(OLD) The Ultimate Jool-5 Challenge:land Kerbals on all moons and return in one big mission

[Ziv]

sorry, i didn't take any photos of any of that. i also forgot to put on kerbal engineer on the main lander. but i did refuel the layth lander befor heading to vall. i did need to send the other lander to rescue the layth lander.

i went to the moons in this order: main ship goes to tylo, lander lands, docks, main craft heads to layth, establishes orbit (by re-entering), layth lander lands, re-docks, re-fuels, heads to vall, lands, heads back to layth, aerobrakes, burns into orbit, runs out of fuel, then the main lander goes to rescue it, heads back to main ship, drops off crew, re-fuels, heads to poll, establishes orbit, lands, heads back to layth, docks with main craft, re-fuels, gets drop tank, heads to bop, establishes orbit, lands, heads to layth, establishes orbit, docks, transfers the remaining fuel into the main craft, return craft heads to kirbin, lands, and the end!

i could just redo the chalenge, after the designing was done, it only took me about 4 or 5 days to do the challenge. and i would be able to skip tylo and layth.

sorry it was vague.

edit:only 1 kerbal was killed, the kerbals in the photos had parachutes. that one kerbal was killed by a bug on poll, and when i loaded the quicksave, the game crashed.

Hey, I'm sorry but I can't accept your entry if I can't check your fuel/deltaV properly during the mission.

[Ziv]

I've wanted to do the Jool 5 challenge for a long time now, when I first found a 1051m/s to Jool path I was planning to use it for this. And now, finally, I managed to do it. I tried to do it with as little dV expended as possible through the wonder of flybys, here's a summary of the flight:

-Poor Jeb had just a lander can for the whole 2 year, 301 day flight. I assume Kerbals can go into hibernation or something.

-I did it in version 0.24.2. 0.25 came out after I completed flight testing and I wasn't going to redo it all.

-197 ton launch weight, all stock except for Mechjeb. No nukes or ions and only one jet, used for the Laythe landing/takeoff. No buried parts except for a couple of the little cubic struts that I used as mounting points for motors (and for a while, parachutes- then when I ruled out 'chutes I couldn't get the struts out!)

-22 flybys: 1 of Mun, 1 of Eve, 2 of Kerbin, 4 of Laythe, 4 of Vall, 6 of Tylo, 2 of Bop and 2 of Pol.

-It is a carrier/fuel depo and a universal lander. The carrier never went into orbit around any moon, or more than 4 orbits around Jool without a moon flyby. It would drop the lander at each moon during a slow and low pass, then pick it up at a later pass.

-Launcher/Carrier dV expended: 1070m/s from LKO to 0-degree inclination orbit around Jool just before dropping off the lander for the 1st time. 245 m/s from there to picking up the lander the last time. 100m/s from there to Kerbin atmosphere. 1415m/s total.

-Landing dV expended. Remember the lander had to decelerate from flyby speed to landing, then takeoff and get back to escape speed to meet the carrier.

Pol: 489m/s down, 504 up: 993 total.

Bop: 633m/s down, 694 up: 1327 total.

Tylo: 3493m/s down, 3412 up: 6855 total.

Vall: 1186m/s down, 1278 up: 2464 total.

Laythe is a special case because of the jet. Mechjeb said the jet expended 8256m/s but that seems really high for what it did, and for only using 41 units of fuel. 591m/s of rocket dV was used.

And 223m/s for the parachute-less landing on Kerbin.

Below are links to 7 Imgur albums detailing the trip . I may have gotten carried away with the pictures, sorry about that. Note that the "delta-V stats" that Mechjeb reports are confused by docking ports, and since the crossfeed goes on and off a lot the numbers go all over the place. The custom window "DV Expended" seems quite accurate as long as I recorded the carrier dV before it redocked and got zeroed out.

http://imgur.com/a/13tuj

http://imgur.com/a/yUjGt

http://imgur.com/a/vxPWJ

http://imgur.com/a/P65S0

http://imgur.com/a/D6WaS

http://imgur.com/a/DOrHC

http://imgur.com/a/kXCeC

PLAD: Congratulations, you have finished the JOOL-5 Challenge on Level 1!

