[0.22.X] BobCat ind. Historical spacecraft thread

[Kerbal01]

I heard the proton was messed up and I can't get in orbit to save my life.

Also, when should we start out gravity turns with the Orion

I keep having the problem bobcat had when he made his Ares I test launch video.(flipping over after SRB sep).

Edited May 30, 2013 by DarthVader

[daver4470]

I heard the proton was messed up and I can't get in orbit to save my life.

Working fine for me (in 0.20)! ("Fine" = "no more than the usual flexing during the first stage burn")

ORDA does make Mir assembly much easier... if you remember which number is which docking port on the core. Which I never did....

[Netris]

I finally started Assembling Mir with hyperedit and ORDA

I have the core module Kvant 2 and am now docking Kvant 1.I also have a Soyuz TMA docked to the end of Kv 2

You should have send Kvant-1 in orbit before Kvant-2 u_u

[Good_Apollo]

I wanted to clear up some naming conventions for the pack:

The Soyuz-U/TMA should be named the Soyuz-FG/TMA right, along with the Soyuz-FG/Progress-M rather than -U and -TM? With the ST Fairings and Fregat upper stage the rocket should become a Soyuz-2ST/Fregat.

The 'oldtype' Soyuz-U/Soyuz craft has always bothered me because I cannot find a single picture of any of the older variants of Soyuz with antennae that match Bobcats except for the one-time manned flight of the Soyuz Apollo-Soyuz-Test-Program variant with the APAS docking system instead of the usual drogue/probe. Any information?

[asmi]

The Soyuz-U/TMA should be named the Soyuz-FG/TMA right, along with the Soyuz-FG/Progress-M rather than -U and -TM? With the ST Fairings and Fregat upper stage the rocket should become a Soyuz-2ST/Fregat.

The Soyuz-TMA-M spacecraft is indeed launched by Soyuz-FG rocket, but Progress-M-M is launched by Soyuz-U rocket, the main difference is Soyuz-FG has max acceleration capped at 4G (man rating requirement), while Soyuz-U AFAIK puts out up to 5G. As for ST, there are actually two different versions - Soyuz-2.1a ST and Soyuz-2.1b ST, the latter one has more payload capacity.

[Kerbal01]

You should have send Kvant-1 in orbit before Kvant-2 u_u

Kvant 2 dockes directly to the fat end of the Core module so I just built it in VAB to save time.

[Mekan1k]

Best. IVA. Ever.

Now-To the MUN!

[Netris]

Kvant 2 dockes directly to the fat end of the Core module so I just built it in VAB to save time.

And you've lost an other occasion to send a Proton up in the sky :-D

[daver4470]

Kvant 2 dockes directly to the fat end of the Core module so I just built it in VAB to save time.

Vice versa, actually. Kvant is the short stubby one that goes on the aft port of the Core. Kvant-2 is the long one that's on one of the radial ports.

[Good_Apollo]

The Soyuz-TMA-M spacecraft is indeed launched by Soyuz-FG rocket, but Progress-M-M is launched by Soyuz-U rocket, the main difference is Soyuz-FG has max acceleration capped at 4G (man rating requirement), while Soyuz-U AFAIK puts out up to 5G. As for ST, there are actually two different versions - Soyuz-2.1a ST and Soyuz-2.1b ST, the latter one has more payload capacity.

Okay, what about the older Soyuz discrepency? Here's a picture of the modified Soyuz used for the ASTP. It's the only one I can find that has antennae that match the one in the pack.

[Kerbal01]

I finally just made an entire Mir .craft file and hyperedited it into orbit around kerbin and docked a Soyuz to it, if anyone wants the .craft i'll find a way to upload it.

To Canopus: told you so

[daver4470]

The Soyuz-TMA-M spacecraft is indeed launched by Soyuz-FG rocket, but Progress-M-M is launched by Soyuz-U rocket, the main difference is Soyuz-FG has max acceleration capped at 4G (man rating requirement), while Soyuz-U AFAIK puts out up to 5G. As for ST, there are actually two different versions - Soyuz-2.1a ST and Soyuz-2.1b ST, the latter one has more payload capacity.

Progress is actually launched by both, depending on the mission requirements. The Soyuz-FG can put a couple hundred extra kilograms into orbit, and has been used when the Progress needed to lift more (e.g. a fully loaded Progress M-1). Most of the Progress launches to the ISS, though, have been on the -U. The last Progress-M (M-19M) was actually launched on a -U. As both the -U and the -FG are being phased out over the next two years, we probably won't see many Progress launches on the -U going forward.

The Soyuz-U/TMA should be named the Soyuz-FG/TMA right, along with the Soyuz-FG/Progress-M rather than -U and -TM? With the ST Fairings and Fregat upper stage the rocket should become a Soyuz-2ST/Fregat.

You're correct, if these were real-life rockets. But since the BobCat models don't operate at the very limit of their ability to launch, it's sort of pointless to try and distinguish by name here, as there's no need to have a more powerful Soyuz. The launcher is based on the Soyuz-U, and sticking a ST fairing and a Fregat on it doesn't suddenly make the first stage more powerful, so it's arguably still a Soyuz-U. In real life, putting the Fregat plus payload or a Soyuz TMA on top of the Soyuz-U would just result in a lower initial LEO than you'd want (or possibly a nice long parabolic arc back to somewhere in the Caucasus). The Soyuz-2 is indistinguishable from the Soyuz-U or the -TM -- the only difference is using the uprated RD-117/118 on the first stage vs. the RD-107/108 on the -U (or 107A/108A on the -FG). It's the same model for all three.

