[WIP] (1.9.1 - 1.12+) TrekDrive - a Star Trek-like Warp Drive by ShadowWorks v0.99.1w NX-Class (10/08/2021)

[Puggonaut]

Decided to resize the spacedock from 1 to 0.6 , best part the lights in dock actually work and now they shine onto the ship itself which they didn't in the larger version .

 

[Melfice]

On 8/6/2021 at 6:20 PM, TheShadow1138 said:

Kerbal-style parts weren't in my plans.  When I set out to do this, my plan was to make Star Trek ships with which to use the warp drive, but there is at leas one other person, I believe, that would like more stock-alike parts.  For the time being, they are not in my plans.  Maybe, and I stress maybe, I'll consider stock-alike parts after the NCC-1701 is completed (that means in-game, released, with IVA), but I make no promises, guarantees, or assurances.

Consider that at least two other persons now!I know this is a tall request and more in the order of daydreaming than an actual request, but a modular stock-alike, Trek-inspired parts would be an amazing gift, and genuinely something I'd be willing to donate for.

A Voyager-like stern(saucer), with a Defiant-like aft(saucer), on top of an Enterprise-D-like hull and nacelles? Why, that would look... positively hideous, but it'd be a player's own designed ship, and that would be rad.

[TheShadow1138]

7 hours ago, Puggonaut said:

Decided to resize the spacedock from 1 to 0.6 , best part the lights in dock actually work and now they shine onto the ship itself which they didn't in the larger version .

 

That's just too perfect.  If this is still available for download somewhere (Spacedock, GitHub) I'd post a link to it in a heartbeat.

 

14 hours ago, Samuelleach2001 said:

Hey Great work man! I myself am a massive Trekkie! I've loved Star Trek ever since i was a little kid. I was wondering if you are going to recreate the Star Trek ships from the outdated SciFi Shipyards mod and the Star Trek Shuttles mod? If you can that will be wholesome buddy!

 

 

The NCC-1701 is next on the list, though it will not be that TOS show-accurate version.  It will be a design influenced by various incarnations of the 1701.  It will be closer to the DISCO version of the Enterprise, but not exactly.  My goal with it is to essentially make a version of the Enterprise so that the film-era refit is more of a refit than a complete rebuild.  The saucer and engineering hull will have profiles that more closely resemble the film-era refit while the nacelles will be a bit more original, taking some cues from the nacelles of the NX-class.

I will be making a Galileo-type shuttle to go with the 1701, though it might get a bit of a facelift, not sure yet.  I'm also thinking about doing the Travel Pod from TMP as it could be used even with the NX.

As for the Constellation-class, or Intrepid-class I haven't given much thought to them.  it took about 5 months to do the NX and Shuttlepod, and I imagine it may take at least that much time, maybe more to do the 1701, shuttlecraft, and travel pod.  It might be possible, but I haven't looked into it, that I might be able to write ModuleManager patches to add TrekDrive compatibility to some of these ships/shuttles.  I'd have to look at the parts though.

3 hours ago, Melfice said:

Consider that at least two other persons now!I know this is a tall request and more in the order of daydreaming than an actual request, but a modular stock-alike, Trek-inspired parts would be an amazing gift, and genuinely something I'd be willing to donate for.

A Voyager-like stern(saucer), with a Defiant-like aft(saucer), on top of an Enterprise-D-like hull and nacelles? Why, that would look... positively hideous, but it'd be a player's own designed ship, and that would be rad.

I just want to make sure I understand what you're saying.  You're asking for parts so that you could Frankenstein a ship from components of other Star Trek ships, correct?  Basically, that's what I'm doing.  I'm not making monolithic single-piece ships, they will be separated into Bridge, Saucer, Engineering hull, Neck (for those that have a distinct "neck" connecting the saucer and engineering hull, so an Intrepid- or Sovereign-class would not have separate "necks"), Nacelle Pylons, Nacelles, and separate Impulse engine modules if warranted.  So, if I'm understanding what you want correctly, it would just require a uniform texture scheme so that say the darker gray of an Intrepid-class doesn't clash with the lighter gray of a Galaxy-class.  If that's the case, it could be fairly simple for me to set a generic base color for the hulls.

Also, I'm trying to picture what you described and am having a bit of trouble.  The stern of Voyager is the aft portion of the ship, the saucer would be towards the bow, so what I'm picturing is the aft portion of the Defiant slapped onto the back of the Voyager's saucer, sitting on top of a Galaxy-class engineering hull as you described.  It would certainly be an interesting look.