Wow, that's really cool that you very highly optimized your ship and flight for the lowest deltaV spendings with a lot of flybys, really impressive!

Some of your flyby solutions very really crazy!

I also liked how you solved the problem that Jet's can have decoupler on their bottom.

That's interesting that you had a staged lander for Vall, that's rare there, but absolutely understandable with your highly optimized design.

The Tylo landing was all right, nice use of those little engines.

That was brave that you went for Bop and Pol only with the carrier-tug with not much fuel left in it, but you not just managed it but went home with that amount of fuel too!! Awesome.

The Jool escape gravity slingshot with Laythe and Tylo was a really good example about how to leave Jool for cheap.

Good job, thank you for participating!

[jaddbo]

Hey, I'm sorry but I can't accept your entry if I can't check your fuel/deltaV properly during the mission.

that is fine, i just did it for the fun of it, and if i go back and re-do it, i will know what to look for, right?

[technion]

I've just completed this.

http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/101042-Yet-another-Jool-5-tour?p=1558630

[PLAD]

PLAD: Congratulations, you have finished the JOOL-5 Challenge on Level 1!

Yeeeehah! How long I've anticipated seeing those words...

Thank you Ziv for keeping up this challenge, the time and effort committed looks quite large. And I've learned many, many useful things from studying all these entries.

As an aside I checked on Mechjeb's accuracy on reporting jet dV by setting a jet hovering just above the launch pad for several minutes (using MJ's translation function in 'Vert' mode with V set to 0), then dividing the dV expended by (seconds spent hovering times 9.81). Ideally I'd get 1.0, but I get 1.25. As a control I tried it with a normal rocket and got 1.0. BUT, with the jet the thing bobs up and down like a clown on a trampoline (it's fun to watch) so the constant throttling up and down might be having an effect. So I shall consider indicated jet dV to be unusable for accurate mission dV, and all I can say is my mission did LKO to the Jool 5 landings to Kerbal surface for about 22000m/s.

[Thunderous Echo]

It has been an amazing two months. I would finally, proudly, like to announce to completion of:

ECHO'S KERBOL GRAND TOUR

(Jebediah's Level + Grand Tour + 17 Reddit Weekly Challenges)

Edited November 25, 2014 by Thunderous Echo

[Thunderous Echo]

I should give Ziv 1.5 days or more to process my entry, right?

Special Request: Can I have the Jool-5 badge without the words: "The Jool-5 Challenge Accomplished"? I'll still link it, of course.

Edited November 26, 2014 by Thunderous Echo

[Brainlord Mesomorph]

Here’s my situation:

Want to start a new career game in 0.25, and I’ve never gotten a guy as far as Jool before. So I decided to spend every last penny in my space budget on a massive fleet to Jool. Science labs, rovers, the whole thing. Then I find out you guys have a thing called the Jool 5 Challenge. And I figured, I can do that too. But then I read the rules, especially the “one big ship†rule. Well, I think I can still do this, but I do need some rules clarified.

First a couple of definitions please:

1. “Refuelingâ€Â: I see you frown on refueling, but can you be more specific about the definition of the word. Specifically, a lander returning to the mother ship, and taking on fuel that the mother ship brought with her, is that considered refueling?

2. “No parts clipping.†How absolutely do you mean that?

I for instance, often clip girder segments partially into fuselages, so they look like they are attached. I’ll often place small components within girder segments. That is empty space. I also often rotate lights around so they look like they are imbedded in the surface. But this is all just cosmetic. - I would never do anything like place an engine within the fuel tank.

