LLL - Lack Luster Labs - Development Thread

[Lack]

I installed this mod in 0.22 with Aviation Lights, B9, Editor Extensions, Kerbal Engineer Redux, Hullcam and Universe Replacer and my game crashed almost exactly every third launch (from SPH or VAB, it didn't matter). I know it's because of LLL because I uninstalled LLL (since I know this is an in-development mod and it has a fair few bugs) and the crashes stopped. Just thought I'd inform you so you can figure out why this happens. What do you suggest? Should I go back to an old version (since this is a parts-only mod and I don't use these parts in career mode)? Thanks Lack.

Memory usage, plain and simple. Try turning textures down to half-res in the settings first, and if that isn't enough then remove parts.

B9, Universe Replacer and this is asking for trouble. I believe LLL has just over half the foot-print as B9, but it's still a lot and the textures in Universe Replacer add up quickly, before you know it you're in crashing territory.

P.S. can you rename the warthog the boar? It doesn't seem as HALOish as well it fits the part, the name Sow also works.

Done. Never played Halo really, so hadn't made the connexion between the two.

The one part thats missing from this set is an RCS thruster block done in the LLL style. It looks a bit odd to me to have these sleek LLL spacecraft with conventional RCS blocks interupting the smooth lines.

Yeah, I should be able to manage that. I haven't used RCS blocks in an age, just use the linear ones now so it never bothered me.

Personally I absolutely love the salvage tug, may I make a sugestion though?

What about a variant of the tug with no crew, having ditched the crew for for automation even more fuel/delta v?

Trade a bit of versatility for even more push?

Thanks. I'm sure I can manage something like that at some point.

And so it's not just replies, been playing around with adding some compatibility for KAS. (Also pictured, the excellent ALCOR pod)

Javascript is disabled. View full album

Edited October 28, 2013 by Lack

[Mekan1k]

... I want the kas capability.

[nismobg]

Lol you seriously build a wall with kas containers !!! Very nice indeed

[KhaosCorp]

Lol you seriously build a wall with kas containers !!! Very nice indeed

Dont think so, it would seem he added the grab/attach modules to several of the LLL parts. If Im not mistaken those are LLL structural plates the outer wall is made of.

[Liam Sheepman]

Are you planning to make any LLL science bays? Maybe ones the size of the 2x1 Hull (Third Length), but with awesome folding doors and sweet monitors everywhere. I'd love to see KAS capability. By the way, why not make the structural wings into actual wings? That'd be sweet. Speaking of those structural wings, I think the left wing looks way better on the right and vice-versa, so that the tips point up.

[Thourion]

... And so it's not just replies, been playing around with adding some compatibility for KAS...

That pic (all, but especially the last) is so freaking awsome, im having an excitment attack.

[Logan.Darklighter]

Hey - remember a while back I made a start at a SHADO Moonbase?

Well check it out - here's the original -

And here's my new proof of concept fitting in the VAB.

This is not yet viable as a spacecraft or something that can be lifted to the Mun yet. This is just a test article meant mainly to see how close the overall shape can be. Next step is to break this up into sections that can be lifted by boosters to the Mun. There to be assembled likely with the help of cranes employing the KAS system.

So far I'm pleased. And it's 90% LLL parts. Just goes to show what you can do with this stuff!

One thing though. Love the geodesic style spheres you've made in the latest pack. But you know what you need? Spheres that have "Soccerball" style alternating pentagon/hex symmetry all around. The above alternating pentagon and triangle is close to what I wanted. But not quite. Yes, of course I have selfish interests at heart!

And thanks again for doing those windows for the Eagle in the Wayland thread. That just puts the polish on those Eagle pods!

[Lack]

Hey - remember a while back I made a start at a SHADO Moonbase?

Well check it out - here's the original -

-snip-

One thing though. Love the geodesic style spheres you've made in the latest pack. But you know what you need? Spheres that have "Soccerball" style alternating pentagon/hex symmetry all around. The above alternating pentagon and triangle is close to what I wanted. But not quite. Yes, of course I have selfish interests at heart!

That's a great recreation, love to see people enjoying the parts. Makes all the effort of making them worth-while.

The SHADO moonbase was actually the inspiration for the Poly-habs, I had been trying to make the design in Blender, but couldn't quite figure out how to do it with the tools. Closest I got was the Polyhabs. Although though a few minutes googling has found some neat tutorials, so I may well try it again.

