[1.0.5] TAC Life Support v0.11.2.1 [12Dec]

[rosenkranz]

Yes. You will need an air intake (for jet engines), and the Air Filter part. The Air Filter will filter the oxygen out of the IntakeAir. This only works on planets with an oxygen-containing atmosphere like Kerbin and Laythe. Note that Kerbals will not consume Oxygen while on Kerbin under a reasonable altitude (pressure greater than 0.2 atmo, which is approximately 8km). They will consume Oxygen on Laythe because I am assuming the air is not the right mix for Kerbals to breathe, because of the EVA reports from the surface.

Would it be possible to get CO2 out of atmosphere's like Duna for use in the recycler?

[seanth]

A question about TACLS' ability to keep track of resources for unfocused craft: does it apply only to TACLS-related resources, or does it keep track of all resources and modules on a craft? For example, if you are running TACLS and Kethane, and have a command module with a kethane drill, if you start drilling, select a different ship, and the return focus later, would the amount of kethane have increased?

[TaranisElsu]

Would it be possible to get CO2 out of atmosphere's like Duna for use in the recycler?

We could make a part that does that. Which planets make sense to do that for them?

A question about TACLS' ability to keep track of resources for unfocused craft: does it apply only to TACLS-related resources, or does it keep track of all resources and modules on a craft? For example, if you are running TACLS and Kethane, and have a command module with a kethane drill, if you start drilling, select a different ship, and the return focus later, would the amount of kethane have increased?

No. I do not actually do anything with a craft while it is unloaded. I just keep track of the last time that I updated things, so when a craft is reloaded I know how much time to "catch up." It will have no effect on other mods.

[seanth]

It will have no effect on other mods.

That's too bad. A dll that just stored a state and updated the resources on refocus would be a great stand alone.

[jrandom]

We could make a part that does that. Which planets make sense to do that for them?

Duna and Eve for sure.

[eggrobin]

A thought about the Waste resource

I humbly suggest that the solid Waste produced by Kerbals is methanedoil (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Methanediol)

I don't think methanediol (methane-di-ol by the way, not methanedoil) makes much sense as Waste, considering that this mod assumes kerbals to be rescaled humans. Human solid waste is definitely not methanediol. Moreover, Waste encompasses more than this, as it also includes graphite from CO2 recycling, whatever remains from the reprocessing of waste water, etc.

As far as methanogenesis is concerned, bear in mind that it produces methane, carbon dioxide, and water, not oxygen.

Regarding methane though, you can get that from the Sabatier reaction (I gave the specs for a Sabatier reactor a couple of pages ago, just replace the Waste output with a [WhateverYourMethaneResourceIs] output). Remember to conserve mass.

On an unrelated note, I made an electrolyser model inspired by Elektron (it's basically Elektron without any of that fancy blast-proof housing and inert atmosphere stuff, fitted awkwardly inside a cylinder). Suggestions and criticism are welcome (I have no experience with either modeling or texturing, so it's going to take a while to finish).

Edited December 11, 2013 by eggrobin

[ExEvolution]

A hydroponics growroom would be a great addition to this mod IMO.

I'm thinking its a heavy, manned (1 or 2 kerbals) part similar to the hitchhiker part but much larger and fit for space stations with extended stay in space. I think it should have a period of say... 90 or 120 days of the module being manned and fully resourced before it starts producing food, so you would be required to add supplies to use during the startup period. Then it would consume CO2, waste, waste water, and electrical charge after being processed into plant nutrients, and produce Food, Purified Water, and Oxygen.

A futuristic grow lab in space to add life for extended missions where just tanks won't do, and much more interesting than an air scrubbers for CO2 processing, and a use for waste rather than having to send missions with tanks to exchange supplies all the time.

Entering the atmosphere could also reset production. It also makes me think about slow Kethane production, which would of course permanently consume the resources if you burn the fuel, requiring resupply

Edited December 11, 2013 by ExEvolution

[jrandom]

Another "yes!" here for hydroponics or other food-growing technology. Maybe a really heavy hydroponics lab that turns waste into food and o2 (maybe water? there's water in plants, right?), and a non-organic convert-waste-to-food module that doesn't produce o2 and isn't as efficient at generating food, but uses less energy and weighs less?

[AbeS]

We could make a part that does that. Which planets make sense to do that for them?.

I know ferram is actually working on adding different gases for the planets on his next update, maybe ask him?

[KerbMav]

Is it possible to deactivate certain parts of this mod, namely the heat management?

[ExEvolution]

Heat? Are you using KSP Interstellar?

[Ralathon]

Is it possible to deactivate certain parts of this mod, namely the heat management?

If you mean heat as in "wasteheat", thats KSP interstellar. not TACLS. if you mean the energy consumption, yes you can edit that. You just need to click the LS button in the space center view and edit the energy value to read 0. I have it set as 1/10th of the default myself, I found it prohibitively high in my early career mode games.

[KerbMav]

Ah, thanks, so I should seek my answer over there.

I am not using any of these two mods right now, I am adding one new challenge in each new save (after bigger patches) and a lifesupport will be most likely in my next career in .23 (after all my mods have had an update if necessary).

Energy consumption is another thing though, so good to know!

How does TAC LS deal with solar panels on inactive vessels?

Crewed pods come stocked with 1 day (24 hours) worth of resources.