And now a couple of rules clarifications:

3. “One big ship, and one fueling ship†I understand that. But I was planning on sending a fleet. So here’s my question: Is there any reason other ships cannot take advantage of the same launch window, leaving at roughly the same time, arriving at roughly the same time, as long as they don’t provide any support to the Jool 5 mission?

4. Once a ship is no longer being used for the Jool 5 mission, a lander being left behind for instance, there’s no reason other Kerbals can’t use equipment that for other reasons, right?

5. Once a given a Kerbal has completed his Jool 5 assignment, and is waiting for his departure window, (we have 100 days) there’s no reason he can’t be involved in other activities, right? Driving a rover around, delivering science to space station etc.

So here would be my plan: we designate one ship as the Jool 5 Challenge mother ship. (perhaps he will designate one as the Jool 5 refueling ship, although at this point I’m not sure I’ll need one) the Jool 5 Challenge mother ship contains all of the astronauts and landers for the Jool 5 mission (even though one of the landers could fly there under its own power, we’ll carry it) we’ll give this ship a special mission patch so that we can tell it from the others.

Without any contact with the other ships, it completes the Jool 5 challenge landings. (separately, the second mission arrives and begins building the two space stations)

Then, if you let me, the Jool 5 astronauts could interact for the second mission, delivering science etc. As long as they don’t receive any fuel or other support.

Once the 100 days is complete, those astronauts get back on the Jool 5 ship and complete the Jool 5 challenge.

Needless to say, should any of the landings go bad, or my Jool 5 astronauts need rescue or support from the second mission in any way, I will have failed in my Jool 5 challenge (although my science mission will continue)

Will that work?

Edited November 26, 2014 by Brainlord Mesomorph

[Cmdr. Arn1e]

1. “Refuelingâ€Â: I see you frown on refueling, but can you be more specific about the definition of the word. Specifically, a lander returning to the mother ship, and taking on fuel that the mother ship brought with her, is that considered refueling?

That's not considered part of the frowned-upon refueling; in fact it can make the mission more interesting!

2. “No parts clipping.†How absolutely do you mean that?

I for instance, often clip girder segments partially into fuselages, so they look like they are attached. I’ll often place small components within girder segments. That is empty space. I also often rotate lights around so they look like they are imbedded in the surface. But this is all just cosmetic. - I would never do anything like place an engine within the fuel tank.

No turning on part-clipping in the F12 menu, mainly... sure Ziv will clarify further if needed...

And now a couple of rules clarifications:

3. “One big ship, and one fueling ship†I understand that. But I was planning on sending a fleet. So here’s my question: Is there any reason other ships cannot take advantage of the same launch window, leaving at roughly the same time, arriving at roughly the same time, as long as they don’t provide any support to the Jool 5 mission?

You can send as man ships as you like in the same launch window, but only 1 will be eligible for this challenge (so all landers for all 5 moons need to be attached, if going that route).

4. Once a ship is no longer being used for the Jool 5 mission, a lander being left behind for instance, there’s no reason other Kerbals can’t use equipment that for other reasons, right?

No problem there!

5. Once a given a Kerbal has completed his Jool 5 assignment, and is waiting for his departure window, (we have 100 days) there’s no reason he can’t be involved in other activities, right? Driving a rover around, delivering science to space station etc.

Nothing wrong there either, as long as all the Kerbals taking part in the Jool-5 Challenge Mission return at the same time (I think... again Ziv will clarify if need be!)

Hope this helps; I've been trying to do this for so long now! I will get another entry together soon... maybe...

[Brainlord Mesomorph]

Perfect!

(there's an F12 menu?)

