Maneuver Node Usability

[RabidSmurf]

Maneuver nodes need serious work to be more usable especially when using them at interplanetary scale. It was bad in KSP1 but usable, it's worse in KSP2 which is sad.

1. Trying to plan planetary transfers is way too frustrating. Perhaps a picture-in-picture mode of some kind where you could see the planet and orbit where your maneuver node is created at (while also zoomed way out on the map). Maybe even allow you to open multiple picture-in-picture movable windows of different bodies to see the orbital situation and results form maneuver node editing. This would allow you to fine adjust to location of the maneuver around the planet you're currently orbiting and watch it's effect in the grand scale when planning transfers to duna and beyond.
2.  Ability to create maneuver nodes on the orbit line inside the SOI of the body you are travelling to when not yet inside that SOI, allows for planning orbital insertion burn before you enter SOI. This was a basic feature in KSP1.
3. Many bugs with consecutive nodes need to be resolved for the ability to plan complicated gravity assists.
4. Text boxes like the AP/PE that can be pinned need to be draggable so i can move them out of the way, they often get in the way of the maneuver node.
5. Ship icons are too big and get in the way of setting target on planetary bodies, often opening a details window that can't be closed when you click on them.
6. The + and - buttons to move the maneuver node by entire orbits into the future. Useful for transferring to moons, or seeing how gravity assists might work out if you plan the maneuver later/earlier. Also a basic ksp1 feature so it's a regression since it's missing from ksp2.
7. Hotkeys to fine tune each of the directions.
8.  Get rid of restrictions on maneuver node editing due to delta-v calcs (no fuel, or not enough delta v), a warning is fine but let me create it anyway. The deltav calc is too buggy currently, many cases where it thinks i have no fuel or not enough when i actually do, also maybe I am just trying to plan something out.
9. Burn calculator is still totally out to lunch a lot of the time,  or maybe it's the countdown timing, i am not sure. There should be a toggle for "Time to maneuver node" so I can do it the old fashioned way.

Lets have some discussion about how else the maneuver nodes can be improved.

[Sea_Kerman]

Definitely a way to edit a maneuver node even when you're not looking at it

[DasWiesel]

After the great improvements with the science update, the poor design of the maneuver nodes is my greatest frustration with the game.

I think basically what we need is something like the maneuver planer on the bottom left in ksp1. Where you could set the increment by which any click would increase the delta v in that direction. 

This should include clickable buttons to move the position of the maneuver node back and forth on the orbit AND to move it in time to the next period.

We also need to see the period and inclination of the current orbit and for the maneuver. Not just  current Ap, Pe. Especially the period is important to build relay networks.

This would restore the functionality which we had in KSP1.

This could be further improved with a picture in picture view of the object that is selected as target. And the ability to switch Ap, Pe etc. between "to body's surface" and "to body's center".

[yijian huang]

In real world, maneuver is calculated by computers on the ground well ahead of the flight.

So I suggest the game provides a tool to generate maneuver nodes automatically by the trip plan, as is done in KSP1.

[ri00t]

Testing KSP2 now and I feel one think is weird. Yeah.. I use already maneuver Node Mod otherwise is so annoying. But my point is I try to plan a new burn in Periapsis of Minmus when I have not yet reached Minmus Gravity. Feels even more confusing and annoying to add new node.

Cannot zoom in close enough to Minmus, cannot rotate to visual see how the orbit will look like. - Solved by double click at Minmus. But mention it here anyway. 

Creating multiple manouver chain is basically not that possible. Even when I have planed  simple burn exactly at PE cannot make the orbit look circular. Do not know what I am doing wrong! I have to refresh the KSP1 and see how it is working there.

Situation is different and more easy when I am already at the Minmus gravity.

My suggestion here is first able to make maneuver nod directly at new gravity influence celestial body.  Visual duplicate or move to target body.  Now is impossible without mod to plan that manuver and keep zoom in to celestial body we try to setup  direct Low Orbit insertion.

Great work with the update! Love game for Parts organization, better visual and music. But I am kind of nerd that want more tiny popup windows with configure percise data. Can it will be also added as a Science research to not make new players too overwhelmed?

[Marko_R]

1. Even when the node is placed on the trajectory within another body's SOI, the directional adjustments for that node are wrong, they do not use the gravity matrix of the target body.  Therefore have to actually get to SOI before adding any local maneuvering nodes.

2. No way to switch to the next node when there are multiple nodes on the trajectory.

3. No way to delete only a single node, always deletes ALL - using trashcan icon on the panel and on the node itself.

[kdaviper]

17 hours ago, ri00t said:

Testing KSP2 now and I feel one think is weird. Yeah.. I use already maneuver Node Mod otherwise is so annoying. But my point is I try to plan a new burn in Periapsis of Minmus when I have not yet reached Minmus Gravity. Feels even more confusing and annoying to add new node.

Cannot zoom in close enough to Minmus, cannot rotate to visual see how the orbit will look like. - Solved by double click at Minmus. But mention it here anyway. 

Creating multiple manouver chain is basically not that possible. Even when I have planed  simple burn exactly at PE cannot make the orbit look circular. Do not know what I am doing wrong! I have to refresh the KSP1 and see how it is working there.

Situation is different and more easy when I am already at the Minmus gravity.

My suggestion here is first able to make maneuver nod directly at new gravity influence celestial body.  Visual duplicate or move to target body.  Now is impossible without mod to plan that manuver and keep zoom in to celestial body we try to setup  direct Low Orbit insertion.

Great work with the update! Love game for Parts organization, better visual and music. But I am kind of nerd that want more tiny popup windows with configure percise data. Can it will be also added as a Science research to not make new players too overwhelmed?

Where you plant the node is where the burn starts, so you have to move it back a touch to get your pe to stay put 

[Sea_Kerman]

Having 2 different modes, secant and tangent, would be nice.

Tangent is what we currently have, and it is best suited to long burns where the new (amazing) full trajectory simulation is useful. Not really possible to "split" a burn around the maneuver when the burn involves several SOI transitions, lol.

Secant would be the new default, where it automatically offsets the maneuver start backward while keeping the pro/retro/normal/radial frame of refrence the same as the initial point. This would result in what we used to do in KSP1.

Edited December 31, 2023 by Sea_Kerman

[Uedel]

i also support the option to numerical enter values.

 

On the second hand, i realy miss all the information from the KSP different modes (orbitasl, rendevouz...) it offered so much more detail information io simply dont get from KSP 2 atm

[Demcrew]

On 12/25/2023 at 7:21 AM, RabidSmurf said:

Ship icons are too big and get in the way of setting target on planetary bodies, often opening a details window that can't be closed when you click on them.

Agreed, these are really annoying actually. Back on KSP1, Vessel Icon fading away depending on the zoom is a must. It gives to this feature (vessel icon) a situational trigger for the player.