[1.8.1] Docking Port Alignment Indicator (Version 6.8.5 - Updated 12/14/19)

[RoboRay]

For some reason, I just like doing it with the docking cam more. I'm odd like that.

There's no docking like Gemini docking!

[LameLefty]

There's no docking like Gemini docking!

That is awesome for any number of reasons.

(But of course, for historical purists, we have to note that two Gemini vehicles never docked to one another despite the Gemini VI/VII rendezvous; they were incapable of doing so. The docking scheme was not androgynous and required one vehicle to have an active docking mechanism and the other to have a passive target to be clamped or grabbed by the active docking vehicle).

Still, very cool. I may have to download and play around with the Gemini vehicle mod!

[RoboRay]

I may have to download and play around with the Gemini vehicle mod!

Best cockpit in KSP!

Since it's modeled very closely on the real one, it leverages the real-world R&D that went into it. You end up with amazing visibility from those two tiny windows, because they are properly positioned right in front of your face and low enough that you can see not only straight forward but even below the plane of your eyes.

Squad could learn some great lessons in IVA design from studying the Gemini cockpit window arrangement. Stock capsule windows are pretty worthless, due to the way they are positioned. Even the Mk1 Cockpit has inferior forward visibility to this capsule.

Edited September 10, 2013 by RoboRay

[krenshala]

Best cockpit in KSP!

Since it's modeled very closely on the real one, it leverages the real-world R&D that went into it. You end up with amazing visibility from those two tiny windows, because they are properly positioned right in front of your face and low enough that you can see not only straight forward but even below the plane of your eyes.

Squad could learn some great lessons in IVA design from studying the Gemini cockpit window arrangement. Stock capsule windows are pretty worthless, due to the way they are positioned. Even the Mk1 Cockpit has inferior forward visibility to this capsule.

Even the B9 cockpits could use some improvement in this area.

[FastMINI42]

You can infer the relative lateral and vertical velocities from the drift rate of the needles. That's the beauty of analog gauges... they display not only the current value by their position but also the rate of change over time by the speed of their movement.

They do require a more intuitive (rather than purely mathematical) understanding of the process to glean all the available information from them, however.

Personally, I'd rather see this instrument remain simple than add redundant clutter. Even most of the information Cpt. Kipard is asking for is already there... simply presented graphically rather than via precise numerals.

But, so long as I can switch off the duplicate numerical displays, I certainly can't argue against them being an option.

Actually ... I just discovered when docking a small, very maneuverable docking tug that the yellow dot does show the speed in the X & Y planes relative to the center. I thought it a pointer or ... well, honestly, I didn't know what it was. Keeping that yellow dot centered between the green line and the gray line worked really well as that naturally decreased the velocity as I got closer to the docking axis and made for a neat, smooth docking maneuver. Much smoother when I was just going by raw numbers.

[NavyFish]

Afaik the white lines in Romfarer's mod are the same as the orange crosshairs in the DPAI, and if you look closely also the LDC is slightly off to the left and top. Maybe the DPAI scales differently and exaggerate "more" than the LDC.

Actually, no, this is incorrect. The orange Alignment Indicator has no analogue in Romfarer's, which is actually why I made this mod in the first place. The two gauges work quite differently, believe it or not. So while Romfarer's white lines are 'analogous' to my green lines and his red cross is similar to my yellow velocity vector, the actual behaviors are quite different, for reasons that are somewhat complex. Take a look at the source code if you'd like specifics, but in general it's because my gauge attempts to remain oriented relative to your own ship's heading (i.e. so "UP" on the gauge equals "UP" on your ship), while his (at least back when I used it), remained fixed relative to the target.

I'll try to explain the significance of each indication, using an an analogy. Pretend the target docking port is another person. You are standing in front of them, but they are looking slightly above your head and over your left shoulder (and are frozen in place, heh). Let's say they have a pair of horse blinders on, too, so they can only see straight ahead (no peripheral vision).

If you were to move your body so that you were standing directly in their line of sight, you would effectively be centering the green cross.

From that centered green cross position, if you were to turn so that you're looking directly into their eyes, you would effectively be centering the orange circle.

So let's say you've done both of these things, and are now standing directly in their line of sight while looking straight into their eyes. From here, note which compass direction you're facing (let's just deal with a 2-d plane in this example), let's say heading 085. Now, if you were to remain facing heading 085, but where to move somewhere else (i.e. step sideways and backwards a few times), you would effectively be un-centering the green cross on the gauge, but keeping the orange circle centered.

On the other hand, lets say you were back to standing directly in their line of sight, but now turned so that you were no longer looking into their eyes. Here, you'd effectively be keeping the green cross centered, while un-centering the orange circle. Had you turned to your left, the orange circle would move to the right, indicating you need to turn back to the right in order to be aligned properly.

Actually ... I just discovered when docking a small, very maneuverable docking tug that the yellow dot does show the speed in the X & Y planes relative to the center. I thought it a pointer or ... well, honestly, I didn't know what it was. Keeping that yellow dot centered between the green line and the gray line worked really well as that naturally decreased the velocity as I got closer to the docking axis and made for a neat, smooth docking maneuver. Much smoother when I was just going by raw numbers.

