[1.0.5] TAC Life Support v0.11.2.1 [12Dec]

[MedievalNerd]

Can I get a version of this that only requires energy for kerbal survival? Or some settings for it. Id love to setup "lifesupport" But i dont want the hassle of shipping oxygen and such around.

If you go in the TacLifeSupport/PluginData/TacLifeSupport folder, you'll see LifeSupport.cfg file. Open it up, then you'll see all the data you need to modify what Kebals need to survive. If you put the consumption to zero, perhaps it'll fix your problem. The plugin might still add those resources to your pods automatically though!

It's a step.

[Zander]

Hi I tried the mod. When my kerbals ran out of power they died as expected. But It took them far longer than 3 days to run out of water and food. it took them 3 months. and then another 3 months after they ran out to die of dehydration. oxygen also ran out after 3 months. but they did die after 5 minutes of no oxygen

Edited October 23, 2013 by Zander

[Scotius]

So you've starved and suffocated your Kerbals just to check how long they'll last? You monster! Apparently even ability to hibernate for months was not enough to free poor dudes from your evil clutches.

[Zander]

So you've starved and suffocated your Kerbals just to check how long they'll last? You monster! Apparently even ability to hibernate for months was not enough to free poor dudes from your evil clutches.

haha don't worry it was just a simulated test at the KSP.

This mod has real potential but TaranisElsu I have some recommendations I think would really improve it

1. Take away the TAC prefix from the resource name. Nobody is going to be using 2 life support mods at once so you dont need to prefix it. Just have the resource names be oxygen, water, and Food. It breaks the immersion to see TAC_Oxygen instead of just Oxygen.

2. for waste water you can convert it. But CO2 and waste cannot, Normally astronauts either use single-use CO2 scrubbers in which case they would be added to waste, or on the ISS they absorb the CO2 and pump it into space, in both cases it would not need a bar in the resources menu at all.

So I recommend you remove the waste water and CO2 bars completely for the most realistic representation.

3. I have an awesome idea for waste. Have it fill up the ship and give the crew an option to have waste collection from another ship after docking which can take it back to kerbin. OR the option to eject it into space. The first one is more troublesome but the second one will spawn a debris object in space which will be floating around and create a risk of colliding with other ships.

4. the resource tanks are so ugly and cartoonish. No space agency labels their tanks like that. I recommend reconfiguring the standard tanks to hold the resources. (I have attached an example with standard squad repurposed tanks you can try out.)

http://www.filedropper.com/taclifesupport

this is a great mod you have going, please keep working on it and contact me if you want help.

Edited October 23, 2013 by Zander

[TaranisElsu]

<snip>

1. This is still a Work In Progress, and I did not want to mess up someone's game if they decided to try it out. I will remove the _TAC from the resource names for the final release. Also note that you can easily change the names to whatever you want, including localizing them to other languages.

2. In real life, we can recycle CO₂ back into usage oxygen. It just is not very efficient yet, and it requires another chemical reactant. Or we can make an algae hydroponics pod to do it (very heavy). My plan is to add recyclers for all of the waste resources back into good resources: CO₂->O₂, WasteWater -> (clean) Water, and CO₂, Water, Waste (fertilizer) -> Food, O₂.

3. I did not want to deal with waste management in my mod. I would prefer to make it recyclable, see #2.

4. Yes, I know that my containers are ugly. I am a professional programmer (10 years), but I am new to modeling and texturing. Did you see regex's replacement textures? Or Talisar's "Spherical and Toridal Tank Pack"? There is also a lot of parts in other mods, like KASPAR, that can be repurposed for life support storage -- for personal use only until the mod owner releases some or gives permission to release some.

[amo28]

I like managing waste resources on my own with resupply trips. You can transfer all of the waste resources to and from your station/ship with Taranis' Fuel Balancer mod. It gives purpose to resupply missions for your stations. I'd rather not see the waste resources go away.

As for the parts, I've found it's really easy to add TAC's resources to other parts if you don't want to use his. For example, I added life support resources to the logistics module of the Fustek pack for my station. If you want something smaller, make a copy of the radial monopropellant tanks and change the config to add life support resources -- that's pretty much what Ioncross did. Or you can add TAC's resources to the Modular Fuel System mod so you can procedurally decide what tanks you want to carry life support. If you do use the TAC parts, use Regex's texture replacement, or cover up the parts with procedural side fairings.

I don't think Taranis needs to hear complaints about his parts on every page of this thread.

[odin_spain]

This great mod would be adapted to 0.22 version. Do it please!!!

