Current Use Of KSP In Schools

[seabas917]

Hello fellow KSP'ers,

I'm a teacher in Germany with an alternative k-8 school system.*

I come from an engineering/computer science background, so as you can imagine I'm pushing for a tech savvy internet driven curriculum.

Three weeks ago I bought Kerbal Space Program (KSP). Now I'm playing it with students and something amazing started happening.*

The kids who don't speak english (just German), started*playing the game in self*organized*groups, started to reach the objectives that took me hours to get to, and build teams*around the key kids taking on fields from piloting to*engineering!

Let me*break*down how incredible this is:

#1 *With only the basic understanding of game*mechanics (shift+,control-, wasd, and t,r,g), they were able to web translate enough of the*construction*description information into german to build*launchable*rockets and (more*impressively)*space planes.*

#2 Asking the right physics questions and building*hypotheses, "why is it so hard to*maneuver my rocket*once*its*in orbit?".*(Three full large orange tanks of fuel, can do that.) My answer try google-ing "inertia". *Kids*especially the 9 - 14 year olds*don't tend to ask questions involving*advanced orbital*mechanics and other physics*concepts. The kids told me the*orbits the game calculates*around*the Mun must be wrong. (After some playing I think they might be right, because it looks like the game only takes into account the mass of one planet at a time.) I had to tell them*gravity*is effected by distance so the mass of Kerbalin or the Sun, have too small an effect to be noticed in that orbit. *Trying to derive*physics*conclusions*on paper wasn't*something*I was doing until*university. *Now its a part of the classes morning*routine!*

#3 A handful of kids*consistently*make rockets that don't explode on the launchpad. So the whole class has*oriented*towards*building*a type of leadership*around, the*skills*required*for seeing the mission through. *Sure the*majority*of launches still end up in the sea or wildly off on large solar orbits without fuel. But the teams are building*themselves*and including everyone for there*tailored*skill set.**Something*you wouldn't have thought possible from kids without*being instructed to do so.

___________

The reason I'm writing on the forum today, is because I've been seeing people wanting to add competitive destructive gameplay elements, such as weaponizing spacecraft or PvP mechanics..

I want to say while that games sounds Awesome and I would love to play it personally!

Thats Not right for schools.

The game the way it is currently, Allows for a great deal of collaboration, without the pretense of competition.

This is why we can have 10 and 12 year old girls playing with out getting overwhelmed or bullied..

I must point out, that this can be used as one of the greatest teaching tools ever made for the next generation of engineers!

And right now I have the "popular girls" of the class actively playing it and the other girls are following. (Some science or engineering university is going to thank me one day!)

My point being this, KSP or a version of it, should be licensed and developed for schools all over the world!

Here in Germany, I would be happy to work towards getting government funding for development and distribution of KSP in the mainstream school system.

If there is anyone from SQUAD who agrees with me I would be very happy to meet with them.

Thanks for reading,

I'm very open to suggestions and help keeping ahead of my students.

Other games... projects... Ideas... anything.

It's become a full time job trying to keep up.

[KAO]

that is exactly the sort of thing Squad had in mind. Squad stated that guns are never going to be incorporated into the game, and that they want the game to be educational and maybe used by teachers

[astropapi1]

I wish my teachers were like that.

Apparently, "studying" catholicism is more important than this. :/

[jjwb22101]

I wish my teachers were like that.

Apparently, "studying" catholicism is more important than this. :/

I completely agree. Managed to get out of catholic school, but memorizing things without understanding their real-world implications and meanings is a pointless education.

Also, seabas, you are correct about it only calculating gravity for one body at a time. It does this because N-body physics (taking into account the gravity of more than one body) would be exponentially more difficult to calculate as more planets and moons are added.

[astropapi1]

You're an awesome teacher for doing this.

Yeah, My school isn't even catholic, but our religion teacher thinks we all want to be catholic priests or whatever. I might have to convert him to Pastafarism!

Seriously, tell your students someone on the internet said they have an incredible teacher. Have some Rep.

[seabas917]

I'm Starting to read on:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Three-body_problem

Thanks for the Info: jjwb22101

Do you know:

The Universe Sandbox

I'm really interested to see how they developed there physics engine.