[EdwardKu]

I hereby submit my Stock+Mechjeb Jool V attempt

Also, I'm pretty new to imgur. For some reason the first two imgur albums display weird; if someone could tell me how to fix it, I'll be immensely grateful

EDIT: Thank you Rhomphaia for telling me how to fix it

Flight of IPV Joolpiter V

Publicity Shot

Mission Abstract

• Reusable mothership for Kerbin-Jool transfer flight
  
• Mothership park at 500km Laythe orbit
  
• Only 3 Kerbals alive is awesome enough to fly this mission: Jeb, Bob and Bill
  
• One Kerbal to surface of each moon
  
• SSTO Laythe spaceplane
  
• Three-stage Tylo lander
  
• Reusable Vall, Bop and Pol lander
  
• Orbital Tug flies Laythe-Tylo and Laythe-Vall-Pol-Bop route
  
• Mk1-2 Command Pod serve as Crew Habitation and Crew Return Module
  
• 
  

Mission Assembly

Javascript is disabled. View full album

Kerbin-Laythe Transfer

Javascript is disabled. View full album

Laythe Landing

Javascript is disabled. View full album

Tylo Landing

Javascript is disabled. View full album

Vall-Pol-Bop Landings

Javascript is disabled. View full album

Return to Kerbin

Javascript is disabled. View full album

Edited November 28, 2014 by EdwardKu

[Rhomphaia]

Also, I'm pretty new to imgur. For some reason the first two imgur albums display weird; if someone could tell me how to fix it, I'll be immensely grateful

for the first two remove #0 from the code.

The rest are how it should be.

[Ziv]

It has been an amazing two months. I would finally, proudly, like to announce to completion of:

ECHO'S KERBOL GRAND TOUR

(Jebediah's Level + Grand Tour + 17 Reddit Weekly Challenges)

Really nice grand tour! I loved that your videos have a good pace and some good effects and parallel cuts.

For the JOOL-5, on video Phase 4 at 1:35 when you go into low Tylo orbit you have less than 50% fuel with the tug all together. The lander has 720 fuel, the tug 360, so you have less than 540 fuel (if the fuel level was indicated for the lander only then it's less than 360).

But when you undock your lander fuel is at 100% which means 720 fuel, which is more than what you had before... how is it possible?

[Ziv]

I should give Ziv 1.5 days or more to process my entry, right?

Special Request: Can I have the Jool-5 badge without the words: "The Jool-5 Challenge Accomplished"? I'll still link it, of course.

Why would you like to have that?

[Ziv]

Here’s my situation:

Want to start a new career game in 0.25, and I’ve never gotten a guy as far as Jool before. So I decided to spend every last penny in my space budget on a massive fleet to Jool. Science labs, rovers, the whole thing. Then I find out you guys have a thing called the Jool 5 Challenge. And I figured, I can do that too. But then I read the rules, especially the “one big ship†rule. Well, I think I can still do this, but I do need some rules clarified.

First a couple of definitions please:

1. “Refuelingâ€Â: I see you frown on refueling, but can you be more specific about the definition of the word. Specifically, a lander returning to the mother ship, and taking on fuel that the mother ship brought with her, is that considered refueling?

2. “No parts clipping.†How absolutely do you mean that?

I for instance, often clip girder segments partially into fuselages, so they look like they are attached. I’ll often place small components within girder segments. That is empty space. I also often rotate lights around so they look like they are imbedded in the surface. But this is all just cosmetic. - I would never do anything like place an engine within the fuel tank.

And now a couple of rules clarifications:

3. “One big ship, and one fueling ship†I understand that. But I was planning on sending a fleet. So here’s my question: Is there any reason other ships cannot take advantage of the same launch window, leaving at roughly the same time, arriving at roughly the same time, as long as they don’t provide any support to the Jool 5 mission?

4. Once a ship is no longer being used for the Jool 5 mission, a lander being left behind for instance, there’s no reason other Kerbals can’t use equipment that for other reasons, right?

5. Once a given a Kerbal has completed his Jool 5 assignment, and is waiting for his departure window, (we have 100 days) there’s no reason he can’t be involved in other activities, right? Driving a rover around, delivering science to space station etc.

