Steam or Site?

[technicalfool]

Do you have a source?

If you do a bit of Googling, you'll find that Steam (the distribution platform) is not Steamworks (the awful DRM component).

That said, Steam would not exist without Steamworks, and I rather resent how it's all but impossible to get games these days without some kind of Big Brother checking, mostly because of Valve "pioneering" this approach with Steamworks.

So yes, I'm rather glad that Squad don't insist on Steam, because I'll never buy a game that requires what I regard as malware.

(Guess where I bought KSP from?)

[Beeman]

Malware is malicious. Steam is not malicious. Steam is not malware.

Windows 8, however, can be considered malicious. They deliberately do things and force the user to experience things that they do not want to be part of their desktop experience. They even basically flipped everyone who complained about the start button/menu's absence in Windows 8 by making the start button pull you straight into the metro UI. Microsoft doesn't care about you as a person or even as a consumer, they just care that you're probably going to buy their product no matter what.

Valve, on the other hand, actually hired a psychologist YEARS ago to study playtesters' facial expressions while playing their games to ensure that they were actually having a good and varied experience with their software...and yes, that devotion to the consumer carries into EVERYTHING that valve does. Steam, Steamworks, Valve games, Steambox, the controllers and other hardware they were experimenting with. Literally everything Valve does is one hundred percent in favor of the community. That's why valve is the best and most reputable software developer on the planet. That is why legions of gamers sing praise to Gabe Newell any time he makes a public appearance. That's why the only bad press you see about them is "why's it taking so long to make this new game >;O".

Yes, Steamworks is DRM. But honestly, it is the least invasive and least annoying DRM imaginable. I don't have to be online to play games on Steam(unless they have their own DRM), I don't have to keep my CD keys handy because my games are automatically installed via Steam, I can log into ANY computer anywhere on the planet(even mac and linux for many games, without buying an extra copy for those operating systems) and download my games as many times as I see fit and now, thanks to valve, I can use THEIR games and THEIR software to make a little money. Either by 3D modeling items for TF2 or DotA2 OR simply by ply playing my games and selling the cards(which I've done). I could even just play the community marketplace and earn money, too. All because of Steam.

There's so many benefits to using Steam that the DRM part of it is practically non-existent. Like...I don't think I've ever had Steam bother me in any way as a DRM platform. Valve is even successful in Russia! You KNOW you're doing something right when russians are buying your video games rather than pirating them. Russia contains some of the highest software piracy rates that I'm aware of, by the way. Not just randomly hating on russians, I actually love the way russian people speak...though I hate that I can't speak russian to save my life DX

[42undead2]

^Damn I wish I could fit that in my signature.

[technicalfool]

That was a blooming great big post that addressed nothing. Steamworks and Steam do nothing for me that cannot be done without DRM. Its whole, and entire purpose is to restrict what I can do with my purchase. It assumes I am a criminal until proven innocent. That is malicious. That is malware.

Until an EU court finally manages to force them into allowing it, I would like to see you be able to sell your purchase second-hand to somebody else. That shiny disk with the game on it? Useless as soon as the key is registered.

Ah, of course, second hand games are evil, aren't they?

I would consider hiring a psychologist to see just how much they can screw people for to be rather creepy, but then that's just me. Steamworks is not unintrusive by any stretch of the imagination. Steam would not exist without Steamworks, and as already mentioned, I resent the accusation and would rather give my money to people who don't use Big Brother tactics.

But, I'll never convince you, and you can be damned sure you won't convince me of any of the merits of a system that takes away everything you can do with software and selectively re-allows some of it assuming you keep logging in with Central Command at regular intervals. Well, unless you just use the cracked pirate edition with zero restrictions, that'll be out days after the official release. No thanks. My money goes elsewhere.

[Beeman]

The thing is, though, that Steam and Valve don't treat you as a criminal. In any way. They treat you as a consumer and want you to have a good time with their software and anyone else's that becomes available(even if they choose to have terrible, invasive or restrictive DRM).

My point is that Steamworks does not restrict you in any way. I'm not trying to convince you of anything, I'm just pointing out the facts and my own opinion on them as you have. Unfortunately, I consider the more broad spectrum of what steam offers rather than focusing on one potential negative that hasn't actually impacted a single person since the early days of Steam when everything was buggy and not-so-great. The number of Steam users speaks for itself, it doesn't need me talking it up on random game forums ;P

It's like...when I have a bowl of oatmeal, I KNOW that there were rats living in the silo that stored my oats. There were bugs in there, too and some of their fecal matter, hair or even body parts might have made it into my bowl. But I can still enjoy that bowl of oatmeal regardless of that fact.