[Puggonaut]

32 minutes ago, TheShadow1138 said:

That's just too perfect.  If this is still available for download somewhere (Spacedock, GitHub) I'd post a link to it in a heartbeat.

 

The NCC-1701 is next on the list, though it will not be that TOS show-accurate version.  It will be a design influenced by various incarnations of the 1701.  It will be closer to the DISCO version of the Enterprise, but not exactly.  My goal with it is to essentially make a version of the Enterprise so that the film-era refit is more of a refit than a complete rebuild.  The saucer and engineering hull will have profiles that more closely resemble the film-era refit while the nacelles will be a bit more original, taking some cues from the nacelles of the NX-class.

I will be making a Galileo-type shuttle to go with the 1701, though it might get a bit of a facelift, not sure yet.  I'm also thinking about doing the Travel Pod from TMP as it could be used even with the NX.

As for the Constellation-class, or Intrepid-class I haven't given much thought to them.  it took about 5 months to do the NX and Shuttlepod, and I imagine it may take at least that much time, maybe more to do the 1701, shuttlecraft, and travel pod.  It might be possible, but I haven't looked into it, that I might be able to write ModuleManager patches to add TrekDrive compatibility to some of these ships/shuttles.  I'd have to look at the parts though.

I just want to make sure I understand what you're saying.  You're asking for parts so that you could Frankenstein a ship from components of other Star Trek ships, correct?  Basically, that's what I'm doing.  I'm not making monolithic single-piece ships, they will be separated into Bridge, Saucer, Engineering hull, Neck (for those that have a distinct "neck" connecting the saucer and engineering hull, so an Intrepid- or Sovereign-class would not have separate "necks"), Nacelle Pylons, Nacelles, and separate Impulse engine modules if warranted.  So, if I'm understanding what you want correctly, it would just require a uniform texture scheme so that say the darker gray of an Intrepid-class doesn't clash with the lighter gray of a Galaxy-class.  If that's the case, it could be fairly simple for me to set a generic base color for the hulls.

Also, I'm trying to picture what you described and am having a bit of trouble.  The stern of Voyager is the aft portion of the ship, the saucer would be towards the bow, so what I'm picturing is the aft portion of the Defiant slapped onto the back of the Voyager's saucer, sitting on top of a Galaxy-class engineering hull as you described.  It would certainly be an interesting look.

https://spacedock.info/mod/1815/USS Nimitz and Drydock

[TheShadow1138]

1 hour ago, Puggonaut said:

https://spacedock.info/mod/1815/USS Nimitz and Drydock

Thanks!  I've added it to the OP.  I'll probably make a ModuleManager patch to remove the GNDrive requirement and convert it to my impulse drive with Deuterium and Antimatter tanks for refueling operations.

[Puggonaut]

I'd also reccomend resizing it via it's cfg to either 0.6 or 0.65 as it's way to big for a NX Class , well unless you wish to park two of them in it

One Question Docking Ports ? are they required to be installed via another part of actually built in the mod itself , the reason I ask is I tried to dock the Shuttlepod to the ship and had slight difficulty finding someone to park it lmao .

[TheShadow1138]

3 minutes ago, Puggonaut said:

I'd also reccomend resizing it via it's cfg to either 0.6 or 0.65 as it's way to big for a NX Class , well unless you wish to park two of them in it

One Question Docking Ports ? are they required to be installed via another part of actually built in the mod itself , the reason I ask is I tried to dock the Shuttlepod to the ship and had slight difficulty finding someone to park it lmao .

I placed a note with the link that a rescaleFactor of 0.6 is a good size for the NX.  When I make the MM patch I can make that edit as well, so that others don't have to worry about changing it themselves.

The docking ports are built into the ship.  There are three external docking ports on the saucer (port, starboard, and aft), one on the engineering section (aft), five on the refit engineering hull (2 port, 2 starboard, 1 aft).  Finally there are two internal docking areas where you can park the shuttles.  There is an "Open Bay Doors" button in the sea of buttons on the saucer.  This opens the aft bay doors, not the show accurate ventral doors.  Then you can fly the shuttlepod into the bay, pretty far into the bay along the three yellow lines on the bay floor until the docking action begins.  I would also recommend turning off SAS once the shuttlepod starts showing signs that the docking is beginning, that is if you have SAS on at the time.  I hope that helps you to get it docked.  Also, any "size1" docking port will dock to the ports, so the stock Clamp-O-Tron will work, if you or anyone wants to dock something besides the shuttlepod to the NX.

