbit for 30 days. The craft never loses power, yet I have a problem with CO2 levels rising to the point that my kerbal dies. Is anyone else having this problem? If it helps, I am using a mk1 Command Pod as my spacecraft.

Does the pod have a Scrubber?  Is it turned on?  It should be by default.

[dylsh]

53 minutes ago, lordcirth said:

Does the pod have a Scrubber?  Is it turned on?  It should be by default.

Yes it does. And yes the scrubber is on. It seems to happen when it’s happening in bachground processing. When I return to the craft, the scrubbers work to get rid of the co2..  but despite co2 levels dropping (albeit very slow) the kerbal also dies of co2 poisoning first. 

 

[Gordon Dry]

20 minutes ago, dylsh said:

but despite co2 levels dropping (albeit very slow) the kerbal also dies of co2 poisoning first

I also had that problem some time ago, the scrubber is too slow if the CO2 level is higher than a couple of percent.

@N70 how about an "emergency scrubber mode" which is 5x faster but uses 10x EC and can be triggered by auto mode when CO2 level is getting higher than 5% ?

[lordcirth]

23 minutes ago, dylsh said:

Yes it does. And yes the scrubber is on. It seems to happen when it’s happening in bachground processing. When I return to the craft, the scrubbers work to get rid of the co2..  but despite co2 levels dropping (albeit very slow) the kerbal also dies of co2 poisoning first. 

 

Ok so you have a background processing problem.  Read KSP.log; it usually spams nullrefs that point to the problem, eg Nertea's Dynamic Battery Storage has occasionally caused conflicts.

[dylsh]

1 minute ago, Gordon Dry said:

I also had that problem some time ago, the scrubber is too slow if the CO2 level is higher than a couple of percent.

@N70 how about an "emergency scrubber mode" which is 5x faster but uses 10x EC and can be triggered by auto mode when CO2 level is getting higher than 5% ?

Thank you for the response. I’m glad to see I’m not alone here. I felt like I was going crazy trying to figure this out. Hopefully it is resolved. The mod enhances the game tremendously, but it’s tough to push my manned missions forward without being irresponsible with kerbal lives. 

[lordcirth]

2 minutes ago, Gordon Dry said:

I also had that problem some time ago, the scrubber is too slow if the CO2 level is higher than a couple of percent.

@N70 how about an "emergency scrubber mode" which is 5x faster but uses 10x EC and can be triggered by auto mode when CO2 level is getting higher than 5% ?

Actually venting atmosphere to replace it with fresh air would make more sense as an emergency option.  You would rapidly consume nitrogen and oxygen.

[dylsh]

3 minutes ago, lordcirth said:

Ok so you have a background processing problem.  Read KSP.log; it usually spams nullrefs that point to the problem, eg Nertea's Dynamic Battery Storage has occasionally caused conflicts.

Thank you for the explanation. To sound like a complete newb, how do I look through KSP.log? 

[theJesuit]

2 hours ago, N70 said:

I tried, and asked a good lot of the Kopernicus devs... no offense to any of em, but only like one or two understood what "solar flux" was

Could it be set up to track the same way that solar panels work using kopernicus to operate off their local star?

[Someone2018]

7 hours ago, dylsh said:

Yes it does. And yes the scrubber is on. It seems to happen when it’s happening in bachground processing. When I return to the craft, the scrubbers work to get rid of the co2..  but despite co2 levels dropping (albeit very slow) the kerbal also dies of co2 poisoning first. 

 

Another possibility that a minor inaccuracy in background simulation at high speeds is causing the difference in CO2 processing, although to be more sure, ask @N70. Have you actually dimension-ed your scrubber capacity to cover your needs? (preferably with a margin)

[Someone2018]

Does anyone know why in the last post-1.5.1 version of Kerbalism the Stockalike Station Parts eXpansion redux offers a greenhouses that perform much better than the default kerbalism one? Despite size and weight being comparable? If anything, the kerbalism one which feeds about one person is already performing better than real life prototypes.

[lordcirth]

21 hours ago, dylsh said:

Thank you for the explanation. To sound like a complete newb, how do I look through KSP.log? 