So here would be my plan: we designate one ship as the Jool 5 Challenge mother ship. (perhaps he will designate one as the Jool 5 refueling ship, although at this point I’m not sure I’ll need one) the Jool 5 Challenge mother ship contains all of the astronauts and landers for the Jool 5 mission (even though one of the landers could fly there under its own power, we’ll carry it) we’ll give this ship a special mission patch so that we can tell it from the others.

Without any contact with the other ships, it completes the Jool 5 challenge landings. (separately, the second mission arrives and begins building the two space stations)

Then, if you let me, the Jool 5 astronauts could interact for the second mission, delivering science etc. As long as they don’t receive any fuel or other support.

Once the 100 days is complete, those astronauts get back on the Jool 5 ship and complete the Jool 5 challenge.

Needless to say, should any of the landings go bad, or my Jool 5 astronauts need rescue or support from the second mission in any way, I will have failed in my Jool 5 challenge (although my science mission will continue)

Will that work?

Hey! Cmdr.Arn1e's answers were right here. Big expeditions and more stuff are always welcomed here, only important things are:

- no cheating so no hyperedit, no magical refuelings, no bad part-clipping especially through tanks or engines (natural small parts can have some clipping, the maximum acceptable one may be a nuclear generator laid half into the side of a tank), no prohibited mods or cheating in any other means

- follow the rules, so one big ship carries all the crew and landers to Jool and do the ships/crew as it is needed for the given level and cannot be changed during the mission

- one refueling mission can be sent from Kerbin if your mission accidentally runs out of fuel. Changing fuel distribution between ships/landers during your mission is absolutely allowed.

- you can send more additional stuff, landers, rovers, stations, anything, and the JOOL-5 crew can interact with them at any level but they have to do their JOOL-5 mission on their own. So for example the JOOL-5 crew can meet other crew in space or on surface, use their rover and facilities on the surface, but cannot use their landers and ships or refuel from them. And they have to go back to Kerbin and land together.

- Also when presenting the mission please make always clear which are the JOOL-5 vehicles and crew.

[Ziv]

I hereby submit my Stock+Mechjeb Jool V attempt

Also, I'm pretty new to imgur. For some reason the first two imgur albums display weird; if someone could tell me how to fix it, I'll be immensely grateful

EDIT: Thank you Rhomphaia for telling me how to fix it

Flight of IPV Joolpiter V

Publicity Shot

http://i.imgur.com/skePY3U.png

Mission Abstract

• Reusable mothership for Kerbin-Jool transfer flight
  
• Mothership park at 500km Laythe orbit
  
• Only 3 Kerbals alive is awesome enough to fly this mission: Jeb, Bob and Bill
  
• One Kerbal to surface of each moon
  
• SSTO Laythe spaceplane
  
• Three-stage Tylo lander
  
• Reusable Vall, Bop and Pol lander
  
• Orbital Tug flies Laythe-Tylo and Laythe-Vall-Pol-Bop route
  
• Mk1-2 Command Pod serve as Crew Habitation and Crew Return Module
  
• 
  

Mission Assembly

http://imgur.com/a/q9tr5

Kerbin-Laythe Transfer

http://imgur.com/a/SW3yI

Laythe Landing

http://imgur.com/a/GV36j

Tylo Landing

http://imgur.com/a/HwtNI

Vall-Pol-Bop Landings

http://imgur.com/a/3CjVH

Return to Kerbin

http://imgur.com/a/cN0eK

EdwardKu: Congratulations, you have finished the JOOL-5 Challenge on Level 1!

I like how you solved the wobbling problem, and your docking port adapter is a nice one too! I guess without any control you had to be very careful not to spin it!

I guess your Laythe plane was not well balanced if you could land only at high speed.

I really liked that your Tylo lander was landing "during" an asparagus staging. Yeah, if the Tylo lander last stage would have legs it could have been the lander for the remaining moons, good notice!