[Melfice]

18 hours ago, TheShadow1138 said:

I just want to make sure I understand what you're saying.  You're asking for parts so that you could Frankenstein a ship from components of other Star Trek ships, correct?  Basically, that's what I'm doing.  I'm not making monolithic single-piece ships, they will be separated into Bridge, Saucer, Engineering hull, Neck (for those that have a distinct "neck" connecting the saucer and engineering hull, so an Intrepid- or Sovereign-class would not have separate "necks"), Nacelle Pylons, Nacelles, and separate Impulse engine modules if warranted.  So, if I'm understanding what you want correctly, it would just require a uniform texture scheme so that say the darker gray of an Intrepid-class doesn't clash with the lighter gray of a Galaxy-class.  If that's the case, it could be fairly simple for me to set a generic base color for the hulls.

Also, I'm trying to picture what you described and am having a bit of trouble.  The stern of Voyager is the aft portion of the ship, the saucer would be towards the bow, so what I'm picturing is the aft portion of the Defiant slapped onto the back of the Voyager's saucer, sitting on top of a Galaxy-class engineering hull as you described.  It would certainly be an interesting look.

My greatest shame revealed. 
I'm a dirty landlubber who can't tell his afts from his sterns or his bows.

But, yes. You got the gist of it.
In an ideal world, somebody would make parts that are still recognizable as the ships that inspired them, but are generic enough in shape that they could be mixed and matched.

So, indeed, an Intrepid-Defiant-Galaxy class Frankenstein that still looks coherent enough.
To avoid it looking like you slapped a stock Mk2 cockpit on a 1.25m fuel tank, if that helps you visualise it better.

Again, I want to stress, this is more daydreaming than an actual hope, wish, or request. The ships you've made thus far look great, and a more Kerbal-sized model would already be a lovely thing IF you ever get round to that.

Edited August 10, 2021 by Melfice

[Puggonaut]

18 hours ago, TheShadow1138 said:

I placed a note with the link that a rescaleFactor of 0.6 is a good size for the NX.  When I make the MM patch I can make that edit as well, so that others don't have to worry about changing it themselves.

The docking ports are built into the ship.  There are three external docking ports on the saucer (port, starboard, and aft), one on the engineering section (aft), five on the refit engineering hull (2 port, 2 starboard, 1 aft).  Finally there are two internal docking areas where you can park the shuttles.  There is an "Open Bay Doors" button in the sea of buttons on the saucer.  This opens the aft bay doors, not the show accurate ventral doors.  Then you can fly the shuttlepod into the bay, pretty far into the bay along the three yellow lines on the bay floor until the docking action begins.  I would also recommend turning off SAS once the shuttlepod starts showing signs that the docking is beginning, that is if you have SAS on at the time.  I hope that helps you to get it docked.  Also, any "size1" docking port will dock to the ports, so the stock Clamp-O-Tron will work, if you or anyone wants to dock something besides the shuttlepod to the NX.

Aha , ok so I mananged to launch the NX Shuttlepod from Kerbin and dock it inside the shuttle bay on the ship after asking " Hal Kermin " to open the bay doors .

The RCS on the Shuttlepod is a bit severe , had to tone down the thrust on it ,  as pressing the transition to move upwards or downwards dips or raises the nose of the craft , balance seems to be a bit off . apart from that it got there to it's destination .

Could also explain why the impluse engines  only offer " Take Off or Landing " I was wondering why there isn't a option to switch to I dunno foward or something neutral ?

[TheShadow1138]

16 hours ago, Melfice said:

My greatest shame revealed. 
I'm a dirty landlubber who can't tell his afts from his sterns or his bows.

But, yes. You got the gist of it.
In an ideal world, somebody would make parts that are still recognizable as the ships that inspired them, but are generic enough in shape that they could be mixed and matched.

So, indeed, an Intrepid-Defiant-Galaxy class Frankenstein that still looks coherent enough.
To avoid it looking like you slapped a stock Mk2 cockpit on a 1.25m fuel tank, if that helps you visualise it better.

Again, I want to stress, this is more daydreaming than an actual hope, wish, or request. The ships you've made thus far look great, and a more Kerbal-sized model would already be a lovely thing IF you ever get round to that.

No worries, it took me a while to get it straight.

I understand.  What do you mean by "Kerbal-sized", the Phoenix and NX-class are both scaled down to Kerbal-scale.  Do you mean like 1.25, 2.5, 3.75m parts?

4 hours ago, Puggonaut said:

Aha , ok so I mananged to launch the NX Shuttlepod from Kerbin and dock it inside the shuttle bay on the ship after asking " Hal Kermin " to open the bay doors .

The RCS on the Shuttlepod is a bit severe , had to tone down the thrust on it ,  as pressing the transition to move upwards or downwards dips or raises the nose of the craft , balance seems to be a bit off . apart from that it got there to it's destination .