[Logan.Darklighter]

That's a great recreation, love to see people enjoying the parts. Makes all the effort of making them worth-while.

The SHADO moonbase was actually the inspiration for the Poly-habs, I had been trying to make the design in Blender, but couldn't quite figure out how to do it with the tools. Closest I got was the Polyhabs. Although a few minutes googling has found some neat tutorials, so I may well try it again.

Nice! Glad to hear it! Do keep the Pentagon and triangle as well, of course! I'd "upgrade" my SHADO recreation with any new polyhab version you cared to create, but more options and parts is always a good thing!

I see great minds think alike!

[Andrew Hansen]

Hello everybody.

First of all, I'm a (relatively) new player to Kerbal Space Program. I've been really enjoying Lack Luster Labs! It goes great with B9 Aerospace.

I have a question, though. How are you supposed to get Kerbals out from the structural hulls and airlock doors? I tried attaching hatch doors, airlock doors, and all sorts of other things to the structural hulls, but the Kerbals seem to be trapped inside and can't get out.

Below are some screenshots.

Other parts such as command pods work fine. I can EVA them and see them no problem. Any ideas?

[Helix935]

Hello everybody.

First of all, I'm a (relatively) new player to Kerbal Space Program. I've been really enjoying Lack Luster Labs! It goes great with B9 Aerospace.

I have a question, though. How are you supposed to get Kerbals out from the structural hulls and airlock doors? I tried attaching hatch doors, airlock doors, and all sorts of other things to the structural hulls, but the Kerbals seem to be trapped inside and can't get out.

Below are some screenshots.

Other parts such as command pods work fine. I can EVA them and see them no problem. Any ideas?

use crew manifest to move them into the airlocks

[Andrew Hansen]

Use crew manifest to move them into the airlocks

Yes, that's what I was thinking....

I just didn't want to really use Crew Manifest because I know I'm going to use it to cheat by creating/deleting extra Kerbals in space or something (if I run out of fuel on a mission, I can just delete the Kerbals without having any regrets).

But I guess that's probably the only solution.

Anyway, with Crew Manifest would my Kerbals show up in flight?

EDIT: I just realized that you must be on the runway or launchpad to add or remove crew. Yay!! Thanks Helix935... I wouldn't have learned that if you hadn't inspired me to look more into Kerbal Crew Manifest. My Kerbals don't show up in flight, but I can transfer them fine and I guess I'm happy with that.

Edited November 4, 2013 by Andrew Hansen

[Gristle]

Hello everybody.

First of all, I'm a (relatively) new player to Kerbal Space Program. I've been really enjoying Lack Luster Labs! It goes great with B9 Aerospace.

I have a question, though. How are you supposed to get Kerbals out from the structural hulls and airlock doors? I tried attaching hatch doors, airlock doors, and all sorts of other things to the structural hulls, but the Kerbals seem to be trapped inside and can't get out.

<SNIP>

Other parts such as command pods work fine. I can EVA them and see them no problem. Any ideas?

LLL is using the Vanguard plugin to allow you to place doors anywhere you like. You have to use the LLL dors and airlock parts though attached to a LLL crew capable part. This then allows you to EVA any kerbals inside those parts and have them re-enter.

Vanguard Plugin

Edited November 4, 2013 by Gristle

[Andrew Hansen]

LLL is using the Vanguard plugin to allow you to place doors anywhere you like.

Thanks Gristle! I was wondering why Lack Luster Labs wouldn't state that you needed Crew Manifest to make some things work. But this makes sense because they do state they use Vanguard Technologies on their front page.

[Sigma52]

these pieces look really good, keep up the awesome work!!!

[Andrew Hansen]

First of all, sorry if this is posted in the wrong place, but I didn't see where else to post bug reports. I think I have found a bug, Lack. See if you can reproduce it.

Basically, I encounter a lot of lag whenever I use the Corridor Berthing Ports.

I've done some testing and the simplest vehicle I can make to reproduce the problem is one with a probe core (I used the 2.5 meter one), a structural hull (I used the 2.5 meter plain hull), and of course one of those docking ports.

With this setup, first of all it takes a long time to load. But the main thing is that whenever I decelerate from time acceleration, it takes several seconds in which Kerbal Space Program doesn't respond before I can do anything.

