On Custom Control Boxes for KSP

[rodion_herrera]

Hi guys, is there already a thread here that discusses on making custom "launch and control" boxes for KSP? I'm talking about those "joystick" type devices that you can use to control a simulation, like what some train simulation hobbyists use:

Anyone has this kind of setup? Could it be possible to utilize existing consumer products like that one above, and use it for KSP? Have some tried it? Can you share your experiences with such setups? Thanks!

[MR4Y]

The closes thing would be the Saitek joysticks and things.

[rodion_herrera]

The closes thing would be the Saitek joysticks and things.

Yes, actually I use two joysticks for KSP, if only for added buttons Also, my primary stick (right hand) doesn't have a twist rudder, so when I need rudder (yaw) axis, I use my left stick which has one. But I want to see if some people actually extend KSP into this kind of hobbying. Because my aim is to get kids interested in space exploration (I teach basic astronomy to elementary and high school kids) and I think such a control box is really cool and can help getting them engaged in an activity about controlling rockets and spacecraft.

[3_bit]

We need a challenge to make the best possible KSP setup, resembling the interior of any cockpit as well as possible (except the ones with no instrument) that could utilize a plugin to get data such as bearing, target, map location, etc.

[rodion_herrera]

We need a challenge to make the best possible KSP setup, resembling the interior of any cockpit as well as possible (except the ones with no instrument) that could utilize a plugin to get data such as bearing, target, map location, etc.

Actually, I wasn't talking about a cockpit setup--probably what triggered that was because MR4Y mentioned joysticks. The reason why I specifically mention "control boxes" is because a cockpit implies a MANNED mission--but with a control box, it means a guy having a console at Mission Control, where he can push buttons in his console, etc. to control a probe or remote rover.

I thought I saw someone post a modified R/C control box as his KSP control box, but I can't find that thread and post, so I was hoping someone can assist, so I can ask questions to that user/forum member, thanks.

[0jam3290]

I do remember seeing a thread where there was a picture of a custom control box that someone made out of some (I believe) plywood/sheet metal and spare electronics parts, but I think it got wiped in the Purge. But I do remember it being greyish-silver with alot of buttons, some sliders for throttle and (possibly) a small analog joystick (it was a few months back, so the details are kinda fuzzy).

[Rage097]

I would kill for something like this in KSP. Button for SAS, RCS, staging, control groups, a level for throttle, a flight yoke for steering, altimeter, RADAR altimeter, vertical speed, speed, ÃŽâ€-v, manuver node implementation and a fully functional nav-ball.

End nerdgasm.

[jwenting]

Still have a lot of GoFlight hardware for MS flightsim that can be configured to perform just about any keyboard operation... http://www.goflightinc.com/

Expensive stuff, but brilliant (and yes, that's $750 plus tax and S&H for what's essentially a joystick).

[air805ronin]

I do remember seeing a thread where there was a picture of a custom control box that someone made out of some (I believe) plywood/sheet metal and spare electronics parts, but I think it got wiped in the Purge. But I do remember it being greyish-silver with alot of buttons, some sliders for throttle and (possibly) a small analog joystick (it was a few months back, so the details are kinda fuzzy).

A few different people posted their different attempts. I'm sure some will come back for this thread, because that other thread had such a wealth of information in it. Specifically whether to use arduino or another controller board, how to get around limitations, etc.

This is something I would desperately love to do...

[mushroomman]

Yeah I saw a really nice custom one before the wipe. As soon as I get a new joystick I'm going to take it apart to make my own.

[rodion_herrera]

I'm glad that people are interested in this. Maybe all of us who are interested in such projects can revive the idea, and start posting links to possible resources (preferrably affordable) for parts to make your own. Heck, I'd make one out of cardboard and with some old joystick parts. But I would like to see how some already did theirs and maybe learn from the experience. Again thanks guys for all your input and keep it coming.

[Payload]

I do remember seeing a thread where there was a picture of a custom control box that someone made out of some (I believe) plywood/sheet metal and spare electronics parts, but I think it got wiped in the Purge. But I do remember it being greyish-silver with alot of buttons, some sliders for throttle and (possibly) a small analog joystick (it was a few months back, so the details are kinda fuzzy).

OMG NOOO! The Arduino Controller Thread was Amazing!

I'll have to re-cap. I'm heart broken...