Could also explain why the impluse engines  only offer " Take Off or Landing " I was wondering why there isn't a option to switch to I dunno foward or something neutral ?

Hopefully you didn't have to remove his memory modules, or listen to his singing afterward.

Yeah, a lot of the RCS and mass numbers are placeholders.  I've also thought about offsetting the COM of the shuttlepod fuselage so that the RCS is more balanced.  Actually, if you look at the configs the NX isn't that massive because I haven't messed with those numbers yet either.

I've actually been thinking about the ability to reverse under impulse power.  I hand't thought about it until a recent Star Trek film marathon when the Enterprise reverses in the Mutara Nebula at the end of TWOK, or at the end of Nemesis.  It was actually really easy to get done.  So...

TrekDrive v0.99.1w

v0.99.1w - Spacedock
* Added a ModuleManager patch for StinkyAce's Spacedock, available at this link:
https://spacedock.info/mod/1815/USS Nimitz and Drydock
The patch scales the dock down to 0.6, a near perfect fit for the NX-class, and instead of modifying the drydock that comes with StinkyAce's mod, it creates a new part with the aforementioned scale, an impulse engine (no part, just the module), and produces the resources used by TrekDrive ships.  This will be a good refueling station for the NX.

* Updated the plugin
    * Fixed an NRE spam in the impulse engine code while in the editor
    * Added the ability to select a "forward" or "reverse" mode for the impulse engines.  Toggleable in the PAW, and can be set as an action group.

* Cleaned up the Waterfall patch by splitting the warp effects into their own patch.
* Tweaked the texture tiling on the NX warp effects (both the Warp 5 and Warp 7 versions).

[Melfice]

I'm sure every person you'd ask has a different idea of what Kerbal-sized means.

Personally, I think that if you were to make a cutaway schematic, the ships should be large enough that it would comfortably fit 3 or 4 Kerbals in the saucer section. That is to say, the entire saucer is the cockpit/bridge. If I remember I will try to mock something up in Paint later today.
I think that would make for fun-scaled ships.

But I appreciate that there may be a lot more folk who want far larger ships to play with.

EDIT:
BEHOLD! My poor MS Paint mockup!

I realize this is slowly starting to become a hijack. So, expect this to be the last I'll mention of my dream mod. Thanks for humoring me.

Edited August 11, 2021 by Melfice

[Puggonaut]

In case anyone wishes to use Textures Unlimited for this wonderful Mod , here is my cfg

..................................................................................................................................................................................................

@REFLECTION_CONFIG[default]
{
    %enabled = true
}
KSP_MODEL_SHADER
{
    name = FullMetal
                model = TrekDrive/Parts/ENTShuttlepod/ENTShuttlepodImpEngine
                model = TrekDrive/Parts/NXClass/NXClassBridge
                model = TrekDrive/Parts/NXClass/NXClassEngineering
                model = TrekDrive/Parts/NXClass/NXClassEngineeringRefit
                model = TrekDrive/Parts/NXClass/NXClassMainImpulsePort
                model = TrekDrive/Parts/NXClass/NXClassMainImpulseStbd
                model = TrekDrive/Parts/NXClass/NXClassPortNacelle
                model = TrekDrive/Parts/NXClass/NXClassStbdNacelle
                model = TrekDrive/Parts/NXClass/NXClassNacellePylonsFour
                model = TrekDrive/Parts/NXClass/NXClassNavDeflector01
                model = TrekDrive/Parts/NXClass/NXClassRefitPortNacelle
                model = TrekDrive/Parts/NXClass/NXClassRefitStbdNacelle
                model = TrekDrive/Parts/NXClass/NXClassSaucer
                model = TrekDrive/Parts/NXClass/NXClassSecImpulsePort
                model = TrekDrive/Parts/NXClass/NXClassSecImpulseStbd
               
                
        MATERIAL
    {
        shader = SSTU/PBR/Metallic
        
        inheritTexture = _MainTex
        inheritTexture = _BumpMap
        inheritTexture = _Emissive
        excludeMesh = Size3EngineCluster
                excludeMesh = Saucer_AftNameplate
                excludeMesh = Saucer_MainRegistry
                excludeMesh = Saucer_VentralRegistry_Port
                excludeMesh = Saucer_VentralRegistry_Stbd
                excludeMesh = RefitEngHull_AftNameplate
                excludeMesh = Warp7Nacelle_Registry_Port
                excludeMesh = Warp7Nacelle_Registry_Stbd