Like...I don't like DC comics but I LOVE Marvel comics yet I still love Batman. Disliking ALL of DC(more or less) isn't going to stop me from enjoying Batman in movies and cartoons and such(I don't actually read comics, but still like Batman).

I can make content for TF2 and literally sell it to other people because of Steam. I can not do that without Steam. If I were to mod KSP and start selling my modded parts to people, I would probably get sued. Granted, SQUAD might also give me permission to do so, but it's unlikely.

I have no interest in selling my Steam games...as most Steam users don't simply because Steam offers my games at such steep discounts so very regularly that the cost of games is practically a non-issue for PC games and now that Origin offers buybacks for the first day that you own an EA game...you can guarantee that Steam will offer a better deal shortly.

Your stance on Steam is so blindly negative it hurts my brain. I mean, that's perfectly fine and I respect your beliefs but...geeze, you act like Gabe Newell came to your house and kicked your teeth in. It's like a lot of people hate Bill Gates for being one of the welthiest men on the planet but he spends a LOT of money...donates it to charities and funds all kinds of scientific research and what-not. Nobody's perfect, everyone does dumb things in their life and everyone has flaws, but when ninety-eight percent of what someone does is positive and benefits mankind, why would you focus on the one negative trait of them and block them out of your life? Just a strange mindset, if you ask me.

[DisarmingBaton5]

I went with the site; Steam was not available when I bought the game. I still use the site, though, because I prefer updating manually. If you are accustomed to Steam, I recommend that, though.

[Tataffe]

That was a blooming great big post that addressed nothing. Steamworks and Steam do nothing for me that cannot be done without DRM. Its whole, and entire purpose is to restrict what I can do with my purchase. It assumes I am a criminal until proven innocent. That is malicious. That is malware.

You are aware of the fact that noone but you decides wether to buy a valve game or not?^^ If you disagree with the stuff that comes with it, then just don't buy it. You act like Valve "surprised" you with DRM.

[technicalfool]

I can not do that without Steam.

I hear it's quite cheap to grab a web host and your own dotcom these days.

Like I say.. Steamworks confers me absolutely zero advantages, and only provides restrictions. I will have nothing to do with it. I will not pretend that these restrictions are somehow a benefit to me, and I refuse to have it infecting my machine.

Anyway. Outta here before it derails the rest of the thread.

[Mr.Rocket]

im facing the same choice now, but leaning towards steam

[magnemoe]

Main problem with steam is that the "do not update game automatically" function is broken. This is not an huge issue with most games, even games who uses lots of mods like Skyrim as the only thing who get broken is the script extender who took some time before getting useful and was updated fast.

For KSP this is pretty critical as updates might break even unmoded saves.

Steam also make it harder runing multiple versions of the game. You might want to test the new version while finishing the missions in the previous version or have one stock and one moded game.

[Legendary Emu]

I went with steam because I didn't have a paypal or paysafe. So go with the one where you can pay for it.

[Jarnis]

im facing the same choice now, but leaning towards steam

Or just throw more money at SQUAD because they are selling the game so cheap. Buy both.

I bought the game from the store when it was first put up and when Steam version came and there was no immediate word on the whole "transfer" business, I just decided to buy the game 2nd time. When I heard it was one-way transfer I was happy for my decision - I still have access to standalone version for some purposes and I have Steam version for easy updating and play-from-any-PC-where-I-log-onto-Steam.

[jaygee1320]

Curious... What's the safest way to buy KSP? Obviously one can purchase the game using various means, credit card, paypal, etc. Either way you're handing over personal info about yourself. Steam is accessed quite a bit whereas Squad may not experience the same volume of internet traffic and be of lesser interest to potential hackers. ....or on the other hand, Squad though doing their best may not have the same level of consumer protection as Steam

Thoughts to ponder.

[Pecan]

If you buy with paysafe on the Squad site you're not giving any information about yourself or your bank - just buy a voucher in a local shop and type its number into the payment box.

[MGCJerry]

Old school user here too... I'd get the site version, and I paid via paypal. I prefer control over my software and when it updates.

[Navy4422]

Thread has been dead since August, please start a new thread, locked