The yellow velocity vector shows the components of your velocity that are perpendicular to the docking port's normal vector (which extends out from the port). These components are then PROJECTED onto the gauge so that they are displayed relative to your current orientation (this is an example of what differs between my mod and Romfarer's). So, let's say for example you are directly on the imaginary line extending out from the target ports (aka it's normal vector) (your green cross will be centered), and you are also facing in the exact reciprocal of this vector (your orange circle will be centered). Now you use RCS to thrust to your right *L key on your keyboard). The yellow Vel Vector will move to the right. You stop thrusting (but obviously continue translating right), and then YAW your ship 90 degrees to the right (using the D key on your keyboard). The yellow Vel Vector will now be centered.

Let's say that instead of yawing to the right, you instead rolled 90 degrees clockwise, using the E key on your keyboard. Now, the yellow Vel Vector would be directly ABOVE the center of the gauge (i.e. 12 o'clock position), indicating that your translational velocity relative to the target is in the "UP" direction relative to your current orientation.

I hope this makes sense.. I know visualizing it would help quite a bit, but I'm not really up for making a tutorial at the moment (real life Navy has me quite busy) -- If one or two of the Advanced users would like to step in here and help out I would be deeply appreciative..

What I'm wondering if you could add an option to mirror the DPAI (either only one axis or on both axes). It's a bit confusing which direction you have to rotate to move the orange marker in the right direction.

Just always pretend that you are looking out of the port you have selected to control from - so the white crosshair is fixed to your ship. Turn so that your ship is oriented towards the orange circle: If it's up and to the left, pitch UP using S and yaw to the left using A. If the green cross is to the right, translate to the right using L.

Either way, both of these mods are fantastic. If I had to pick though, I'd rather Navyfish's DPAI be added to stock. The only change I'd make is to be able to toggle it on and off.

Well I do appreciate that. A future (and possibly the next) release will indeed have the ability to minimize the gauge.

Edited September 11, 2013 by NavyFish

[xZise]

First of all thanks (?) for your reply, but I actually know what the different crosshairs do:

• green = lateral offset
  
• orange = rotation relative to targeted docking port direction → centered orange crosshairs mean both docking ports are parallel to each other; You only need to move sideways/forward/backwards to dock
  
• yellow = change in offset

I'm pretty sure that the white lines (in LDC) display the same rotation as your orange one. There is no display (in LDC again, apart from the numbers) showing your required movement. But it's quite a time since I last used LDC.

On another note I really miss the camera part of it. I would love to see DPAI having a camera too.

Fabian

[NavyFish]

First of all thanks (?) for your reply, but I actually know what the different crosshairs do:

• green = lateral offset
  
• orange = rotation relative to targeted docking port direction → centered orange crosshairs mean both docking ports are parallel to each other; You only need to move sideways/forward/backwards to dock
  
• yellow = change in offset

I'm pretty sure that the white lines (in LDC) display the same rotation as your orange one. There is no display (in LDC again, apart from the numbers) showing your required movement. But it's quite a time since I last used LDC.

On another note I really miss the camera part of it. I would love to see DPAI having a camera too.

Fabian

It's possible I'm mis-remembering how LDC worked but either way, I hope you weren't taking offense to the post. There has been enough confusion regarding the gauge that I felt some further explanation would be helpful.

I don't forsee this mod implementing a camera similar to LDC for a number of reasons, but primarily due to the performance overhead it demands.

[capi3101]

Dunno if this question's been asked yet or not, but has anybody had any issues using the mod with multi-port docking? It works exceptionally with single ports, but so far I haven't had much luck trying to dock more than one at a time (I've got an old craft that utilizes a quad of medium clamp-o-trons for docking; I've been trying to put an adapter on it so that it can dock with a single Senior, but so far haven't managed to dock more than one port at once). Is there some kind of trick involved?

[NavyFish]

I've had success with multiple Clamp-o-tron Seniors. Check out the below pic - the orange tanks are connected to the rest of the ship using 3 Sr. docking ports abreast of each other.

Probably the biggest key is to make sure the parts line up IN THE VAB 100%. I'm not sure that a 1.5m single to quad adapter actually lines up perfectly with a 2.5m quad to single, for example. I know with certainty that a 1.5 binary adapter DOES NOT line up with a 2.5 binary adapter It can be very hard to visually see the misalignment in VAB. The only way to really guaruntee you have a match is to clone the part and flip it upside down.

Edited September 17, 2013 by NavyFish

[capi3101]

They align 100%; both the Thunderbolt and the adapter unit are using a quad adapter and 4 medium clamp-o-trons - built it in subassembly, yes they match up, yes the ports are facing outwards (just covering the usual noob bases there). I think I'm using the mod in the wrong way to try and get them to dock and I suspect it has something to do with how I've got the roll indicator positioned.

Seems to me some pics may be in order to better explain what's going on; I'll try to get a few ready to go this evening.

[BLUAV8R]

hey, whenever i select a docking port as a target i get weird lines all over the indidcator, any help?

