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OMG, we're not worthy!

roosterr

By roosterr
in KSP Fan Works

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regex

regex

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Can anyone tell me what mod he used to transfer crew. Out of all of it, that is one of my "OMG I WANT THAT" moments yet I can't find it in his mod list.

Pretty sure it's in Crew Manifest.

E: Ninja!

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Maxmaps

Maxmaps

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The one thing I'd like to add to the discussion on whether NASA does X or Y is that you have to come at it from the point that in the end, KSP is a game, and as such it's absolutely okay to not fear failure, because worst case scenario you lose some eventually respawning kerbals and that's that. NASA uses incredibly complex autopilots (Seriously, look their controls up, they make MJ's UI clutter look as simple and user friendly as a facebook game) because they have so.much. at stake. From millions of dollars to the irreplaceable lives of the brave crew involved. Yes, we understand that veteran pilots may want to automate some of their tasks, but whatever you do, don't be afraid of failure. Don't take an easier road because you can't do it, challenge yourself to do it!

The design of Kerbals included that element where their demise is cartoony at best in little puffs of smoke because we don't want you to feel bad for making mistakes. We don't want you to feel bad if your constant failures at docking mean that Jeb gets stranded up in space for 10 years, the (ker)man can handle it. Yes, NASA uses autopilots and they should because they have so much to lose, even if the crew is perfectly trained to take over if those systems fail. Yes, it's okay for you to automate tasks you maybe feel are monotonous or simple for your advanced tastes. But try. Try and fail and explode and have that moment when you throw away an hour of design and building time and start your ship up from scratch. Learn, and I swear to you -nothing- will feel like how planting the flag after descending from the craft that costed you sweat, blood and tears.

If piloting isn't your thing and you're more of a builder, that's cool, if there's certain things you find aren't your cup of tea and you want to automate them, that's also cool, but whatever you do, don't automate things out of fear of failure and learning. Yes, NASA uses 'Mechjeb' so to speak, but they can't afford not to. You can always afford to hit Revert Flight and give it another go.

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NeoMorph

NeoMorph

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If piloting isn't your thing and you're more of a builder, that's cool, if there's certain things you find aren't your cup of tea and you want to automate them, that's also cool, but whatever you do, don't automate things out of fear of failure and learning. Yes, NASA uses 'Mechjeb' so to speak, but they can't afford not to. You can always afford to hit Revert Flight and give it another go.

If you looked at the way the OP used Mechjeb he was entering values to MechJeb's Surface SmartAss. He wasn't using it to totally automate the system. It's actually harder than manually piloting at times. I am going to use Mechjeb later on in my hardware project to link it to a DSKY. If anything that will make it harder still.

That's the beauty of KSP, Maxmaps. You can choose the way you want to play the game. You can go all automation or all manual or many different values in between. I like designing craft and letting MJ hammer the hell out of them. I like making craft and driving them "seat of the pants" style. Above all I love both styles equally as much. It's what keeps me playing (in fact I have to limit myself or else I would be playing it constantly and the hardware mod would never get done).

It may not be the way the designers envisioned the game but it also lets a broader range of players experience space exploration. Mechjeb is a pretty good teacher of how to do things. I'm not going into the whole argument about stock vs Mechjeb but will say that Mechjeb is basically a tool... You can use it however you want... or not as your preference may be. I still think the OP's mission was pretty darned awesome and I learned a few things along the way. That's another plus in this game... you are always learning something new.

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suzin.felipe

suzin.felipe

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That is the most careful planned and imaginative mission that I've seen so far around here. I would honestly love to see someone top that.

So if you have a more impressive mission, please link in the tread, or just sit there complaining about mods and MJ.

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Maxmaps

Maxmaps

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No matter what happens, one style of play shouldn't be frowned upon and another gratified.

We should all remain neutral about it on these forums.

I agree on that, and the actual OP on this thread is pretty cool regardless of the discussion. What I wanted to address was the growingly common issue with justifying automation because NASA does it, which I think is a pretty slippery position to take, anything you do in KSP is a personal choice and it affects no one else's playstyle, but my point is to not justify anything. If automation lets you focus on the parts of the game you enjoy more, that's great, but never change things out of fear of failure. Detonate some rockets, vaporize a few Kerbals and learn. Don't just say 'it looks hard, I'll let Mechjeb do it', try a couple times and go 'okay, I'll let Mechjeb do it.'

