KEA(R) Airliner Size/Speed/Range War

[Andetch]

4 minutes ago, Kebab Kerman said:

Are you using the rudders? If you are, don't. Roll over and use pitch instead.

No, I turn with a roll, usually around 45 degree angle, and keep the nose up with the rudder while yanking it round with the pitch control.

[Kebab Kerman]

3 minutes ago, Andetch said:

No, I turn with a roll, usually around 45 degree angle, and keep the nose up with the rudder while yanking it round with the pitch control.

Ah, good. For a second there I thought you didn't have any sense! Seriously though, who in their right mind ACTUALLY uses the rudders?

EDIT: If you want to use Steam screenshots, open the screenshot and click "Copy link" and then paste it into the reply or post. Worked for me, so it should work too. I'm adding this because Imgur is blocked at my school, where I currently am.

Edited March 26, 2018 by Kebab Kerman

[neistridlar]

15 minutes ago, Kebab Kerman said:

who in their right mind ACTUALLY uses the rudders?

 

I do . But only to maintain coordinated flight, and as a make shift air break. For anyone that might not know, the proper way to turn would be to use roll to control the G-force. Use the rudders to keep the nose aligned with the pro grade marker side to side, and pitch to keep the pro grade marker on the horizon. 

[Kebab Kerman]

24 minutes ago, neistridlar said:

I do . But only to maintain coordinated flight, and as a make shift air break. For anyone that might not know, the proper way to turn would be to use roll to control the G-force. Use the rudders to keep the nose aligned with the pro grade marker side to side, and pitch to keep the pro grade marker on the horizon. 

Eh... I usually just use roll and pitch. Come to think of it, why have I been putting control surfaces on my rudders if I don't use them?

[neistridlar]

1 minute ago, Kebab Kerman said:

Eh... I usually just use roll and pitch. Come to think of it, why have I been putting control surfaces on my rudders if I don't use them?

My stingy 24 and stingy 32 for the KEA thread does not have rudders to save money. If you have strong enough yaw stability, and a bit of dihedral you really can get away without them.

[Kebab Kerman]

19 minutes ago, neistridlar said:

My stingy 24 and stingy 32 for the KEA thread does not have rudders to save money. If you have strong enough yaw stability, and a bit of dihedral you really can get away without them.

OR if it's a flying wing. I've built massive ones wider than the SPH, and really it's not that hard. Well, if you're using SXT, of course. Has those large wings everybody loves!

EDIT: Quick, somebody make an OS that only runs KSP! Open the computer, login, and BOOM! There's the launcher! Take KSP anywhere you go! Also, I'll be building the computer for it in a few weeks, with 24gb 12gb ram and 512gb storage JUST FOR KERBAL SPACE PROGRAM!

EDIT #2: Okay, three harddrives. We need three harddrives because they can die easily. Seriously though, somebody get on it please! It's basically the ultimate KSP mod!

EDIT #3: Kinda random, but who else thinks Matt Lowne should try the

And try the near-impossible mode?

Edited March 26, 2018 by Kebab Kerman
Alright, now lets get back to the size war.

[Andetch]

42 minutes ago, neistridlar said:

My stingy 24 and stingy 32 for the KEA thread does not have rudders to save money. If you have strong enough yaw stability, and a bit of dihedral you really can get away without them.

The reason you need yaw control in a bank is to counter the natural tendency for the nose to point down slightly... Probably due to drag and gravity?

With my (or anyone else's) smaller, more responsive planes (Night Fury) you can bank at 90 degrees, and use pitch to pull the plane round the corner then yaw control to put the nose up or down! So you can corkscrew.

Also, yaw is essential for recovering a flatspin. 

[neistridlar]

22 minutes ago, Andetch said:

The reason you need yaw control in a bank is to counter the natural tendency for the nose to point down slightly... Probably due to drag and gravity?

With my (or anyone else's) smaller, more responsive planes (Night Fury) you can bank at 90 degrees, and use pitch to pull the plane round the corner then yaw control to put the nose up or down! So you can corkscrew.

Also, yaw is essential for recovering a flatspin. 

Forgot about flat spins, yaw certainly tend to help with getting out of those. I find many of my aircraft actually pull the nose up in a turn if I don't use rudder, it all depends on the aerodynamics. With the method I described though, you are still pulling the aircraft around the turn with the elevators. The rudder is used only to prevent side slipping, which is aerodynamically inefficient, and uncomfortable for the pilot/passengers. If you max out the pitch, and can not maintain altitude, you should be rolling in stead of yawing to maintain altitude. It is entirely possible to get very close to 90 degrees of bank and still maintain altitude if you have high TWR though.

Edited March 26, 2018 by neistridlar

[Andetch]

2 minutes ago, neistridlar said:

Forgot about flat spins, yaw certainly tend to help with getting out of those. I find many of my aircraft actually pull the nose up in a turn if I don't use rudder, it all depends on the aerodynamics. With the method I described though, you are pulling the aircraft around the turn with the elevators. The rudder is used only to prevent side slipping, which is aerodynamically inefficient, and uncomfortable for the pilot/passengers. If you max out the pitch, and can not maintain altitude, you should be rolling in stead of yawing to maintain altitude. It is entirely possible to get very close to 90 degrees of bank and still maintain altitude if you have high TWR though.

