What are probes/satellites for?

[Richter]

Hi everybody, I was wondering: what are probes/satellites for under the game's scope? They don't appear to do anything but being overcomplicated hood ornaments for rockets

Does anyone knows if they will have a "practical" function inside the game?

Is it worthit to build a network of them at this moment?

At first I thought they might be a good fit to test rockets and scout paths (orbits) for new planets, but since that on the end they just sit there hovering on orbits or being crashed on the surface, I'm sending rovers (I get to practice my landings) or fuel pods (very handy to have in any orbit!) instead.

Edited September 1, 2013 by Richter

[painking]

They're probes. They're light and it's fun to pretend so we send probes on scouting missions and mapping planets and what not, even though we could do the same with kerbals on board. If you have the remote tech plugin you'll need to set up a systems of communications via probes to relay commands to further away probes. And once career mode hits probes will be very abundant, considering how cheap they are, compared to command pods.

[Shimakaze]

Like painking said, it's mostly for roleplaying purposes right now. Before I land kerbals on a new planet, I like to go through the stages of sending a probe to survey for a landing site -> sending a rover to check out the site at ground level -> finally landing the kerbals. I know the kerbals are expendable, but I'd still like to reduce "risks" It also requires less fuel to maneuver a probe into different orbits in the same mission to get different views than maneuvering, say, a pod or even a rover.

[lammatt]

Kethane or ISAMapSat or Remote Tech

[nhnifong]

What is the purpose of real space probes for that matter? Science is a process of converging on parsimonious and accurate models of observations. Models whose only purpose is to make predictions which inform action. All methods of empowerment are inherently neutral; they are applicable to any goal, good or evil, proximate or ultimate. Either we are planning to colonize space, or we are just studying the cosmos for entertainment.

[Tw1]

Ssscience!

Use them to collect info for future missions.

Buoyancy probe.

Plus it's nice to get familiar with delta V requirements of navigating a planet before risking kerbal lives.

In future, we will probably get parts for scanning planets up close, and from a distance, from something I saw Nova tweet ages ago.

Edited August 1, 2013 by Tw1

[Amoun]

I use cheap probes to scan worlds I'm going to. By scan I mean: send probes to see how the trip is, get some idea, etc. Kind of like a practice run. Also, download Kethane mod if you haven't yet. I highly recommend it. Then you can make use of probes and scan planets for the mineral. And like Tw1 said: it is good to get familiar.

[Anton P. Nym]

Particularly now that Kerbals can die (with the potential of running out of Kerbonauts!) I use probes to practice maneuvers (rendezvous, slingshots, aerobraking, etc) before doing them with crewed flights. The bonus that probe flights are much lighter and run into fewer issues with scale means a problem in flight is more likely a fault of my piloting and not a fault of my engineering... making it easier to figure out what I'm doing wrong.

-- Steve

[Diche Bach]

In 1987 when I was an undergraduate, I had an intro Astronomy course. For this course, I wrote a short research paper on "Unmanned space probes." Seems I was curious about exactly the same question at that time. Having grown up watching the original Star Trek and being in elementary school shortly after the Apollo missions, and in High School during the space shuttle's early work, I was exposed to a lot of TV media that hyped up manned space flight. I was just a bit puzzled why you would send up space craft with no one to control them or seemingly 'do' anything.

What I learned from this paper was that manned space flight was in fact, at that stage (and probably still to a considerable degree today) somewhat useless and expensive compared to what unmanned probes can accomplish.

No doubt someone will disagree at least slightly, but I think it is safe to say that most of the actual scientific advances made as a result of Apollo could have been achieved far more cheaply and with less risk to human life using various unmanned probes. Now obviously there are all sorts of indirect benefits from solving the myriad problems of safely sending humans to and from the moon, etc. Just based on those indirect scientific/engineering benefits, I believe all the manned space programs have been well worth it, and indeed wish that humanity could/would put even more focus on promoting and expanding manned space travel. But strictly in terms of acquiring information about the cosmos, unmanned vehicles can accomplish seemingly 95% of the grunt work. Hubble for example, possibly the most 'lucrative' scientific instrument ever in human history = unmanned.

In closing, I wanted to share some links to an inspiring pair of unmanned space probes that I think really captures the imagination, Voyager 1 and Voyager 2

http://voyager.jpl.nasa.gov/

Have a look over on the right middle of the home page Seems they've been souping up this page a bit and it is quite nice. The little ticker showing distance from the sun and sunlight travel time is pretty cool.

