Come back old ASAS - all is forgiven!

[ComradeGoat]

Your SAS is holding it's heading fine, and returning to it as well. The nose up, like you said is from the imbalance on your thrust, no surprise there. And the SAS doesn't aggressively go hard over trying to compensate for stuff like a dog with a bone anymore, but it is correcting, and is coming back to settle on the original heading.

No it isn't. It settles on the original heading when I turn the engines off. With thrust on, it settles on a heading 10-13º away.

However, at your altitude and orbital velocity, your horizon is going to rotate away from you around 12 degrees per minute, and your video is almost that long. It looks as if your ship is returning to the same absolute attitude over the time elapsed on the video, and the horizon has dropped the expected amount. Given the inaccuracies inherent to the navball, the other degree or so could just be instrumentation/reading error.

That is not what is happening here. Look at the video closely. Watch what happens when I apply thrust, when it's sustained, and when it's removed. Pay close attending to the throttle, the nav ball, and the pitch indicator.

[_Aramchek_]

I've also been having problems, on a fresh instal, and I never use mods.

I've been compensating for it and learning how to work around, but, the fact that it no longer locks in your heading when you let go of the controls is a bad idea, it works for those who already like to "fly" with mechjeb or as Scott Manley does, constantly adjusting this or that, but for me it's a huge step backwards.

I don't think it's worth all the current "yelling" at squad either though, likely the majority of those testing prefer that style of flying would be my guess, so to them, there was no problem.

I, however, never had problems with my rockets shaking themselves apart because I always strengthen the structure of my rockets realistically to counter the inherent wobbliness of the unity engine and VASTLY prefer the old ASAS which I could point and forget without needing to babysit the ship te entire time, or without stacking a ridiculous number of reaction wheels to get some semblance of stability.

Edited July 25, 2013 by _Aramchek_

[Sir Nahme]

money on the problem craft not being fully symetrical on the lift thrust and mass axis'

you definitely have to increase your control authority and balance on assymetrical craft now to compensate but other than that I'm loving the new asas

[ComradeGoat]

I think I understand this issue more now after watching some of the videos in this thread.. They should just make it so that it locks on more like the old asas when tapping F or turning SAS off and then back on. I think the main reason I didnt notice this issue was because I have a habit of stopping most of the momentum before enganging SAS.

It's drifting for me when I start from dead stable. Ship is slightly out of balance, and it doesn't attempt to correct for that, or rather it does, but on a different heading. :-(

[Sardonyx]

The vessel I'm having most trouble with weighs less than 10 tonnes on the runway.

Would you be willing to post a copy of the vehicle? I'm happy to try it out on my system and help narrow down if it's a bug related to a particular install.

[Amoun]

I wasnt having problems with ASAS.......or so I thought.

My contraptions hold their course (or maybe so far) but once I leave the atmosphere, I cant turn SAS off and I can not separate or do anything at all. Must be a bug.

The game is still going, just doesn't respond.

Maybe I am missing something? hmm

[ComradeGoat]

Would you be willing to post a copy of the vehicle? I'm happy to try it out on my system and help narrow down if it's a bug related to a particular install.

Gladly. It's here:

http://www.sarahlizzy.com/Labrys.craft

It behaves well enough at low altitude and low speed. Take it to orbit and play with it there.

1 to init.

2 toggles rockets.

3 toggles jet and intakes.

ETA: 4 toggles solar panels

Edited July 25, 2013 by ComradeGoat

[Captain Sierra]

I tried to justify the new SAS before but after finally flying with it, wow. NO GOOD! It can't even keep this rocket straight vertical.

Yes, I have power, yes, I have SAS equipped reaction wheels, yes, I have winglets, yes, I have extra torque on the lower stage. No, it won't hold vertical. It immediately drifts off to a few degrees westward gravity burn. I cut the test at 10k. If I'd let it go, it probably would have slowly and steadily gotten worse with altitude.

Craft file is available on request.

[Neomatt]

I wasnt having problems with ASAS.......or so I thought.

My contraptions hold their course (or maybe so far) but once I leave the atmosphere, I cant turn SAS off and I can not separate or do anything at all. Must be a bug.

The game is still going, just doesn't respond.

Maybe I am missing something? hmm

Probe? Stupid question, but... do you have any electric power left?

[Sardonyx]

I wasnt having problems with ASAS.......or so I thought.

My contraptions hold their course (or maybe so far) but once I leave the atmosphere, I cant turn SAS off and I can not separate or do anything at all. Must be a bug.

The game is still going, just doesn't respond.

Maybe I am missing something? hmm

Did you run out of electricity? The new reaction wheels consume it turn the ship. If your ship ran completely out of juice you'll basically have no control.

[Weatherman159]

Please note that it appears that FAR is essentially nerfing the SAS to a non-functioning state. So, if using FAR, you're going to be having some SAS issues.

I have noticed no such nerfing. SAS works exactly the same way as in stock.

[Captain Sierra]

Even manned command pods need power now. I do think the power consumption is a bit high though.

