India sends probe to Mars

[vencaslac]

So i'm sure everyone's heard of this already but I just realised today after reading this article http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-24851242 that it would likely be a lot harder for me to understand why they're doing the trans martian injection in multiple burns if it wasn't for KSP... so thanks Squad... - /discuss

[Whackjob]

Am I the only one who was disappointed that they didn't call the probe "Shiva"?

[Starwaster]

I wish them luck!

Mars has been a rough place on probes statistically speaking.

The Martians value their privacy.

[Wallace]

Am I the only one who thinks they should not be spending money on sending stuff into space when foreign aid is paying to feed their people?

[Whackjob]

Am I the only one who thinks they should not be spending money on sending stuff into space when foreign aid is paying to feed their people?

Sadly, it's never, never that simple. The world already produces enough food to feed the entire world plus. The issue is politics and good old fashioned human greed.

[SlyReaper]

Am I the only one who thinks they should not be spending money on sending stuff into space when foreign aid is paying to feed their people?

I hope so. Sending stuff into space has, historically, pretty much always turned out to be a sound investment. This Indian mission also happens to be the cheapest interplanetary mission in history. By quite a large margin, if I understand correctly.

The price of sending this probe on its merry way was somewhere in the region of $75mil. Now imagine taking that money and converting it into food for the entire population of India which lives in poverty. How long do you imagine that food would last? How many crumbs do you think each person would receive? Spend 75mil to provide a few crumbs to the poor, or spend 75mil on a project which may eventually help lift those people out of poverty.

[Starwaster]

Am I the only one who thinks they should not be spending money on sending stuff into space when foreign aid is paying to feed their people?

Yeah.

Sorry.

[Lohan2008]

Am I the only one who was disappointed that they didn't call the probe "Shiva"?

Mangalyaan, which means "Mars craft" in Hindi, lacks the power to fly directly and the launch vehicle will orbit Earth for nearly a month, building up the necessary velocity to break free from our planet's gravitational pull.

Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/technology/sci-tech/india-launches-mission-to-mars-20131105-2wzoh.html#ixzz2k0PEHHx8

[Lohan2008]

Hindu Cosmology from the "Ramayana"

Edited November 7, 2013 by Lohan2008

[Kryten]

'Mangalyaan' is something the press came up with the mission was announced (by analogy with the 'Chandrayaan' moon mission); ISRO refers to it solely as 'mars orbiter mission'. They seem to have something of a liking for extremely literal names; they actually called their first satellite launch vehicle 'satellite launch vehicle'.

Edited November 8, 2013 by Kryten

[FenrirWolf]

After playing this game for like half a year, I sympathize with them completely. Making good names for your rockets is the hardest part of running a space program

[Merinsan]

'Mangalyaan' is something the press came up with the mission was announced (by analogy with the 'Chandrayaan' moon mission); ISRO refers to it solely as 'mars orbiter mission'. They seem to have something of a liking for extremely literal names; they actually called their first satellite launch vehicle 'satellite launch vehicle'.

My space program uses exactly the same naming convention.

[Camacha]

Am I the only one who thinks they should not be spending money on sending stuff into space when foreign aid is paying to feed their people?

Well, considering that 'aid' is coming from a country that robbed and pilaged India for some time, I do not. As someone not affiliated with either country, it is quite obvious that the only people objecting are English/UK/island folks.

A developing nation needs a horizon to aim at. You do not lift a country out of poverty by giving out money, you lift it out of poverty by building the economy, developing technology and building something to be proud of. Space is just a reminder of what can be done if you get your stuff together. Let us also not pretend that the cost of the space program could feed any relevant portion of the nation. Where do you think pretty much all fo that money went? Exactly, right back into the local economy.

[lajoswinkler]

Am I the only one who thinks they should not be spending money on sending stuff into space when foreign aid is paying to feed their people?

No, you are not.

India does not have mild problems. There's extreme powerty which will not be solved by advancement in high technology. It's not a country like Ireland. It's India.

Besides high class, high technology helps the middle class. The poor don't get anything, and India has a lot of extremely poor people.

