[1.2] Procedural Fairings 3.20 (November 8)

[Castun]

The rocket however is in early prototyping and is extremely inefficient. On a normal launch currently, the rocket gets a 3.04 ton payload including the empty 3rd stage to 5,012 m/s however O_o.

5KM/sec? Sounds like your throttle control is a large part of that inefficiency. Maintain that terminal velocity!

[AncientGammoner]

He means that making the fuel tank look taller or shorter is achieveable, but the glowing green blobs at the top and bottom of it (the attachment nodes) are in fixed locations, so a shortened tank will have a gap before the next part, and a stretched tank will end up overlapping the next part.

Currently, I don't think any modder has found a way to adjust the locations of the attachment nodes within the game once it has loaded. i.e. unless Squad add some API calls to allow this, it may not be possible to do.

It's possible to move attachment nodes, but there might be issues.

Creating new ones dynamically won't work though, because it's done after the craft is loaded, and it won't load (will crash the game) if the nodes are missing.

You can check out the source here for my new procedural fuel tank mod (http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/showthread.php/46447-0-21-1-StretchyTanks-v0-1) for the solution to that problem. The long and short of it is: you only really need to move the attachment nodes in the editor so you can build your ship, when the game goes into flight mode those attachments are saved regardless of whether or not the nodes are in a different location on loading. Now in my mod I update the node locations anyways when flight mode starts, but I've tried it without doing that and it works just the same.

[Dictatorshipper]

If I download the new version of this mod will it break the ships I made with 1.3?

[e-dog]

If I download the new version of this mod will it break the ships I made with 1.3?

No, it shouldn't break anything.

[Starwaster]

You can check out the source here for my new procedural fuel tank mod (http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/showthread.php/46447-0-21-1-StretchyTanks-v0-1) for the solution to that problem. The long and short of it is: you only really need to move the attachment nodes in the editor so you can build your ship, when the game goes into flight mode those attachments are saved regardless of whether or not the nodes are in a different location on loading. Now in my mod I update the node locations anyways when flight mode starts, but I've tried it without doing that and it works just the same.

oh my god! i wanted this for so long. how is volume handled?

[MAKC]

Good job. Wanna try procedural wings next?

[AncientGammoner]

oh my god! i wanted this for so long. how is volume handled?

Never need to calculate volume, since dry mass/resource amounts vary linearly with the primary variable called stretchFactor (normalized to 1 for unstretched). If you mean how does it expand in volume it scales the model transform.

Good job. Wanna try procedural wings next?

There's already procedural wings

[GavinZac]

Oooh, ooooh! Procedural engines!

[Hyratel]

Oooh, ooooh! Procedural engines!

NO. for one, engines don't scale linearly by any stretch. the geometry necessary changes majorly as you do different things as do the performance

[GavinZac]

NO. for one, engines don't scale linearly by any stretch. the geometry necessary changes majorly as you do different things as do the performance

Procedural isn't just related to scale - just that the parts are dynamically created, not using fixed values. A detailed procedural engine generator could allow textual input; a more kerbal-ish one could just implement little sliders for the Project Management Triangle - fast/good/cheap, or rather thrusty/overheaty/ISPy

[Zaeo]

hm...

Procedural Adapter plates/fuel adapter tanks*to make them useful as something other than a beauty product?

[MAKC]

There's already procedural wings

Yeah, but they have some design decisions that limit their usefulness and realism. Lots of people have been asking DYJ to separate chord and wing thickness but he seems reluctant to do it. I don't think he has even commented on it. He doesn't have any obligations to anyone but neither do I, so I figured I'd try my luck here since e-dog has already proven his skill in the procedural area and I think he could pull it off nicely.

[GeckoOBac]

May I suggest, if it hasn't been done already, a version of the fairings that basically behaves like a cylindrical one (like when putting two facing fairing bases), but without one of the bases? In practice you should be able to resize it manually, both the width AND the length. This would help reduce weight and part count. I was thinking of using one such thing as a cover for the reentry engines part of a munar module, so the base with the fairings (whether fixed or ejectable) would stay on the mun and still provide cover/protection/style to the above part during launch/landing.

I tried locking shapes using the 2 bases approach, however that resulted in fairings that where too high after the removal of the top base. In the end I had to use a buttload of structural plates, which looked ugly, weighed a fair bit and increased impressively the part count.

[e-dog]

May I suggest, if it hasn't been done already, a version of the fairings that basically behaves like a cylindrical one (like when putting two facing fairing bases), but without one of the bases? In practice you should be able to resize it manually, both the width AND the length. This would help reduce weight and part count. I was thinking of using one such thing as a cover for the reentry engines part of a munar module, so the base with the fairings (whether fixed or ejectable) would stay on the mun and still provide cover/protection/style to the above part during launch/landing.

I tried locking shapes using the 2 bases approach, however that resulted in fairings that where too high after the removal of the top base. In the end I had to use a buttload of structural plates, which looked ugly, weighed a fair bit and increased impressively the part count.