[amo28]

It already works in 0.22, however you need to add the tech nodes to the cfgs. I did this with a ModuleManager (with Sarbian wildcard fix) cfg:

@PART[TAC*]

{

techRequired = Survivability

entryCost = 2500

}

That's it! Works like a charm. Just be prepared for a lot of extra electricity requirements in the beginning of a career. You won't be seeing any trips to the Mun without solar panels first.

[Krevsin]

Hmm, it would appear the download link on the spaceport isn't working.

Can someone help?

[TaranisElsu]

I am working on an update (that includes recycling-yay!), but until then: this mod does work with 0.22, you just need to add the two lines to each part's cfg file to make them show up in career mode. I plan to have most parts unlock in the Survivability node, with the larger ones unlocking in the Heavy Rocketry node.

See instructions here: http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/40667-0-21-1-WIP-TAC-Life-Support-28Jul?p=708033&viewfull=1#post708033

Hmm, it would appear the download link on the spaceport isn't working.

Can someone help?

Would you try logging in to the Spaceport first? Then try downloading it again. Spaceport can be kind of finicky. I hope that helps.

[Krevsin]

I've tried, but I don't have a Kerbal Spaceport account and trying to register seems to do nothing.

[Krevsin]

I apologise for the double post, but the spaceport download works now. The mod works just fine in 0.22 after the additions to the .cfg files.

[Kethevin]

Is there any downside to using this with the .cfg adjustments, or is it better to wait for the .22 update?

I'd like to start using it now, with my new game, I'm just not sure what might be changing with it in the next update.

Thanks!

[UberFuber]

1. This is still a Work In Progress, and I did not want to mess up someone's game if they decided to try it out. I will remove the _TAC from the resource names for the final release. Also note that you can easily change the names to whatever you want, including localizing them to other languages.

May I suggest that WasteWater to be renamed to Sewage? Seems a bit weird to see a camel-cased word amongst other, non-camel cased words.

2. In real life, we can recycle CO₂ back into usage oxygen. It just is not very efficient yet, and it requires another chemical reactant. Or we can make an algae hydroponics pod to do it (very heavy). My plan is to add recyclers for all of the waste resources back into good resources: CO₂->O₂, WasteWater -> (clean) Water, and CO₂, Water, Waste (fertilizer) -> Food, O₂.

I would really love this! Especially if its setup so that conservation of mass is obeyed.

3. I did not want to deal with waste management in my mod. I would prefer to make it recyclable, see #2.

I like the way you think.

I've always envision that, with life-support needed, player would build various life-support recycling stations.

If you want, I've some suggestion on recycling mechanism.

Distillation/Electrolosys: Can convert WasteWater -> Water using just electricity.

Greenhouse: Consumes Waste, CO2 and Electricity (for lighting and heating). Produce Food and Oxygen. The ratio of Food and Oxygen produce (and conversely, Waste and CO2 consumed) should match the ratio Kerbal consume/produce. Fairly heavy (perhaps several tons needed to sustain 1 kerbalnaut indefinitely)

This may promote a network of "farming" stations (manned or unmanned), where it consist of several greenhouses and large containers for food, waste, water, sewage, oxygen and CO2. Spacecrafts on a long journey would dock here, transfer waste, sewage and CO2 out and transfer in food, water and oxygen before continuing their journey, leaving the farming stations to convert them back to useable products.

4. Yes, I know that my containers are ugly. I am a professional programmer (10 years), but I am new to modeling and texturing. Did you see regex's replacement textures? Or Talisar's "Spherical and Toridal Tank Pack"? There is also a lot of parts in other mods, like KASPAR, that can be repurposed for life support storage -- for personal use only until the mod owner releases some or gives permission to release some.

[TaranisElsu]

May I suggest that WasteWater to be renamed to Sewage? Seems a bit weird to see a camel-cased word amongst other, non-camel cased words.

I would prefer the name Garbage over Sewage. It is supposed to represent other kinds of waste too, like the inedible parts of food (bones & rinds) and some packaging waste (although that should be minimized in a closed-loop system). BTW, ElectricCharge is also camel cased (and not mine).

Edit: Oops, I misread your comment. Waste is supposed to represent garbage like above. Waste water is supposed to represent liquid Kerbal waste, plus dirty water from hygienic needs (washing hands, dishes, bathing) and dehumidifying the air (because of sweat). That is why so much is created per day.

This may promote a network of "farming" stations (manned or unmanned), where it consist of several greenhouses and large containers for food, waste, water, sewage, oxygen and CO2. Spacecrafts on a long journey would dock here, transfer waste, sewage and CO2 out and transfer in food, water and oxygen before continuing their journey, leaving the farming stations to convert them back to useable products.

I would prefer the greenhouses to be manned, with a fairly high requirement to represent the labor that would be needed. And I am thinking the greenhouses should only produce food every 30-days or so to represent the growing cycle -- and for the challenge.