        PROPERTY
        {
            name = _Metal
            float = 0.70
        }
        PROPERTY
        {
            name = _Smoothness
            float = 0.75
        }
        PROPERTY
        {
            name = _Detail
            float = 0.85
        }
        PROPERTY
        {
            name = _Shininess
            float = 0.85
        }
    }        
}
KSP_MODEL_SHADER
{    
         name = LessMetal

                model=TrekDrive/Parts/ENTShuttlepod/ENTShuttlepod
        
    MATERIAL
    {
        shader = SSTU/PBR/Metallic
        
        inheritTexture = _MainTex
        inheritTexture = _BumpMap
        inheritTexture = _Emissive

        
        PROPERTY
        {
            name = _Metal
            float = 0.15
        }
        PROPERTY
        {
            name = _Smoothness
            float = 0.65
        }
        PROPERTY
        {
            name = _Detail
            float = 0.75
        }
        PROPERTY
        {
            name = _Shininess
            float = 0.85
        }
    }
    
}

.......................................................................................................................................................................................

Copy between the dotted lines into notepad and save it as a .CFG file then drop it into you GameData folder .

[Puggonaut]

12 hours ago, TheShadow1138 said:

Yeah, a lot of the RCS and mass numbers are placeholders.  I've also thought about offsetting the COM of the shuttlepod fuselage so that the RCS is more balanced.  Actually, if you look at the configs the NX isn't that massive because I haven't messed with those numbers yet either.

I've actually been thinking about the ability to reverse under impulse power.  I hand't thought about it until a recent Star Trek film marathon when the Enterprise reverses in the Mutara Nebula at the end of TWOK, or at the end of Nemesis.  It was actually really easy to get done.  So...

TrekDrive v0.99.1w

v0.99.1w - Spacedock
* Added a ModuleManager patch for StinkyAce's Spacedock, available at this link:
https://spacedock.info/mod/1815/USS Nimitz and Drydock
The patch scales the dock down to 0.6, a near perfect fit for the NX-class, and instead of modifying the drydock that comes with StinkyAce's mod, it creates a new part with the aforementioned scale, an impulse engine (no part, just the module), and produces the resources used by TrekDrive ships.  This will be a good refueling station for the NX.

* Updated the plugin
    * Fixed an NRE spam in the impulse engine code while in the editor
    * Added the ability to select a "forward" or "reverse" mode for the impulse engines.  Toggleable in the PAW, and can be set as an action group.

* Cleaned up the Waterfall patch by splitting the warp effects into their own patch.
* Tweaked the texture tiling on the NX warp effects (both the Warp 5 and Warp 7 versions).

Ok cool forward and reverse is great , but would it be possible to have a 3rd option as in OFF MODE or Neutral MODE .

Was trying to dock the NX in Orbit with the Spacedock and it's erm intersting to say the least , figure if everything else bar the rcs is off , then I can play with the various RCS settings and find the balance point for up down left right , e.t.c easier .

I've built loads of VTOL's in KSP that Transition to forward flight  and also helped out a few people regarding balance points and C.O.G .

Put around 30 + Hours into playing with the NX and so far it's very impressive , yeah I know it's WIP , just offering thought's and that's all .

Edited August 11, 2021 by Puggonaut

[TheShadow1138]

8 hours ago, Melfice said:

I'm sure every person you'd ask has a different idea of what Kerbal-sized means.

Personally, I think that if you were to make a cutaway schematic, the ships should be large enough that it would comfortably fit 3 or 4 Kerbals in the saucer section. That is to say, the entire saucer is the cockpit/bridge. If I remember I will try to mock something up in Paint later today.
I think that would make for fun-scaled ships.

But I appreciate that there may be a lot more folk who want far larger ships to play with.

EDIT:
BEHOLD! My poor MS Paint mockup!

I realize this is slowly starting to become a hijack. So, expect this to be the last I'll mention of my dream mod. Thanks for humoring me.

I see what you mean.  It's something to keep in mind.

5 hours ago, Puggonaut said:

Ok cool forward and reverse is great , but would it be possible to have a 3rd option as in OFF MODE or Neutral MODE .

Was trying to dock the NX in Orbit with the Spacedock and it's erm intersting to say the least , figure if everything else bar the rcs is off , then I can play with the various RCS settings and find the balance point for up down left right , e.t.c easier .

I've built loads of VTOL's in KSP that Transition to forward flight  and also helped out a few people regarding balance points and C.O.G .

Put around 30 + Hours into playing with the NX and so far it's very impressive , yeah I know it's WIP , just offering thought's and that's all .