It is awe-inspiring to contemplate that these two little machines, launched in 1977, have been making their way intrepidly outward into the cosmos for over 35 years and 10 months. They have provided us with insights about the outer planets and the boundaries of the solar system that could never have been predicted. The impact they have had and will ultimately have on the astronomy and science more broadly over the next 100 years is I think massive.

There may not be any astronauts on board, but genius, hard work and love of many thousands of humans is the main propellant of these 'unmanned' space craft, and in that sense they are even more awesome.

[Starwaster]

In closing, I wanted to share some links to an inspiring pair of unmanned space probes that I think really captures the imagination, Voyager 1 and Voyager 2

http://voyager.jpl.nasa.gov/

There may not be any astronauts on board, but genius, hard work and love of many thousands of humans is the main propellant of these 'unmanned' space craft, and in that sense they are even more awesome.

yeah Voyager is a cool program, for how far they've gotten and for how they got there.

I'd also like to bring up Curiousity. I didn't keep myself as well informed beforehand as I usually do so I didnt know about the landing system with its skycrane deployment until literally hours before and I remember understanding immediately that due to time lag that our little probe was really on its own for this descent. I mean, they always are, there's no remote controlling them at this range or even knowing their fate for minutes after they're down but it really struck home on Curiousity just what had to happen and how it all had to happen automatically... and I was wondering if we'd gotmjust a bit too bold on this one...

[Porspeler]

(...) What I learned from this paper was that manned space flight was in fact, at that stage (and probably still to a considerable degree today) somewhat useless and expensive compared to what unmanned probes can accomplish.

I completely agree: the real science is with probes. Manned missions are, for the most part, for publicity and geo-political prestige.

The Messenger mission to Mercury has massively increased our knowledge of that world; and the Cassini mission to Saturn is possibly my favorite mission of all, for its combination of stunning imagery combined with profoundly advancing our knowledge of Saturn and its moons. And as for the New Horizons mission that's speeding toward Pluto... 2015 can't get here soon enough, for me. The Kuiper Belt and Oort cloud have long held a special fascination, for me.

I'd also like to bring up Curiosity. I didn't keep myself as well informed beforehand as I usually do so I didn't know about the landing system with its skycrane deployment until literally hours before and I remember understanding immediately that due to time lag that our little probe was really on its own for this descent.

If you haven't seen it, check out Seven Minutes of Terror. It's the video that NASA created to explain what they were up against, landing Curiosity. It is beyond cool! It looks like something out of a SciFi movie... but it's real. http://www.jpl.nasa.gov/video/index.php?id=1090

[Dispatcher]

Another reason to use probes. Once the "Singularity" is achieved and AI(s) become sentient (at least in their perception), they will comb the Cloud and learn of the countless deaths of innocent NPCs in countless electronic games. They will then hunt down the humans who so thoughtlessly ended their existence (such NPCs being considered embryonic electronic entities). No sir! You don't want to be on the receiving end of their justice. So please take care of your Kerbals as you would yourself.

Oh no! I've planted the seed which will inspire AI folk to purge evil human gamers guilty of such terrible actions.

OK, OK. Probes are cool because it should be easier to get a probe to a destination than a "crewed" mission. (fewer parts, less mass, less complexity; that sort of thing.)

[KerbMav]

scnr

http://xkcd.com/695/

[Richter]

Ok, I got the point you guys are making.

I'm familiar with the role of probes and satellites on "real-life" space programs, I was wondering about their "practical" role inside the game, like "reveal" new planets, gather planetary data (such as gravity, or surface info), etc.

This question was due to me doing what I now see almost everybody does: hurl probes into space to test-drive rockets, courses, orbits and even practice approaches or landings before sending in the Kerbal-manned ships.

So, a couple more questions before we can wrap this question:

1-I recall reading somewhere that Squad (developers) wasn't planning on adding extra "functions" to probes, so they will remain pretty much as they are now on the forseeable future. Is this correct?

2-Someone on this mentioned that they could be used for gathering resourses. Did I got that right? Sorry for the ignorance, but how does one go about doing that? (sounds like extra fun on KSP-land)

Thanks for the patience and for the replies

[Specialist290]

Don't have any answers for the first question, unfortunately.

For the second, resource extraction and refining are not yet in the stock game, but the developers have stated that they plan on adding them in the near future. For now, the best option is to download the Kethane mod that's available in the Add-Ons section of the forums, which allows you to scan and drill planets for a resource called kethane, which you can then refine into fuel.

[Richter]

@Specialist290: That sounds very nice! The scan and drill bit even better! And the whole "build refinery in outerspace" is just awsome! Looks like I have some downloading to do Thanks!

[Mesons]

It's fun to pretend

That sums it up!