Good job with the other landings and the return too. Thank you for participating!

[Brainlord Mesomorph]

- one refueling mission can be sent from Kerbin if your mission accidentally runs out of fuel.

Well, I'm taking advantage of a minimum delta V launch window (and departure window). So sending a ship later won't do.

But the fleet will involve at least a couple of fuel tankers, so I was thinking I could designate one of them the JOOL-5 tanker (give it the special mission patch) and if the J5 crew needs fuel it can get it from that one ship.

Really still not sure I'll need it yet, but I want to get the rools (LOL) straight.

Close enough?

[Ziv]

Well, I'm taking advantage of a minimum delta V launch window (and departure window). So sending a ship later won't do.

But the fleet will involve at least a couple of fuel tankers, so I was thinking I could designate one of them the JOOL-5 tanker (give it the special mission patch) and if the J5 crew needs fuel it can get it from that one ship.

Really still not sure I'll need it yet, but I want to get the rools (LOL) straight.

Close enough?

Yes, all right!

[Thunderous Echo]

Sorry, been out of town and didn't warn anyone.

Really nice grand tour! I loved that your videos have a good pace and some good effects and parallel cuts.

For the JOOL-5, on video Phase 4 at 1:35 when you go into low Tylo orbit you have less than 50% fuel with the tug all together. The lander has 720 fuel, the tug 360, so you have less than 540 fuel (if the fuel level was indicated for the lander only then it's less than 360).

But when you undock your lander fuel is at 100% which means 720 fuel, which is more than what you had before... how is it possible?

The lander started fully fueled, the tug started half-fueled. (1:30). The lander's fuel tanks were locked, so the indicators seen while draining from the tug showed how mush fuel the tug had left. Fuel was drained from the tug (1:35) until it was empty, and then it was decoupled. The lander's tanks were then unlocked, and since no fuel had drained from the lander, they were full (1:37). The indicators now showed full fuel.

The reason I want a wordless badge is that I like a non-distracting sig. However, I am content with the standard badge, if standardization pleases you.

[Krovster]

I have just completed (in my mind) the Jool 5 moon challenge on lv 1. Jebediah successfully landed on all 5 moons and returned to Kerbin safely.

However, I failed to put a ladder on my lander is this going to disqualify me?

If so there isn't a lot of point me writing it all up, otherwise I will right it up.

[Krovster]

I have just completed (in my mind) the Jool 5 moon challenge on lv 1. Jebediah successfully landed on all 5 moons and returned to Kerbin safely.

However, I failed to put a ladder on my lander is this going to disqualify me?

If so there isn't a lot of point me writing it all up, otherwise I will right it up.

Although I have just realised that due to the design of my lander I can get back on board without a ladder even from Laythe and Tylo. So would it be sufficient to demonstrate how I would do that?

[kookoo_gr]

If your kerbal can get inside the lander without the help of a ladder then you are not disqualified. It would be good to show how you went inside the lander so that ziv won't have any questions. Look at my solution at Laythe when i forgot the ladder.

http://imgur.com/a/8JWlG#0

[Cmdr. Arn1e]

The ladder problem is only really relevant to the Jeb-Level of the Challenge, due to the gathering of the Science. If you are only doing a Level-1, you don't need to worry about the Science, so getting onto the surface to get the Surface Sample isn't as much of a requirement

[Rhomphaia]

The ladder problem is only really relevant to the Jeb-Level of the Challenge, due to the gathering of the Science. If you are only doing a Level-1, you don't need to worry about the Science, so getting onto the surface to get the Surface Sample isn't as much of a requirement

Rule seven

(Read the rules carefully because I'm strict about them!)

7. All the landings have to include a spacewalk on the surface too, so double check your ladders for Laythe and Tylo!

[dharmdevil]

Hi, new here and am planning to try this challenge--launching everything in single launch in 20k+ ton rocket.

Is RealChute mod allowed or not?