[FleetAdmiralJ]

Yes, I have power, yes, I have SAS equipped reaction wheels, yes, I have winglets, yes, I have extra torque on the lower stage. No, it won't hold vertical. It immediately drifts off to a few degrees westward gravity burn. I cut the test at 10k. If I'd let it go, it probably would have slowly and steadily gotten worse with altitude.

Craft file is available on request.

Are you just using reaction wheels or are you using the advanced stabilizer? JUST reaction wheels won't automatically steer your ship.

[Sardonyx]

I tried to justify the new SAS before but after finally flying with it, wow. NO GOOD! It can't even keep this rocket straight vertical.

Yes, I have power, yes, I have SAS equipped reaction wheels, yes, I have winglets, yes, I have extra torque on the lower stage. No, it won't hold vertical. It immediately drifts off to a few degrees westward gravity burn. I cut the test at 10k. If I'd let it go, it probably would have slowly and steadily gotten worse with altitude.

Craft file is available on request.

Could you send me a copy of your craft file? I'm happy to test it out and see if I have the same issue.

[turban10]

Not sure if this has been mentioned in the past 49 pages, but I too was having the same problem and two things really helped

1) Even though I thought I uninstalled KPS from my Windows 7 machine, the Kerbal Space Program folder was still left in the "~\Steam\Steamapps\Common" folder. Delete that first, then download the entire update from Steam. If you do that, you will get a clean install.

2) I normally place fins on my rockets so they have control in the atmostphere. No matter how many reaction wheels I put on, I would completely lose control. Out of a whim, i removed the fins, and the rocket came under complete control, just like we saw in the previews.

Give it a try. Hope it works for you, as it did for me.

[Sardonyx]

Gladly. It's here:

http://www.sarahlizzy.com/Labrys.craft

It behaves well enough at low altitude and low speed. Take it to orbit and play with it there.

1 to init.

2 toggles rockets.

3 toggles jet and intakes.

ETA: 4 toggles solar panels

Awesome I'll give it a go and report back shortly

[Fleb]

Do you have a joystick Cpt Sierra? Someone had a similar rocket with similar behaviour, and when he unplugged his stick, it flew straight. Not enough deadzone on the stick probably.

I put together a big rocket for landing on the new Mun. Except for the turns, this is all hands off and it virtually flies itself with SAS on. It gets a little wobble when the SRBs hit half fuel, probably not aligned perfectly.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1A3kFznSBJA

https://docs.google.com/file/d/0BxRJ34iC2Pa0NC1aTXBuaUZwWUk/edit?usp=sharing

Edited July 25, 2013 by Fleb

[KOCOUR]

New SAS works great! Just tried it out.

[turban10]

Try this: remove the winglets and try again with the ASAS and SAS. When i did that, it flew like an arrow.

[Torham234]

Might as well post this here as well:

The issue is entirely replicable with the stock Aeris 3A. You just need to take it to higher altitude. Here is my attempt to capture the problem. Basically it seems that every time pleyer does any input on the steering, the trim set by ASAS is reset. Watch closely at 1:35. The craft is holding the set heading, but the moment I touch the roll key the nose dives down to the prograde marker.

Edited July 25, 2013 by Torham234

[Captain Sierra]

I have both. The stabilizer by the cockpit and additional reaction wheels on the lower stage to provide extra torque.

[bogpad]

The craft is holding the set heading, but the moment I touch the roll key the nose dives down to the prograde marker.]

thats indeed something I encountered aswell, doesn't make it impossible to fly planes and/or rockets, but there certainly is something that is not as it is supposed to be.

[Captain Sierra]

Do you have a joystick Cpt Sierra? Someone had a similar rocket with similar behaviour, and when he unplugged his stick, it flew straight. Not enough deadzone on the stick probably.

I put together a big rocket for landing on the new Mun. Except for the turns, this is all hands off and it virtually flies itself with SAS on. It gets a little wobble when the SRBs hit half fuel, probably not aligned perfectly.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1A3kFznSBJA

1) I can't wait to see that rocket.

2) My update was a hard install so the settings.cfg has been overwritten (I'm sure). My joystick (I do have one) has not been plugged in or configured on my stock backup KSP since updating. There is no way that's the problem.

For those who want it, here is the craft file. https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B_BVD9gAcd6BTS1laDhPN0llLW8/

And this is what it is for. Look closely before asking if I am missing something.

I didn't action group the solar panels (for if you reach orbit; and sorry).

Abort triggers parachute, fires sepatrons, and decouples the command pod (with running kill tallies, I'm into abort sequences to save kerbals now XD)

[FleetAdmiralJ]

I have both. The stabilizer by the cockpit and additional reaction wheels on the lower stage to provide extra torque.

Hmm, how is your center of lift? On my first rocket I had a center liquid fuel engine and two solids on the side. If I fired just the solids and not the liquid, it tended to tilt, but if I did all three it went up straight as an arrow. I'm not sure why it would do that, but it seemed to matter. I don't know if it was the ASAS or just luck (though it still seemed to hold things pretty straight in space too)

[Captain Sierra]

The sepatrons are slightly offcenter (to get the pod clear of rocket flying at mach 2) but that SHOULD cause it to lean toward the camera because of where they are. It leans left, westward, therefore they are not causing the issue but you can download the craft file above and test it with and without.