The 'oldtype' Soyuz-U/Soyuz craft has always bothered me because I cannot find a single picture of any of the older variants of Soyuz with antennae that match Bobcats except for the one-time manned flight of the Soyuz Apollo-Soyuz-Test-Program variant with the APAS docking system instead of the usual drogue/probe. Any information?

I'm 98% sure that BobCat's model is based on the Soyuz-TM, which was the uprated Soyuz-T used for Mir missions. The Soyuz-T was, in part, based on the 7K-TM... the specially-modified version of the 7K-T ferry (the one that had no solar panels) used for ASTP. There aren't a hell of a lot of pictures of the -T; most come from the early days of Mir (the first few missions to Mir after launched used the Soyuz-T variant.) There are a good number of pictures of the -TM, though, and it looks pretty much exactly like Bobcat's Soyuz. Here's a link to one. His -TMA is spot-on, though -- here's a super hi rez photo of one from NASA.

Edited May 30, 2013 by daver4470
edited to fix -TM photo link

[Fyrem]

ok, while reading the post above me, I couldn't help hearing this song in my head

[daver4470]

ok, while reading the post above me, I couldn't help hearing this song in my head

The Man in Black gets you a reputation point, sirrah!

[Kerbal01]

Hey bobcat, you did say you would make a Voskod after .20 was released, are you still planning on doing that?

[Deltac]

Hey bobcat, you did say you would make a Voskod after .20 was released, are you still planning on doing that?

after .20.5 probably.

[HGGundamReviews]

For Bobcat or any of his team, I was wondering, if in the stuff you have planned, is there going to be one day a full on Saturn V system with Apollo command pod and LEM in one of your packs? I have seen some attempts by other moders but I have to say as far as historical craft, Ain't Nobody Better Than The Bobcat Team.

[Good_Apollo]

Somebody is making one now and it looks good. Bobcat team has a ton of work already and like the real thing, Saturn V/Apollo aint a small task...

[finkmac]

Hey bobcat, you did say you would make a Voskod after .20 was released, are you still planning on doing that?

He said he would not make Vostok until .20...

1 man 1 pod? not before .20

[BlazingAngel665]

Suprise Part II Texturing isn't as bad as I though. Once I clean up some horrible pixels figure out what the fudge a normal map is, do emissives, and do the gimble animation, and BUG SHOOT BUG SHOOT BUG SHOOT it might work. Here is a video of why bug shooting is going to be very necessary.

[skeligandrew]

Hey blazing, I had this problem while making my black arrow mod, does it look like that in the VAB?

the problem for me was I did not move my model to 0,0,0 on the grid in my 3d modelling program before export, so it was offset in unity

[BlazingAngel665]

Hey blazing, I had this problem while making my black arrow mod, does it look like that in the VAB?

the problem for me was I did not move my model to 0,0,0 on the grid in my 3d modelling program before export, so it was offset in unity

not exactly, the collision mesh doesn't scale with the model for some reason. The collision mesh was already in the wrong spot in unity so I am doing a remodel with a better poly count, normal maps, emmissive maps, gimbling animations and hopefully a texture that wraps without having a super obvious transition. Shouldn't take too much longer now that I have an idea what I am doing and have all the resources in place.

[dimovski]

Blazing Angel, if you need ANY help with .cfgs...just send me a PM, I would be happy if I could try acctually helping someone and not just DL stuff

[Good_Apollo]

Okay now that I've got all my addons back in and patched to .20.2 I have locked the problem on the Kliper w/Mechjeb. Guess what? Removing the RCS/ASAS cone completely removed every single problem. I could gravity turn at any altitude I wanted and the rocket reacted just as it did pre-0.20 (Flawlessly). I knew it wasn't an aerodynamics issue or center of mass or any of that because none of that changed between the versions. Clearly there's something up with the AdvSASToggle plugin. The winglets are still flapping all over thanks to Mechjeb and everything, doesn't matter it didn't flip over or anything...literally the problem is in the Nose Cone and I suspect the plugin itself....

I'm removing it from Bobcat's parts and will retest to see if it fixes the other wobbly/SAS issues I've had.

[Netris]

Okay now that I've got all my addons back in and patched to .20.2 I have locked the problem on the Kliper w/Mechjeb. Guess what? Removing the RCS/ASAS cone completely removed every single problem. I could gravity turn at any altitude I wanted and the rocket reacted just as it did pre-0.20 (Flawlessly). I knew it wasn't an aerodynamics issue or center of mass or any of that because none of that changed between the versions. Clearly there's something up with the AdvSASToggle plugin. The winglets are still flapping all over thanks to Mechjeb and everything, doesn't matter it didn't flip over or anything...literally the problem is in the Nose Cone and I suspect the plugin itself....

I'm removing it from Bobcat's parts and will retest to see if it fixes the other wobbly/SAS issues I've had.

Have you tried only deactivate the ASAS ?