There kind of is a neutral mode.  The takeoff/landing only works when the vessel is sub-orbital, landed, or splashed.  So, once in orbit there is no vertical (takeoff/landing) thrust being applied to the vessel by the impulse engine(s) at all, and if you are throttled all the way down to 0% the impulse drive is also applying no thrust to the vessel.  So, if you're throttled all the way down in orbit then the RCS should be the only thing causing thrust.  Also, if you shutdown the impulse engines there definitely will be no forces applied by them.

I welcome any help getting things balanced.  I should probably get the masses of the parts set before we really get into RCS balancing.  The RCS on the NX is definitely more interesting to deal with than the shuttlepod, balance-wise that is to say.  That's probably the source of the troubles/weirdness while trying to dock to the spacedock.

[Puggonaut]

31 minutes ago, TheShadow1138 said:

I see what you mean.  It's something to keep in mind.

There kind of is a neutral mode.  The takeoff/landing only works when the vessel is sub-orbital, landed, or splashed.  So, once in orbit there is no vertical (takeoff/landing) thrust being applied to the vessel by the impulse engine(s) at all, and if you are throttled all the way down to 0% the impulse drive is also applying no thrust to the vessel.  So, if you're throttled all the way down in orbit then the RCS should be the only thing causing thrust.  Also, if you shutdown the impulse engines there definitely will be no forces applied by them.

I welcome any help getting things balanced.  I should probably get the masses of the parts set before we really get into RCS balancing.  The RCS on the NX is definitely more interesting to deal with than the shuttlepod, balance-wise that is to say.  That's probably the source of the troubles/weirdness while trying to dock to the spacedock.

The issue with the NX is it simply is running out of "Pitch" as it climbs through the atmosphere , the slider ends up at the bottom of the scale and then the tail drops , i'm currently messing with the C.O.G and have added internal cannards to help with the Pitch , will keep you updated .

Thanks for the information about the Takeoff/Landing thrust , that's one less thing to look at lmao . Well for me at least .

Edited August 11, 2021 by Puggonaut

[Miss Atomic2512]

Hi, I've just downloaded the mod and I'm finding difficult piloting the suttlepods. They do not work as I had thought, in my head I thought they would work the same as planes. is there a way to better understand how to use the suttlepods? 

 

 

[Puggonaut]

Cannards : This simple idea adds about 35/40% more pitch control , wierd how KSP works huh

Anyhow did two test flights , both got to Orbit , hmmm ok.............but it took a average of 25 mins .

But lets put this all into context the NX series wasn't designed to be flown in Atmosphere in the first place , so all this trial and error is just that .

It is fun to do it though , yes it's difficult , fun though

 

Edited August 11, 2021 by Puggonaut

[TheShadow1138]

2 hours ago, Puggonaut said:

The issue with the NX is it simply is running out of "Pitch" as it climbs through the atmosphere , the slider ends up at the bottom of the scale and then the tail drops , i'm currently messing with the C.O.G and have added internal cannards to help with the Pitch , will keep you updated .

Thanks for the information about the Takeoff/Landing thrust , that's one less thing to look at lmao . Well for me at least .

 

40 minutes ago, Puggonaut said:

Cannards : This simple idea adds about 35/40% more pitch control , wierd how KSP works huh

Anyhow did two test flights , both got to Orbit , hmmm ok.............but it took a average of 25 mins .

But lets put this all into context the NX series wasn't designed to be flown in Atmosphere in the first place , so all this trial and error is just that .

It is fun to do it though , yes it's difficult , fun though

 

Yeah atmospheric flight is tricky.  I think you're right that the RCS doesn't have enough thrust to counter the drag caused by the nacelles.  I do believe the the nacelles are what's causing the aft end to drop because if you use the "B" variant where the nacelles are ventrally mounted you'll see the opposite behavior where the tail rises.  The "C" variant with the four nacelles may negate some of this issue since the drag forces will be more-or-less balanced.  As you said it wasn't designed for atmospheric flight, although we did see it in-atmosphere in the season 4 premier episode.  It might be possible to change the "hoverAlt" parameter in the configs to a higher altitude where the atmosphere is less dense, and change the "maxVerticalAccel" to be higher so that it would gently rise to that altitude faster.  This might mitigate some of the issues with the pitch authority for the rest of the flight to orbit.  So, it would rise vertically to 30k m or higher, and then it might be easier to throttle up the impulse engines to get the rest of the way to orbit.

1 hour ago, Miss Atomic2512 said:

Hi, I've just downloaded the mod and I'm finding difficult piloting the suttlepods. They do not work as I had thought, in my head I thought they would work the same as planes. is there a way to better understand how to use the suttlepods? 