First someguy, can't remember his name, built a DIY KSP controller made with an Arduino and it was excellent. The Arduino is a DIY micro-controller Dev kit that you can purchase at RadioShack for about 30$ U.S. This will allow you to build your own USB input device. It sounds complicated but the programming has already been done. You can just build the thing and modify the code to do whatever you wish.

Still gutted that thread is gone because it had so much useful information in it. First if not paramount is to make sure you buy at least the Leonardo model of the micro-controller kit. The earlier version do support USB HID but it is no as easy to handle. I have done it with an Uno version I have here but making changes is a pain.

So here it is Boys..

Part number one...

The Brane MASHEEEN.. AKA Arduino.

http://www.adafruit.com/products/849?gclid=CJr56u-zurcCFY0WMgodPUoA8A

You could also procure one at you closest RadioShack. LOL I know you haven't been in one in years, but they do still exist in some places. I doubt the staff will have any idea what you are looking for though.

Edited May 29, 2013 by Payload

[air805ronin]

One key thing I remember is setting up an arduino to emulate a keyboard and not necessarily a joystick, because KSP has a limited number of buttons allowed on a joystick. I may not be remembering that quite right... Edit2: As payload said, also, the finished boards seemed to all use Arduino Leonardos...

Really quick initial search: http://www.instructables.com/id/Flight-Simulator-with-Arduino-and-Python/

http://www.instructables.com/id/Build-inexpensive-game-controllers-Arduino-Proc/

The other thread had much better resources, including other controllers that are less expensive than the Arduino line.

Edit: The key idea is that your buttons and switches (and joystick) map to inputs on the controller. Then you map those to a keyboard map, and make sure the map in KSP reflects what you have assigned the buttons for. Some things like joysticks and throttles are more complicated because they aren't on/off/multiple press.

Edited May 29, 2013 by air805ronin

[rodion_herrera]

OMG NOOO! The Arduino Controller Thread was Amazing!

I'll have to re-cap. I'm heart broken...

First someguy, can't remember his name, built a DIY KSP controller made with and Arduino and it was excellent. The Arduino is a DIY micro-controller Dev kit that you can purchase at RadioShack for about 30$ U.S. This will allow you to build you own USB input device. It sounds complicated but the programming has already been done. You can just build the thing and modify the code to do whatever you wish.

Still gutted that thread is gone because it had so much useful information in it. First if not paramount is to make sure you buy at least the Leonardo model of the micro-controller kit. The earlier version do support USB HID but it is no as easy to handle. I have done it with an Uno version I have here but making changes is a pain.

Yes using an Arduino seems logical, or for a more fancy setup maybe even use an rPi. But perhaps by just using an old USB joystick with multiple buttons, one can already create something useful for KSP. I personally don't want the new thread to focus on projects that would perhaps need more knowledge in circuit design and/or electronics engineering to complete, thereby scaring some who feel they lack the skillset to finish such a project. I wish for a broader spectrum of control box makers and projects that range from the simplest (heck, some kids would be happy seeing a LARGE RED BUTTON with the word LAUNCH on it hehehe), to the complex.

[Payload]

Totally agree bro. I;m just here to say that if your looking at tearing into a Regular USB controller to build a custom box.. I can almost guarantee that the arduino thing is easier. You still have to know all the same things. Only with a gutted XBOX controller you have to have freakin ESP about how what goes where and all sorts of things that may not be directly observable. Further more, the things weren't designed to be disassembled. I see a lot of potential for that to just be harder and more costly than buying a micro controller and having a known quantity to start with and to be able to tailor your component choices as you see fit.

I personally wouldn't use potentiometers. I would use Hall sensors.

Others will want Large gimbals other will want RC style gimbals.

If you are going to plug in a Xbox Controller then you might as well just just use that.

Also keep in mind we are talking about Keyboard emulation here. That is kinda hard to do with some store bought controllers.

[air805ronin]

Don't forget the big red abort button, for which you have the switch you have to flip to enable the button. Or two kerbal authentication with keys.

(I second the fact that an arduino project only takes a little more effort and knowledge than a controller mod)

[sparty48]

I will write a blank check for a full motion simulator for ksp! JK... I think

[rodion_herrera]

Totally agree bro. I;m just here to say that if your looking at tearing into a Regular USB controller to build a custom box.. I can almost guarantee that the arduino thing is easier. You still have to know all the same things. Only with a gutted XBOX controller you have to have freakin ESP about how what goes where and all sorts of things that may not be directly observable. Further more, the things weren't designed to be disassembled. I see a lot of potential for that to just be harder and more costly than buying a micro controller and having a known quantity to start with and to be able to tailor your component choices as you see fit.