Other than that, Lack Luster Labs has been great!

[Lack]

First of all, sorry if this is posted in the wrong place, but I didn't see where else to post bug reports. I think I have found a bug, Lack. See if you can reproduce it.

Basically, I encounter a lot of lag whenever I use the Corridor Berthing Ports.

I've done some testing and the simplest vehicle I can make to reproduce the problem is one with a probe core (I used the 2.5 meter one), a structural hull (I used the 2.5 meter plain hull), and of course one of those docking ports.

With this setup, first of all it takes a long time to load. But the main thing is that whenever I decelerate from time acceleration, it takes several seconds in which Kerbal Space Program doesn't respond before I can do anything.

Other than that, Lack Luster Labs has been great!

Yeah, it's known. I had a lot of requests to try and make the CBM self-alligning when docking, but the mesh ended up becoming ridiculously complicated (and it only sort of works) and with that many sub-parts that it became quite laggy. I've tried phasing it out a few times but people didn't like not having the option, so I stuck it behind an animation (right-click the CBM for the 'docking guide' option), which helps only slightly with the problem.

[Gristle]

Yeah, it's known. I had a lot of requests to try and make the CBM self-alligning when docking, but the mesh ended up becoming ridiculously complicated (and it only sort of works) and with that many sub-parts that it became quite laggy. I've tried phasing it out a few times but people didn't like not having the option, so I stuck it behind an animation (right-click the CBM for the 'docking guide' option), which helps only slightly with the problem.

Could you make 2 parts? One with docking guides and one without? I personally don't like CBM's with docking guides. They are more of a hindrance than helpful. With several docking maneuver helper plugins being available guides aren't really needed, IMO.

[Andrew Hansen]

Could you make 2 parts? One with docking guides and one without? I personally don't like CBM's with docking guides. They are more of a hindrance than helpful. With several docking maneuver helper plugins being available guides aren't really needed, IMO.

I second this. The docking guides animation does look pretty amazing, but I'm willing to sacrifice a few looks for better performance.

[Logan.Darklighter]

Yeah, it's known. I had a lot of requests to try and make the CBM self-alligning when docking, but the mesh ended up becoming ridiculously complicated (and it only sort of works) and with that many sub-parts that it became quite laggy. I've tried phasing it out a few times but people didn't like not having the option, so I stuck it behind an animation (right-click the CBM for the 'docking guide' option), which helps only slightly with the problem.

Damn. That may explain why I've noticed some pretty severe lag when I get two of the modded Eagle's close together. I use those connectors at the front and back of the pods that I created. Having just one Eagle with them in view and nothing else is okay. But as soon as I get two of them within draw distance of each other it lags badly. Also lags when I get near another construction of any significant part count, like say - a stock space station. Some of that undoubtedly is just the part count overall. But it's noticeably worse when the Eagles are around. And I was wondering why.

[Lack]

Right, here's a much simpler version of the CBM. Should help with the lag.

http://www./download/thg7epo1eegw9g9/2013-11-07-LLL-NewCBM.zip

I did away with the docking guides parts and added a bit to the back (like with the Airlock and the extendable CBM) so it'll blend a bit better if you place it on the side of a part.

Edited November 7, 2013 by Lack

[Andrew Hansen]

Right, here's a much simpler version of the CBM. Should help with the lag.

Wow, thanks Lack! Downloading this right away.

[Logan.Darklighter]

Cool! Was really liking the blended versions of the other parts and wondered why the CBM didn't have that feature. I'll download that and see if that improves things with the lag. Thanks!

[wasmic]

Hey Lack, why don't you start a thread in the Addon Releases and Projects Showcase subforum? You'll get way more views that way, your thread will be easier to find, and your mod is definitely qualified for a place there.

[Lack]

Hey Lack, why don't you start a thread in the Addon Releases and Projects Showcase subforum? You'll get way more views that way, your thread will be easier to find, and your mod is definitely qualified for a place there.

That would be my naturally reactionary tendencies; 'Why change? Everything is fine. Who needs land reform anyway, bring back the Tsar, I say.' etc.

There's still a fair few things to fix, and to be honest, I quite like the community and slower pace in Add-on development; I may post it in the releases when I have more time to keep up with KSP things.

Edit: a bit of messing around from the past week or two

Javascript is disabled. View full album

Edited November 7, 2013 by Lack