[softweir]

Several possibilities.

• KSP has become corrupt - reinstall or get Steam to check the local files.
  
• Another mod is dumping data in the DA plugin - remove mods one-by-one until the problem goes away, then report it in the thread relevant to the last mod you removed.
  
• Hardware/driver issue - there could be a problem with your GPU. Do you have problems with other games?

That's all I can think of right now!

Richard.

[NavyFish]

Version 1 of the mod is probably still installed. Remove all versions of this mod and reinstall. Note that version 1 was installed in a different directory than the current version - check the warning text file in the install package. Please report back if this does or doesn't fix the problem.

[Ratzap]

A guy I know (yeah, informative right but hear it out) is complaining that his docking port window keeps going back to where it was rather than saving the position he moved it to. He's using 2.11 and I'm using 2.0 - mine saves the position no problem.

Is this a known issue? I told him to try deleting his config.xml completely and start KSP

[Diazo]

@Ratzap: Do any of his game settings save? That sounds like a windows security issue where he does not have write access to the directory the mod is stored in.

If this is the case things like changing the keybindings or issues loading saved games would also crop up.

D.

[etheoma]

Pleas pleas pleas could you add a reverse controls for the alignment HUD because I'm finding it really difficult to adjust. I will adjust its just that I can't be the only one that finds it unintuitive the way it is.

[xZise]

Pleas pleas pleas could you add a reverse controls for the alignment HUD because I'm finding it really difficult to adjust. I will adjust its just that I can't be the only one that finds it unintuitive the way it is.

Yeah the rotational offset it is somehow „reversed“ compared to the navball. You need to press A to move the marker right and D to move the marker to the left, while W moves the marker up and S moves the marker down, while on the navball all movements are inverted.

Fabian

[RoboRay]

The rotational indicator is not reversed. In avionics, this is what is known as a "command instrument." The rotation marker shows your target's orientation, not your own orientation. Your craft's rotation is referenced to the top of the instrument. If the mark is to the left, you roll your craft to the left. This brings your rotation closer to the target's rotation marker.

The moving markers don't show you where you are, they show you where you want to go. You're not really moving the mark, you're moving your craft toward the mark... just like with the green crosshairs: you don't move the lines, you move toward the lines.

Edited October 5, 2013 by RoboRay

[xZise]

That's the problem: When I want to rotate towards the marker, and lets say it is on the upper left quadrant I have to use S and A to rotate to it, instead of W and D. Which is pretty counter intuitive, because when you want to rotate to the upper left of the navball you would use W and D.

Fabian

[gilflo]

You don't have to figure out how to go where you want to go, you just have to follow the needles,,,don't think, just follow...

[RoboRay]

That's the problem: When I want to rotate towards the marker, and lets say it is on the upper left quadrant I have to use S and A to rotate to it...

That's right. The marker is to the upper left, so you need to turn toward the upper left. S pitches your nose up and A yaws you to the left. This is normal.

...instead of W and D. Which is pretty counter intuitive, because when you want to rotate to the upper left of the navball you would use W and D.

W pitches your nose down and D yaws you to the right. So, it turns you in the exact opposite direction of the example above. You don't pitch down and yaw right to turn upward and to the left.

I'm not sure how you're interpreting the NavBall, but I wonder if you are confused about what it represents. Can you be more specific about what you're talking about with the NavBall?

You don't have to figure out how to go where you want to go, you just have to follow the needles,,,don't think, just follow...

Exactly. That's the point of a command instrument... you don't have to figure anything out. The instrument has already done the thinking for you and is presenting you with the solution. The moving indicators are the solution. Just follow the needles.

Edited October 5, 2013 by RoboRay

[xZise]

[…]I'm not sure how you're interpreting the NavBall, but I wonder if you are confused about what it represents. Can you be more specific about what you're talking about with the NavBall?[…]

When you are starting and the 90°/E marker is on the right, you press D to yaw right. Of course the navball beneath is rotating in the other direction, that's why it's confusing (at least for me). And “don't think†is hard to obey: I'm adapted to the navball, and if I want to to the right there I press the button to go to the right and if I read the DPAI I have to inverse the “thinking†and this isn't working automatically (yet).

Fabian

[RoboRay]

Ah... You're saying the NavBall is rotating the opposite direction, but it's really not. The NavBall is the one part of your spacecraft that never rotates at all. The rest of your craft is rotating around it. The NavBall itself is as fixed in space as the horizon of the world below you, which it represents.

If you think of "turning the NavBall" you're going to get reversed controls and confusion. Treat the NavBall like a window you can see out. If you look out the front window and see you need to steer to the left, you use the controls to turn left and the world outside the window shifts to the right. You don't think off that as "moving the world to the right" though. The world isn't moving, just your craft. The NavBall should be treated the same way, as part of the unmoving world.

[xZise]

Yeah but that is my “problemâ€Â. When you press D, the navball beneath rotates to the left and your craft yaws to the right. On the DPAI it isn't inverted: When you press D, the “background†moves to the right (including the marker) and your crafts yaws to the right.

Fabian

Edited October 6, 2013 by xZise