(Lots of points of mass!)

Some how trajectories need to be broken down to a floating point calculation for the graphics card.

That's some ruff math. I think I need to sleep. 2:05am here.

...

Speaking of religion: God how I love this job!

Industry sucks!

[seabas917]

I'm Starting to read up on:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Three-body_problem

Thanks for the Info: jjwb22101

Do you know:

The Universe Sandbox

I'm really interested to see how they developed there physics engine.

(Lots of points of mass!)

Somehow trajectories need to be broken down to a floating point calculation for the graphics card.

That's some ruff math. I think I need to sleep. its 2:05am here (on a school night).

...

Speaking of religion: God how I love this job!

Industry sucks!

[swiftgates24]

As always, I wish my school did this...but you have no worries! SQUAD has no intention of EVER putting weapons or PvP stuff.

[ouion]

What if a kid knows how to make weapons from stock from watching Macey Deans Videos.

[swiftgates24]

What if a kid knows how to make weapons from stock from watching Macey Deans Videos.

That'd be awesome though.

"Jimmy! No making bombs out of rocket fuel!"

[pxi]

Hello fellow KSP'ers,

I'm very open to suggestions and help keeping ahead of my students.

Other games... projects... Ideas... anything.

It's become a full time job trying to keep up.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_educational_video_games

The only title on that list that I've actually heard good things about is 'Oregon Trail'. Unfortunately Squad seem to be in an extreme minority of games companies have even the remotest idea of how to make education through gaming a compelling thing.

Outside of that, my other suggestion would be to look at the Raspberry PI project. www.raspberrypi.org

Good luck with your endeavours, you're the kind of teacher I think we all wish we had.

[skyace65]

What if a kid knows how to make weapons from stock from watching Macey Deans Videos.

fire the SRB's!

[Astronut25]

...you're the kind of teacher I think we all wish we had.

Agreed.

Recommended reading if you really want something technical, this is the math involved in calculating anything you want in 2-body mechanics: http://www.braeunig.us/space/orbmech.htm I find it very satisfying to use math to calculate my missions, and then do it perfectly in the game.

I wish we had an education system that actually pushes their students to actually learn, the education system in Oregon is comparable to some third-world countries. Most people around where I live don't know anything about mathematics beyond addition, and subtraction (and maybe multiplication). No joke.

[User Unrelated]

This is awesome! I tip my hat to you, sir.

I am currently going into my senior year studying mechanical engineering, and if I would have had something like this in my earlier years of education, it would have been simply THE COOLEST THING EVER.

I hope your endeavors continue to be fruitful!

and yes, many many guys in fiture engineering programs will be thanking you

trust me... I'm an engineer haha

[gameassassin1020]

I love ksp and all but how does it help education wise? I mean it's better than what we are learning now but how does it help you get a job or figure out economics? Yeah the astrophysics are cool and all but it's not useful in life.

[Lazro]

I love ksp and all but how does it help education wise? I mean it's better than what we are learning now but how does it help you get a job or figure out economics? Yeah the astrophysics are cool and all but it's not useful in life.

So teamwork in groups and assigning roles isn't important?

[sumghai]

I love ksp and all but how does it help education wise? I mean it's better than what we are learning now but how does it help you get a job or figure out economics? Yeah the astrophysics are cool and all but it's not useful in life.

It gets people interested in science and engineering in a fun and approachable manner.

When I was nine, I went on a trip to the States and visited the Smithsonian's National Air and Space Museum, and was absolutely enthralled by the exhibits on aeronautics, rocketry and spaceflight (especially getting to see a real X-15 and the Skylab backup). I kept asking myself (and the tour guides) why certain things were designed a certain way, or why the pilots/astronauts performed certain maneuvers at a certain time.

Consequently, I decided I wanted to be not a firefighter or policeman, but an aerospace engineer. While ultimately I ended up being involved in a different type of engineering (microfluidics research), I still credit that trip for putting me on the path towards science.

Now, imagine what KSP would have done had it been available to my school twenty years ago!

[NeoMorph]

That'd be awesome though.

"Jimmy! No making bombs out of rocket fuel!"