Yes, I actually have experienced that--I once dissembled an old Logitech stick to somehow customize it for Orbiter once, and yeah it was more or less a hair-pulling experience of frustration, because I had to lengthen wires, only to find out that the resistance increased, so loss of signal etc...so yeah I understand that perhaps using controllers is in fact an easier and practical approach. But there are some off-the-shelf controllers that might actually have a type of PCB and wiring layout that will just basically need a container/box replacement, to actually finish it off as a custom box. So yeah, both methods are encouraged

[nyrath]

I was asking about the possibility of making homebrew Apollo-style hand controller in this thread

http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/showthread.php/27561-Hand-controllers

[Mefi282]

Right i've got a setup including 1 PC 1 notebook 2 monitors 1 joystick mouse keyboard and a tablet.

On one monitor is KSP on the other is chrome with telemetry aswell on the notebook (telemachus plugin) on the tablet there are controls for the rocket and mechjeb. And sometimes even the phone to calculate planetary transfers.

Maybe il buy an other monitor instead of a notebook...

But i'm quiet happy with this setup.

[rodion_herrera]

My idea for the control box is not so much as to make things "easier" to control for KSP, like a fancy multibutton joystick HOTAS setup would do, but also to introduce it as a sort of novelty item, possibly even a merchandise item. I was thinking along the lines of those who make Steampunk keyboards and control devices, you know, "jazzing" up a custom controller box, to make it look "kerbalized" I am thinking making the controls deliberately look like the Fisher Price equivalent of a laptop or a kitchen set.

This might also make KSP more appealing to kids, if they see such a controller and realize they can control a Kerbal ship using it.

[NeoMorph]

My build got a bit of a boost yesterday when I got my laminator up to the required temp to fuse my circuits to copper so I can go ahead with my custom circuit boards... will mean I will be able to make this soon...

Oh yeah and I was AMAZED to find this on eBay US...

http://www.ebay.com/itm/LM-5-DSKY-DISPLAY-KEYBOARD-APOLLO-GUIDANCE-COMPUTER-AGC-MODEL-ART-CRAFT-KIT-1-1-/230953345011#shId

[rodion_herrera]

That Apollo DSKY would be suitable for something as complex as the NASSP project for Orbiter, for one thing because the NASSP mod itself contains the actual code for the DSKY! (read below), but for KSP, the DSKY/PGNS/AGS buttons will serve to activate KSP related functions.

The NASSP Project for Orbiter is an Apollo sim that actually allows you to program the simulated Apollo DSKY (for both the CSM and the LM), exactly as how Neil Armstrong, Buzz, or any of the 32 people who flew Apollo spacecraft. It's the closest you can get to experience how to send commands to an Apollo spacecraft via a primitive input device. I enjoyed punching in those "nouns" and "verbs" while I was a member of the NASSP project and testing out my LM on lunar orbit

Edited May 31, 2013 by rodion_herrera

[NeoMorph]

So you know what I mean when I say to you "P00 and Accept!"

Yeah, I've got Orbiter/NASSP installed on this PC.

I've been using my mods to interface with MechJeb instead of something like AGC. I need to update it for the latest version (still using the 1.9.8 code) an make it compatible with 0.20 KSP. I just did some test code to see if it would work and am now working on the actual hardware and programming the interfaces. Should be nice when I get it all working together.

[rodion_herrera]

So you know what I mean when I say to you "P00 and Accept!"

Went to POOH!

Yeah, I've got Orbiter/NASSP installed on this PC.

Not sure which NASSP flavor you got installed, but my "enhancements pack" added the AP16 and AP14 landing sites, and I made the original LEVA astronauts (A7L and A7LB suits) and the Rover Ahhh fond memories

I've been using my mods to interface with MechJeb instead of something like AGC. I need to update it for the latest version (still using the 1.9.8 code) an make it compatible with 0.20 KSP. I just did some test code to see if it would work and am now working on the actual hardware and programming the interfaces. Should be nice when I get it all working together.

Awesome! I'd sure like to see the progress of your project