The shuttlepod can be tricky to fly in-atmosphere.  The SAS and RCS are your friends and being careful with your throttle.  It isn't a good idea to go full throttle as it can become quite difficult to control even with the SAS and RCS turned on.  I didn't make any part of the shuttlepod a lifting surface, but thinking about it, if I actually try making the wings lifting surfaces, it might improve the flight characteristics some.

The impulse engine has a "Takeoff" and "Landing" mode that handles vertical thrust when the ship/shuttlepod is in a sub-orbital, landed, or splashed situation.  In "Takeoff" mode thrust is applied vertically upward (normal to the gravitational force) along the center-of-mass (COM) that will cause the ship/shuttlepod to lift upwards to a "hover altitude", it doesn't really hover at that altitude, which is defined in the part CFG for the engine.  Increasing the throttle will apply thrust through the COM pushing the ship/shuttlepod forward.  There is now an option to switch this to thrusting in reverse.  The toggle is visible in the PAW and can be set as an action group, just like the takeoff/landing mode switch.  In "Landing" mode the pod will slow itself down to 5m/s of vertical speed (the speed indicator on the NavBall may show a higher speed, but it shows total speed, vertical and lateral, so that can be a way to indicate that you are not moving straight downward.  The pod/ship, however, will not start slowing itself down until it reaches or is below its hover altitude, but it will apply more force the higher the vertical speed to slow it down quickly, but there could still be a possibility of hitting the ground too fast.  I'm not saying that it will crash, I just want you to be aware that if the pod is falling at 1000 m/s when it starts to slow down, it may not make a safe landing.

The shuttlepod and NX are still WIP and practically no balancing has been done.  So, right now in-atmosphere flight should be handled with a gentle touch.  I hope that helps some, but if not I'm happy to answer any other questions.

[Puggonaut]

11 hours ago, TheShadow1138 said:

 

Yeah atmospheric flight is tricky.  I think you're right that the RCS doesn't have enough thrust to counter the drag caused by the nacelles.  I do believe the the nacelles are what's causing the aft end to drop because if you use the "B" variant where the nacelles are ventrally mounted you'll see the opposite behavior where the tail rises.  The "C" variant with the four nacelles may negate some of this issue since the drag forces will be more-or-less balanced.  As you said it wasn't designed for atmospheric flight, although we did see it in-atmosphere in the season 4 premier episode.  It might be possible to change the "hoverAlt" parameter in the configs to a higher altitude where the atmosphere is less dense, and change the "maxVerticalAccel" to be higher so that it would gently rise to that altitude faster.  This might mitigate some of the issues with the pitch authority for the rest of the flight to orbit.  So, it would rise vertically to 30k m or higher, and then it might be easier to throttle up the impulse engines to get the rest of the way to orbit.

The shuttlepod and NX are still WIP and practically no balancing has been done.  So, right now in-atmosphere flight should be handled with a gentle touch.  I hope that helps some, but if not I'm happy to answer any other questions.

MaxVerticalAccel and the HoverAlt , made a huge difference . Removed the Cannards and still got to orbit .

So  question the original settings had one set of engines at HoverAlt 1000 and the other set at 2000 ?

Ok the other one is Reaction wheel Authority , if you say put a  stock rocket into orbit , you used say a Mk1-3pod a fuel tank , engine and rcs . once in orbit if you turn off the rcs you still have yaw pitch and roll authority using the keyboard keys as per normal .

With the NX this isn't possible , is that simply down to the Reaction wheel ?

 

[Puggonaut]

SetUp

.......................

SWNXClassBridge
 
name = ModuleReactionWheel
    PitchTorgue = 50
    YawTorque = 50
    RollTorque = 30

...........................

SWNXClassMainImpulsePort

maxVerticalAccel = 1.5
hoverAlt = 30000

..........................

SWNXClassSecImpulsePort

maxVerticalAccel = 1.5
hoverAlt = 27000

.........................

FLIGHT

.........................

IMPORTANT PART :

The ship is very throttle sensative .

Set the throttle to position 1 of 15 , hit the spacebar allow the ship to cruise to a altitude 30,000 .

When you have reached 30,000 set to Prograde .

After that gradually increase the throttle , no need to go mad , just gradually.

Time to Orbit is approx 30 mins altitude is between 75/80,000  circularised .

.........................

Alternative Take Off mode as in the video .

Add the Extra Large Undercarriage , set the springs and rebound to max .

Action Keys : Make sure you have set a Action key for the Hover Mode , press once to set all 4 impulse engines to landing mode .

Apply full throttle .