When a Kerbal goes on EVA, he takes a half day (12 hours) of each resource with him in the EVA suit, taking from the pod that he was in.

If two Kerbals leave a three man pod, is the third guy left to die?

[Ralathon]

Ah, thanks, so I should seek my answer over there.

I am not using any of these two mods right now, I am adding one new challenge in each new save (after bigger patches) and a lifesupport will be most likely in my next career in .23 (after all my mods have had an update if necessary).

Energy consumption is another thing though, so good to know!

How does TAC LS deal with solar panels on inactive vessels?

It doesn't. It just freezes energy consumption when you unfocus the craft as of 0.6. Your only time limit is by your supply of O2, water and food.

If two Kerbals leave a three man pod, is the third guy left to die?

No, the 1 day of resources means 1 day of resources in a fully crewed state. So if 1 unit of life support can sustain a single kerbal for a day then the Mk1-2 pod would contain 3 units. When 2 out of 3 kerbals go on an EVA they both take half an unit of LS leaving 2 days worth of snacks and air to the last guy.

This is occasionally useful. I recall a mission where I intended to send a single guy on a apollo style landing (munar orbit rendezvouz). Sadly, a random greysuit sneaked aboard and it wasn't until after the ejection burn that I noticed him. So i had to dump him overboard to save Bob.

Edited December 11, 2013 by Ralathon

[WafflesToo]

It doesn't. It just freezes energy consumption when you unfocus the craft as of 0.6. Your only time limit is by your supply of O2, water and food.

No, the 1 day of resources means 1 day of resources in a fully crewed state. So if 1 unit of life support can sustain a single kerbal for a day then the Mk1-2 pod would contain 3 units. When 2 out of 3 kerbals go on an EVA they both take half an unit of LS leaving 2 days worth of snacks and air to the last guy.

This is occasionally useful. I recall a mission where I intended to send a single guy on a apollo style landing (munar orbit rendezvouz). Sadly, a random greysuit sneaked aboard and it wasn't until after the ejection burn that I noticed him. So i had to dump him overboard to save Bob.

It's 'The Cold Equasion' all over again!

[seanth]

As far as methanogenesis is concerned, bear in mind that it produces methane, carbon dioxide, and water, not oxygen.

Doh. You are absolutely correct.

Mea culpa.

[jrandom]

Will electric charge usage for non-active ships be implemented at some point?

[WafflesToo]

Will electric charge usage for non-active ships be implemented at some point?

I don't think it really can be unless there's a fundamental change to the game engine itself. Tracking the power use was easy, but power production systems don't work when the ship is unloaded. Had the same problem with RemoteTech.

[jrandom]

Odd. I thought KSP itself tracked power production for inactive vessels.

[C4pt.Miles]

First:

Really love the mod!

This one is always on.^^

Second:

Will there be "Waste Heat" on it?

Like in the Shadow you have to heat you spacecraft and in sunlight you have to cool it?

all the best

[regex]

Will there be "Waste Heat" on it?

Like in the Shadow you have to heat you spacecraft and in sunlight you have to cool it?

That's why you have electrical charge drain; it's already been abstracted.

[WafflesToo]

Odd. I thought KSP itself tracked power production for inactive vessels.

Nope, if its unloaded it has no activity whatsoever. Try it, launch a probe on a stack of batteries and a bunch of power-draining accessories. Leave the lights on and go to another unit more than 3 km away. Let run a few years or so then go back. You'll have the same charge as when you left.

[TaranisElsu]

I have been asked to weigh in on the discussion here: http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/61296-Build-a-Centralized-Modder-Unified-Resource-Catalog

What are your opinions? It would mean giving up the convenient 1 unit per Kerbal per day resource consumption rates.

Keep in mind that the actual amount consumed, the mass, would not change. The only thing that would change is the resource display. Kerbals would still need 0.317 kg of Food, 1.798 kg of Water, and 0.429 kg of Oxygen per 24 hours, but it would change to something like 1.798 units (liters) of Water and 1.490 units (liters) of Oxygen per 24 hours instead of 1 unit of Water and 1 unit of Oxygen per 24 hours.

I could offer config files for both, but that would make it difficult for people to make parts for my mod. They would also have to provide two config files for each part.

[regex]

I have been asked to weigh in on the discussion here: http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/61296-Build-a-Centralized-Modder-Unified-Resource-Catalog

What are your opinions?

IMO that suggestion contains four fifths pipe dream and one fifth actually achievable goal. asmi is correct in pointing out that densities may vary for gaseous resources due to pressurization differences, not to mention such nebulous concepts such as "food". Maybe everyone could agree on the density of "water" but I think it is up to each mod to define the resources themselves. Besides, it's not like someone is going to be using two life support mods at once.

Of course, it's up to you, in the end. I'd still mod your mod back to the convenient values because that is what I value, but if you value standardization I can respect that.

[jrandom]

Aw man, right in the middle of my RSS/RO rescale for TAC.

For life support, having resources in units-per-day or units-per-hour is super-handy. If we switch to the actual amounts in kg, it will be crucial that the text description for each part that carries that resource display how much a kerbal uses per hour/day/whatever so that missions can be planned out without having to dig up yet another chart.

... unless the life support mod could somehow in real-time add the (x days/hours support per kerbal) text dynamically...

Personally, I prefer the units for life support to be time-per-kerbal instead of mass.