Yes, I understand that you pull it round on the elevators. I know how to fly

[Kebab Kerman]

3 minutes ago, neistridlar said:

Forgot about flat spins, yaw certainly tend to help with getting out of those. I find many of my aircraft actually pull the nose up in a turn if I don't use rudder, it all depends on the aerodynamics. With the method I described though, you are pulling the aircraft around the turn with the elevators. The rudder is used only to prevent side slipping, which is aerodynamically inefficient, and uncomfortable for the pilot/passengers. If you max out the pitch, and can not maintain altitude, you should be rolling in stead of yawing to maintain altitude. It is entirely possible to get very close to 90 degrees of bank and still maintain altitude if you have high TWR though.

That makes sense.

[neistridlar]

5 minutes ago, Andetch said:

Yes, I understand that you pull it round on the elevators. I know how to fly

Ops, missed a still in that sentence, I was not trying to imply you did not know that, after all you already stated that. I was just trying to clarify, as it seemed you might have misunderstood the nuances of my statement. Anyways, I am probably the only person in the world that cares about coordinated flight in KSP. In real life though it is very important.

[Andetch]

Lol, no worries man.... It's good to care

[Kebab Kerman]

I'm building a new version of this:

It will have two more levels, one above the highest cabins in the image and a fifth below the lowest cabins in this image. And maybe even more at the back, which brings the grand passenger total to 4,752 PASSENGERS! And with possible central cabins being added it raises to 7,632 PASSENGERS! Beat this and you are god of planes! Seriously though, I am adding two more levels and central compartments, making it, at widest, a quintuple-aisle jet!

[RedPandaz]

1 hour ago, Kebab Kerman said:

I'm building a new version of this:

It will have two more levels, one above the highest cabins in the image and a fifth below the lowest cabins in this image. And maybe even more at the back, which brings the grand passenger total to 4,752 PASSENGERS! And with possible central cabins being added it raises to 7,632 PASSENGERS! Beat this and you are god of planes! Seriously though, I am adding two more levels and central compartments, making it, at widest, a quintuple-aisle jet!

Challenge Accepted

[Kebab Kerman]

Alright, I got up to 6,744 passengers. Screenshot!

[neistridlar]

20 minutes ago, Kebab Kerman said:

Alright, I got up to 6,744 passengers. Screenshot!

And exactly how are you going to make that not explode the moment the wheels hit the runway?

[Kebab Kerman]

3 minutes ago, neistridlar said:

And exactly how are you going to make that not explode the moment the wheels hit the runway?

MAHJICK!

 

Also known as Editor Extensions Redux.

[Andetch]

Yeah, I am never going to be able to compete with stock parts and no resize style mods....

I am pretty much at the limits of what I can do with out "MAHJICK"

3 hours ago, Kebab Kerman said:

MAHJICK!

 

Also known as Editor Extensions Redux.

 

[Kebab Kerman]

Update: It kills my game.

[Kebab Kerman]

I will put a download link for the plane I built and see if you can run it. Mods: SXT, AirplanePlus (for 1.3.1,) and Tweakscale. Built in 1.2.2. For some reason, the military wants some. I can't think of why other than to execute kerbals. I wouldn't want to pay 4,000,000,000 just to crash a plane.

 

EDIT: Who else agrees with this? 

 

Edited March 27, 2018 by Kebab Kerman

[Andetch]

Okay, now there is a speed war, in goes my other large* plane - crusing at 1,400 m/s and seating 170ish - however it is restricted due to altitude limitations on the other thread, maybe going a bit higher i can go a lot faster

Check the kerbalx for images as I can't find the imgur links - https://kerbalx.com/Andetch/The-X-Series-Night-Fury

*large meaning tiny for this thread

Edited March 28, 2018 by Andetch

[Kebab Kerman]

19 hours ago, Andetch said:

Okay, now there is a speed war, in goes my other large* plane - crusing at 1,400 m/s and seating 170ish - however it is restricted due to altitude limitations on the other thread, maybe going a bit higher i can go a lot faster

Check the kerbalx for images as I can't find the imgur links - https://kerbalx.com/Andetch/The-X-Series-Night-Fury

*large meaning tiny for this thread

The supersonic plane I made for the Express Airlines challenge went mach 4.2

Or 1,440m/s-1,475m/s

And that wasn't it's max speed, it ran out of fuel in under 2 minutes and 15 seconds. It's fixed now, it should have more fuel now.

EDIT: It's also only 25 tons. It's small.

EDIT #2: I got it to go MACH 4.65!

Edited March 29, 2018 by Kebab Kerman

[Andetch]

Well getting to a max speed then running out of fuel isn't exactly hard....... sustained hypersonic cruise is harder, especially low down at 15km

[neistridlar]

I have a supersonic plane that is almost ready for release in the KEA Thread. It I not a jumbo, but it can circumnavigate kerbing at ~1650m/s, without burning up. Might post a preview here first, just to set the standard.

[Kebab Kerman]

10 hours ago, neistridlar said:

I have a supersonic plane that is almost ready for release in the KEA Thread. It I not a jumbo, but it can circumnavigate kerbing at ~1650m/s, without burning up. Might post a preview here first, just to set the standard.

Congrats, thats mach 4.81!