Edited November 8, 2013 by TaranisElsu
Misread

[regex]

I would prefer the greenhouses to be manned, with a fairly high requirement to represent the labor that would be needed. And I am thinking the greenhouses should only produce food every 30-days or so to represent the growing cycle -- and for the challenge.

I like the cut of your jib, sir. I'm hoping you want to avoid the problem of recyclers pretty much invalidating the entire reason for having life support by having a 1:1 return.

Of course, I'm just going to remove them from the parts list anyway so maybe I shouldn't be making suggestions about them; I prefer my life support to have meaning.

[Corax]

I would prefer the greenhouses to be manned, with a fairly high requirement to represent the labor that would be needed. And I am thinking the greenhouses should only produce food every 30-days or so to represent the growing cycle -- and for the challenge.

Consider once a greenhouse has been started, it should be possible to put out a relatively constant supply (with relatively constant care). Mission planners would certainly try and optimize the plant composition for such a case.

Also I'd assume – at least for manned missions – that a greenhouse module isn't launched with barren hydroponds, but pre-seeded and possibly already close to the first harvest; sending one on an unmanned, long duration cargo flight would be a different scenario though.

[Patupi]

Perhaps make the greenhouse build up waste (as you'd expect) but if it maxes out the crops start to die off. The only way to clear this is with Kerbals on-site. This would mean you need Kerbals to tend the gardens, but not neccessarily continuously

[Minwaabi]

Looks like I found a bug. Kerbal's weren't filling up on electricity when they went out on EVA. This seems to only happen when there is one 100Charge battery and a MKI command pod, and it only happens after the craft has flown. It doesn't have to fly far, a few meters or 100km and it will show up, but not on the pad (pre-flight). Two batteries is fine, no batteries is fine, but that combination causes issues.

With a little more testing I've found out that this also happens for the other stock single seat command pods and a 100 Charge battery. Multiple pods don't seem to get this bug either and the MK2 command pod is fine. So the problem seems to be a single seat command pod totaling 150 charge.

Edited November 9, 2013 by Minwaabi

[TaranisElsu]

Looks like I found a bug. Kerbal's weren't filling up on electricity when they went out on EVA. This seems to only happen when there is one 100Charge battery and a MKI command pod, and it only happens after the craft has flown. It doesn't have to fly far, a few meters or 100km and it will show up, but not on the pad (pre-flight). Two batteries is fine, no batteries is fine, but that combination causes issues.

With a little more testing I've found out that this also happens for the other stock single seat command pods and a 100 Charge battery. Multiple pods don't seem to get this bug either and the MK2 command pod is fine. So the problem seems to be a single seat command pod totaling 150 charge.

I will have to see if that still happens in the new version. I have changed around the way that it gets the resources to fill the EVA spacesuit. Thanks for the bug report.

https://github.com/taraniselsu/TacLifeSupport/issues/1

Edited November 10, 2013 by TaranisElsu

[Lalwcat]

So, grabbed the recent link in the OP from Spaceport and threw it in, then grabbed the latest GameData from the github and tossed it in, I get this when I click the LS button: http://i.imgur.com/wD8kgcD.jpg

No resource draw after timewarp either.

Any ideas what I'm doing wrong?

Alt+F2 shows lots of Null reference exceptions. Hitting escape caused none of the buttons in the menu to work (couldnt space center, no action on click, couldn't revert (no buttons on the revert menu)).

Removing the TAC folder from GameData resolved the null reference and menu errors

Edited November 10, 2013 by Lalwcat

[Jivaii]

Grabbed the BioFuels mod, now working on modifying it for TAC Life Support resources in such a way that it isn't overkill and balanced by needing multiple of each type. (All produce oxygen, but the rates at which they produce other goods I'm trying to balance out)

Would love some assistance in sorting out the values needed. My goal is that one of each of the three greenhouses needed for every 4 kerbals (more of one type of green house tilts the balance out of wack is my idea)

[whit89]

Can somebody please run me through step by step exactly how i can add this to the tech tree?

[Lalwcat]

In addition to my previous post, is there anyway to have kerbals replace the materials they took out when they go on EVA? Right now if I put a single command pod into orbit and have a kerbal get out, they take half the electric charge. If they get back in, I have 25/50 or so. If I get out again to get another EVA report and get back in, I'm at 13. This makes getting in and out to grab EVA reports without having solar panels impossible, since you'll drain all of your electric charge.

[sidfu]

Can somebody please run me through step by step exactly how i can add this to the tech tree?

go to your squad folder and look at the part .cfg u will see 2 lings above cost saying tech requriment. copy past those into the tac .cfg above the cost. would post what it is but not on my computer at moment