Edited by Maxmaps
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BostLabs

BostLabs

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Yes I know :(, but 2030 is pretty far away...

So was 2000 once, for some of us.:). I remember thinking it was a long way away, back in 1974. BOOM suddenly I'm 40 and it is the year 2000.

Don't rush it, their is a lot of life to experience between now and then.

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Eric S

Eric S

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If every KSP player was given the same set of mods, manipulating joints, attachment systems, custom fuel and engines, and MechJeb to fly it all, the OP's challenge to "top this" would have been beaten in the first 30 minutes by others.

[snark] You have access to the mods. You have 30 minutes. Go. [/snark]

On the non-snarky side, I will say that even though I've used most of the mods there, there was a good bit of imagination and work in that video, far more than just 30 minutes worth. Most of the attempts to duplicate NASA missions, real or proposed, tend to focus on a moon landing or a shuttle launch so this scores points just for being different. Is it the best ever? No, but it's better than most. Overstated subject line? That much I can agree on.

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Necandi Brasil

Necandi Brasil

Posted
Posted (edited)
So was 2000 once, for some of us.:). I remember thinking it was a long way away, back in 1974. BOOM suddenly I'm 40 and it is the year 2000.

Don't rush it, their is a lot of life to experience between now and then.

Yep... I know, I will enjoy my time doing things I love... like playing KSP ! :D

But with the arrival of commercial space (Like Space X, Bigelow, Planetary Resources , etc.) and the fact that Sci Fi is being highly profitable (Specially for Hollywood) , I really expect a change in the minds of the common citizen.

In the end I think we are in the right time, dunno if I'm being too optimistic though...

About the use of automatics A.K.A :Mechjeb

It can get really boring doing that 300 part space station without the use of autopilot... But in manned missions I prefer doing it manually to simulate the real thing :cool:

Edited by Necandi Brasil
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XoX

XoX

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I agree on that, and the actual OP on this thread is pretty cool regardless of the discussion. What I wanted to address was the growingly common issue with justifying automation because NASA does it, which I think is a pretty slippery position to take, anything you do in KSP is a personal choice and it affects no one else's playstyle, but my point is to not justify anything. If automation lets you focus on the parts of the game you enjoy more, that's great, but never change things out of fear of failure. Detonate some rockets, vaporize a few Kerbals and learn. Don't just say 'it looks hard, I'll let Mechjeb do it', try a couple times and go 'okay, I'll let Mechjeb do it.'

I agree. Personally, I use mechjeb because the actual flying is not what interests me. What interests me in the game is coming up with a mission, designing it, building it and then getting there, but the actual flying ( controlling the ship ) doesn't really interest me so why should anyone judge me for not doing it myself? Also, I tried (and completed) all the maneuvers manually first before I used mechjeb.

As for the mission, I was really impressed and I loved the music, it fit perfectly. I hope that one day I can accomplish something similar. I disagree with anyone saying that it's less impressive because it uses mods. If parts are simply not in the game, how is he supposed to do it with stock parts? Mods add possibilities and the good ones are balanced so they don't give an advantage, just more options.

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BostLabs

BostLabs

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Yep... I know, I will enjoy my time doing things I love... like playing KSP ! :D

But with the arrival of commercial space (Like Space X, Bigelow, Planetary Resources , etc.) and the fact that Sci Fi is being highly profitable (Specially for Hollywood) , I really expect a change in the minds of the common citizen.

In the end I think we are in the right time, dunno if I'm being too optimistic though...

Oh I forgot to mention... I'm still looking for my flying car I was promised in THE YEAR 2000.

:)

Well the level of computers we have now wasn't really promised like that so I guess it's all good. :D

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RogueMason

RogueMason

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My current mission to Duna in 0.21 is very much inspired by this video, although it's MUCH less complex, as well as mostly stock (only one SUNBEAM laser and some quantum struts are in use). Thought I may as well give something like this a shot :)

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ecat

ecat

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The crafts, the planning, the video presentation are all stunning.

Makes me glad I didn't push the stop button 10 seconds in. The music! It's not bad by any stretch of the imagination but I like to hear the clicks and clunks and whooshes of the game and the music is just way too loud.

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