KSP.log should be in the main KSP folder.  Skip to near the end and look for errors.  If you have trouble reading it, pastebin it at, eg, https://bpaste.net/ and link it for us.

[theJesuit]

7 minutes ago, Someone2018 said:

Does anyone know why in the last post-1.5.1 version of Kerbalism the Stockalike Station Parts eXpansion redux offers a greenhouses that perform much better than the default kerbalism one? Despite size and weight being comparable? If anything, the kerbalism one which feeds about one person is already performing better than real life prototypes.

Coding.

That's just the way the balance was established.  What do you see needs adjusting?

Peace.

[evilman222]

On 5/7/2018 at 9:32 AM, PiezPiedPy said:

@evilman222 Not quite MKS yet but support for USI Reactors, Kontainers and FTT is now included with Kerbalism, you can try with the latest Jenkins build before the release comes out.

If you try it can you let me know what you think

https://jenkins.spaceball.cf/job/Kerbalism/138/artifact/Kerbalism.zip

Awesome, thanks. I'll give it a try as soon as I figure out which of my unholy number of mods broke my 1.4.3 install

[mikegarrison]

My kerbals do not seem to be eating or drinking anything no matter how long they are in space. Is there some configuration for this that might not be set?

[Someone2018]

11 hours ago, theJesuit said:

Coding.

That's just the way the balance was established.  What do you see needs adjusting?

Peace.

I understand coding, but there was no reason included in the pull request  

https://www.degruyter.com/downloadpdf/j/opag.2017.2.issue-1/opag-2017-0011/opag-2017-0011.pdf <-- this one mentions a much bigger structure, which when inflated is approximately 10 meters high and 23 meters in diameter, and produces food for around 6 people. In terms of volume that is between 2000 and 4000 m3.

Another reference is this: https://www.ag.arizona.edu/lunargreenhouse/MidReviews.htm

One presentation from there states the design target of 50% of food needs of one person using a 2.1 meter by 5.5 meter (volume 20.9 m3) tube shaped structure: https://www.ag.arizona.edu/lunargreenhouse/Documents/2012-07-20_01_Giacomelli.pdf

The kerbalism structure is approximately 5 meters long, with a diameter of 2.5 meters. So that's close the last example. So strictly speaking that part is already pretty overpowered, because it produces 150% of food needs of one person.

The Station redux parts are massively overpowered now (at 300% and 450% food production for one person), I haven't seen any indication that humans are anywhere near that kind of food level production in such a small structure.

And the 3.75m module isn't even bigger than the 2.5m one, so why does it perform again even better?

I can code up another balance pass no problem, and include oxygen production of plants as well. But I wanted to at least discuss out in the open to prevent pull request "war".

30 minutes ago, mikegarrison said:

My kerbals do not seem to be eating or drinking anything no matter how long they are in space. Is there some configuration for this that might not be set?

This processing is done in the background if I remember correctly, have you gone to the tracking center for a while to see if they consume food and water?

Edited May 10, 2018 by Someone2018

[mikegarrison]

5 hours ago, Someone2018 said:

This processing is done in the background if I remember correctly, have you gone to the tracking center for a while to see if they consume food and water?

I have warped for 10s of days at the spacecenter. No consumption of food or water. Oxygen is consumed. I am using many mods, including Near Future, but not including any other life support mod.

My log contains many of these:

KERBALISM.vessel_resources resources, Double elapsed_s)
    KERBALISM.Kerbalism.FixedUpdate ()
[EXC 23:50:31.202] NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object
 

Edited May 10, 2018 by mikegarrison

[lordcirth]

18 minutes ago, mikegarrison said:

I have warped for 10s of days at the spacecenter. No consumption of food or water. Oxygen is consumed. I am using many mods, including Near Future, but not including any other life support mod.

My log contains many of these:

KERBALISM.vessel_resources resources, Double elapsed_s)
    KERBALISM.Kerbalism.FixedUpdate ()
[EXC 23:50:31.202] NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object
 

Did Near Future pull in Nertea's DynamicBatteryStorage mod?  That has conflicted in the past.