Hit the spacebar , as soon your airbourne , cut the throttle to 1 of 15 , action key to set hover mode to from Landing Mode to Take Off .

After that follow the above guide .

.......................

ReFit NX

Well ok you can't use a undercarriage , so leave the hover mode left as take off , apply 1 of 15 throttle , and take off .

Flys very similar to the standard NX . The added refit hull actually makes the pitch control easier due to the added weight , so that alters the C.O.G favourbly .

.......................

Warranty None given , if you kill your Kerbals it's not my fault ok .

......................

p:s when flying in Atmosphere , keep an eye out for Stuka's with Lazer Cannon's

Edited August 12, 2021 by Puggonaut
Spelling slways spelling , as usual .

[TheShadow1138]

9 hours ago, Puggonaut said:

MaxVerticalAccel and the HoverAlt , made a huge difference . Removed the Cannards and still got to orbit .

So  question the original settings had one set of engines at HoverAlt 1000 and the other set at 2000 ?

Ok the other one is Reaction wheel Authority , if you say put a  stock rocket into orbit , you used say a Mk1-3pod a fuel tank , engine and rcs . once in orbit if you turn off the rcs you still have yaw pitch and roll authority using the keyboard keys as per normal .

With the NX this isn't possible , is that simply down to the Reaction wheel ?

 

That's great.  I wasn't thinking, but part of the issue was probably that once it was getting to or above its hover altitude there was very little keeping it in the air other than horizontal velocity so the higher hover altitude maintained vertical thrust long enough to  attain sufficient horizontal velocity to maintain flight without adverse effects from drag.

The difference in the hoverAlt settings were done because one set is a secondary, so I just set them to have lower stats.  I tended to set my test craft to not stage the secondary impulse engines, but it might be better to at least have their hover settings the same just incase.

Yeah, I didn't even mess with the reaction wheel settings.  it's actually hold-over numbers from my Orion capsule, so in a way it's like an Orion capsule is trying to move an NX-class starship.  I mean, from a realism standpoint, the reaction wheels necessary to rotate a ship of this size would probably be quite large and unnecessary.  That being said, those numbers you used in your other post worked well it seems, and I can certainly see the utility of just using reaction wheels in some cases.  I'll make sure to set these numbers to make them useful once I finalize the mass of the NX.

Edited August 12, 2021 by TheShadow1138

[Puggonaut]

14 hours ago, TheShadow1138 said:

That's great.  I wasn't thinking, but part of the issue was probably that once it was getting to or above its hover altitude there was very little keeping it in the air other than horizontal velocity so the higher hover altitude maintained vertical thrust long enough to  attain sufficient horizontal velocity to maintain flight without adverse effects from drag.

The difference in the hoverAlt settings were done because one set is a secondary, so I just set them to have lower stats.  I tended to set my test craft to not stage the secondary impulse engines, but it might be better to at lest have their hover settings the same just incase.

Yeah, I didn't even mess with the reaction wheel settings.  it's actually hold-over numbers from my Orion capsule, so in a way it's like an Orion capsule is trying to move an NX-class starship.  I mean, from a realism standpoint, the reaction wheels necessary to rotate a ship of this size would probably be quite large and unnecessary.  That being said, those numbers you used in your other post worked well it seems, and I can certainly see the utility of just using reaction wheels in some cases.  I'll make sure to set these numbers to make them useful once I finalize the mass of the NX.

Cool glad it was helpful , put me on the list in about 5 months when you want the 1701 tested lol .

Edited August 13, 2021 by Puggonaut
Spelling slways spelling , as usual .

[Puggonaut]

Free Thrust ?

Throttle is set to Zero

I dunno maybe it's meant to do that .

 

[Puggonaut]

But i had to try this idea , using MagicSmokeIndustries for the robotics , I came up with this idea .

I'll go an hide now .

 

[TheShadow1138]

8 hours ago, Puggonaut said:

Free Thrust ?

Throttle is set to Zero

I dunno maybe it's meant to do that .

 

When in landing mode, and the vessel is sub-orbital, once it's at or below its hoverAlt, vertical thrust is applied to slow the vessel down to 5m/s of vertical speed.  This is done regardless of throttle setting, so yeah pretty much free thrust, but the same is true with the takeoff mode.  Did you use the warp drive to get to the moon, or just the impulse drive?  Right now with the warp drive the NX would be the best choice to get you there in under a second.

6 hours ago, Puggonaut said:

But i had to try this idea , using MagicSmokeIndustries for the robotics , I came up with this idea .

I'll go an hide now .

 

That's neat!  If people want to do that with their NX, I'm all for it.