Reminds me of electronics class...

"Tommy, no overcharging capacitors to use as bullets" <- and yes, this actually happened. Kid made a capacitor machine gun lol. All because when we were working on a defective oscilloscope the instructor mentioned something was overcharging and then BAM a hole appeared in the ceiling tile when one of the caps blew. Gave the kid the idea and oops...

Yeah, give kids ideas and they will run with them... SO NO WEAPONS IN KSP... EVER!

[Seshins]

It gets people interested in science and engineering in a fun and approachable manner.

When I was nine, I went on a trip to the States and visited the Smithsonian's National Air and Space Museum, and was absolutely enthralled by the exhibits on aeronautics, rocketry and spaceflight (especially getting to see a real X-15 and the Skylab backup). I kept asking myself (and the tour guides) why certain things were designed a certain way, or why the pilots/astronauts performed certain maneuvers at a certain time.

Consequently, I decided I wanted to be not a firefighter or policeman, but an aerospace engineer. While ultimately I ended up being involved in a different type of engineering (microfluidics research), I still credit that trip for putting me on the path towards science.

Now, imagine what KSP would have done had it been available to my school twenty years ago!

man, if this had been the case at my school, i would be an astrophysicist right now. Ive always loved Space, but it always felt "to out of reach" no pun

[Duxwing]

First, YOU ARE AWESOME. I wish that I had a teacher like you when I was their age.

I have at length thought about such scenarios as the one that you've described in my daydreams. Below are a few suggestions:

1.) Don't mess with a good thing. If the kids are doing well on their own, then don't 'taint' their little world with your adultness. I don't mean to sound mean, but this game is theirs.

2.) Don't let the fire die. If you see that a group dynamic is limiting the kids, then step in and fix it as quickly and cleanly as you can; if they need resources, then provide them, e.g., have orbital mechanics textbooks; and keep adding fuel, e.g., leave a book full of old rocket designs idly lying on a table--or better yet, a single sheet of paper with a fundamental concept or two.

3.) Think ahead. Your goal is to get these kids to have fun with rocket science in the most natural way that you can. If doing so means sparingly helping them over an otherwise insurmountable hurdle, then do so.

4.) Match their level of sincerity and enthusiasm--which can become surprisingly intense and specific to certain aspects of the game: give the pilots adventure, the organizers power, and the engineers problems that seem just out of reach. Some kids will even find meaning in their work--stoke that, too.

5.) Stoke their interest. Put a grand, ultimate challenge before the class--a mothership capable of orbiting and deploying a manned lander upon every single body in the Kerbol system--and leave them to their own devices unless such a case as described in suggestion 2 comes up.

-Duxwing

[esinohio]

I found this link http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/showthread.php/45770-KSP-Tutorials-auf-Deutsch in the international section. Since it has been over 25 years since I spoke German I can't attest to how well the tutorials are done but thought you might watch them and if they are done well you could pass them on to your students.

I would also like to pass along best wishes to your students. Tell them this game is proof that indeed you will use those mathematics you are studying!

[Nalin_Airheart]

IIRC there was another teacher on the forums asking around for help on mission/reward creation and balancing. There was an entire page and student forum too, I'll try to nail the thread onto a link for you if you want to talk to him.

[Designer225]

I agree with many of you and SQUAD's thought that no weapons should be added ever, as it introduces violence.

However, it's best not to use stock parts to make weapons... ugh...

[User Unrelated]

So teamwork in groups and assigning roles isn't important?

This guy.

This guy right here knows what's up.

Out of all of the spectacular and impressive things that I've learned over the past 3 years in engineering school, I don't even hesitate to say that the most important things I've learned so far in life have been the teamwork and leadership skills that I gained from my 4 years as a power-player on the F.I.R.S.T. Robotics team in high school.

[SpaceSphereOfDeath]

The only part of the OP I don't agree with is the one about 9-14 year old kids not asking questions about physics.

I'm a young teen, and I have a fairly good grasp of general relativity and quantum mechanics, let alone astorphysics.

I'm sorry If it seems like I'm ranting but I'm not, so can you please put most 9-14 year old children

Thanks