I guess interstage adapter is what you want. It's in the works, progress so far:

There's still a number of problems to work out, including stock engine fairings that remain attached to the top node, hanging in the air.

[Liam Sheepman]

Love it. I got it and I instantly tried it out with a Duna satellite. Changed the whole thing from some ugly mish-mash into a speeding interplanetary three-rocketed bullet. My first good-looking rocket. Even better, I got there with ridiculous amounts of fuel left and my actual satellite looked good too. Thanks for helping me make an aesthetically pleasing ship for once,

[Resender]

I'm not getting the option to separate the fairing pieces.

I'm not getting them in the stack as demonstrated in this picture

http://s259.photobucket.com/user/Resender/media/screenshot6_zps3ce62498.png.html

[e-dog]

I'm not getting the option to separate the fairing pieces.

I'm not getting them in the stack as demonstrated in this picture

http://s259.photobucket.com/user/Resender/media/screenshot6_zps3ce62498.png.html

That's fuselage, not fairings. It has no decouplers, intentionally. It's also colored differently. Read the description.

[Gristle]

I'm not getting the option to separate the fairing pieces.

I'm not getting them in the stack as demonstrated in this picture

http://s259.photobucket.com/user/Resender/media/screenshot6_zps3ce62498.png.html

Are you using the white or beige fairings? The white fairing are meant to be inline and do not have decouple functions. The beige fairings do have the decouple which is whatt I think you are looking for.

[Gristle]

May I suggest, if it hasn't been done already, a version of the fairings that basically behaves like a cylindrical one (like when putting two facing fairing bases), but without one of the bases? In practice you should be able to resize it manually, both the width AND the length. This would help reduce weight and part count. I was thinking of using one such thing as a cover for the reentry engines part of a munar module, so the base with the fairings (whether fixed or ejectable) would stay on the mun and still provide cover/protection/style to the above part during launch/landing.

I tried locking shapes using the 2 bases approach, however that resulted in fairings that where too high after the removal of the top base. In the end I had to use a buttload of structural plates, which looked ugly, weighed a fair bit and increased impressively the part count.

Are you trying to do something like this?

The trick is to use an off center support beam to support / connect the lower and upper section between the fairings. You can see this support embedded in the non movable fairing in the pic.

[GeckoOBac]

Are you trying to do something like this?

The trick is to use an off center support beam to support / connect the lower and upper section between the fairings. You can see this support embedded in the non movable fairing in the pic.

Actually I was trying to replicate the staged mun lander here: http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/showthread.php/39630-Doing-it-Apollo-style?p=515916&viewfull=1#post515916

You can see the separation moment here: http://www.skyrender.net/lp2/ksp/alpacalips34.jpg

As you can see the engine and fuel canisters were hidden behind the screen of structural panels, but I wanted to use fairings (even fixed fairings) for that, mostly due to easier positioning, better looks and lower parts count.

[Gristle]

Actually I was trying to replicate the staged mun lander here: http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/showthread.php/39630-Doing-it-Apollo-style?p=515916&viewfull=1#post515916

You can see the separation moment here: http://www.skyrender.net/lp2/ksp/alpacalips34.jpg

As you can see the engine and fuel canisters were hidden behind the screen of structural panels, but I wanted to use fairings (even fixed fairings) for that, mostly due to easier positioning, better looks and lower parts count.

You could use the same techniques I used to create the cargo bay. It would actually be easier to do what you want. You'll need to figure out how tall your fairing needs to be in the final build, then substitute parts in between the faring bases to get the edge to edge height right on the fairings. Be sure to attach the faring pieces to the bottom faring base section attached to your lander. Once you get the height correct, lock the fairing shapes using the "L" key, then remove them and rip out the top fairing base and your spacer parts. Reassemble your complete vessel and stick the fairing pieces back on the remaining bottom base.

[GeckoOBac]

You could use the same techniques I used to create the cargo bay. It would actually be easier to do what you want. You'll need to figure out how tall your fairing needs to be in the final build, then substitute parts in between the faring bases to get the edge to edge height right on the fairings. Be sure to attach the faring pieces to the bottom faring base section attached to your lander. Once you get the height correct, lock the fairing shapes using the "L" key, then remove them and rip out the top fairing base and your spacer parts. Reassemble your complete vessel and stick the fairing pieces back on the remaining bottom base.

Yeah alright, but a simple resizing of the fairing would be better

[Gristle]

Yeah alright, but a simple resizing of the fairing would be better

I agree, but what you want is doable with the system as it works today.

[e-dog]

Updated to 2.4:

• Added procedural interstage fairing adapter with adjustable radii and height which decouples from the top part when fairings are ejected.
  
• Added conic fuselage.
  
• Fixed another inline fairing shape bug.
  

The interstage adapter has three stack nodes: below the ring, above the ring, and movable top node. It makes inline fairings only, and will decouple from top part when you eject fairing sides, simulating sides supporting the top part.

So, you can now do a quite authentic Saturn V with it

[jrandom]

This has rapidly become one of my favorite mods, and these updates are great! I can't wait to get home tonight to try out the new interstage!