It would be better for them to invest into governmental programs for better education, healthcare and more respect of human rights. That's how you lift a nation from gutters.

[Kryten]

Because, of course, this mission represents a massive proportion of the Indian governments education or healthcare budget, right?

[Fractal_UK]

Well, considering that 'aid' is coming from a country that robbed and pilaged India for some time, I do not. As someone not affiliated with either country, it is quite obvious that the only people objecting are English/UK/island folks.

As a UK taxpayer, I have no problems with India spending money on a space program and I totally disagree with the idea that their pursuit of a space program is incompatible with receiving aid funding. Insisting that an area remain technologically underdeveloped in order to receive aid funding sounds like a path to perpetual dependence where they are never able to make the technlogical strides needed to catch up and resolve their own problems.

India definitely has a long way to do in improving the standard of living of its people but hindering their technological development for very minor short term welfare gains is ultimately short sighted and counterproductive.

[Camacha]

It would be better for them to invest into governmental programs for better education, healthcare and more respect of human rights. That's how you lift a nation from gutters.

Did you ever consider the effect of space flight on people nation wide? How many Americans do you think aspired to become an engineer, pilot or something similar because they saw the Saturn V fly to the moon, or the space shuttle take to the skies? Lots, I can garantee you. The country is not the same anymore, and never will be.

A country needs a vision, something to be proud of and it needs to aim high. Space flight provides exactly that. Just solving immediate problems is not going to do a lot. Just look at Japan, that developed itself from the ruins of the second world war into a highly technological power. That is not because they just solved their current problems, that is because they aspired to be great.

As a UK taxpayer, I have no problems with India spending money on a space program and I totally disagree with the idea that their pursuit of a space program is incompatible with receiving aid funding. Insisting that an area remain technologically underdeveloped in order to receive aid funding sounds like a path to perpetual dependence where they are never able to make the technlogical strides needed to catch up and resolve their own problems.

I love this analyses. My nation has a colonial history too, and I would only be too happy if our former colonies decided to develop in the way India is doing. Unfortunately, our former colonies do not seem so aspiring or independent.

Edited November 8, 2013 by Camacha

[PakledHostage]

I don't want to argue this point either way, but I do want to point out that Wikipedia's list of countries by foreign aid received shows that India received $1.4 billion in foreign aid in 2007 and $2.1 billion in 2008.

Compare that to Israel (yes, Israel) that received $2.5 billion in 2007 and $2.4 billion in 2008.

Edited November 8, 2013 by PakledHostage

[vencaslac]

Every nation on Earth that can afford to do so should puruse a space program... $75 mil is not flashy at all tbh... the company I work for has a higher yearly turnover i suspect so even though it may sound like a lot of money to the individual it really is pocket change on a government level... and i think India should be commended for doing it so cheaply... how much does a dragon capsule cost?

[Tech Support]

No, you are not.

India does not have mild problems. There's extreme powerty which will not be solved by advancement in high technology. It's not a country like Ireland. It's India.

Besides high class, high technology helps the middle class. The poor don't get anything, and India has a lot of extremely poor people.

It would be better for them to invest into governmental programs for better education, healthcare and more respect of human rights. That's how you lift a nation from gutters.

I live in India, and personally, I feel sad that no matter what we do, the world can only look at our poor and not our progress, levels of education and healthcare are increasing every year but in the eyes of many all they see is " a nation in gutters" as you called us. and in reference to the aid the UK gives us ? last year The Indian airforce decided to buy 126 Dassault Rafale fighter aircraft over the Eurofighter Typhoon; the UK soon released a statement stating that aid to India will be reduced. now pray tell me, is this not Hippocratic ? the Indian Space Program runs on a shoestring budget and yet has done amazing things for the economy ( the commercial wing of ISRO launches satellites at a profit ) the program has profited the nation is numerous ways. India is not perfect, we have corruption and poverty but we are trying to remove that every day.

[Tech Support]

I also like to point out that most Indians do not view the UK as evil, many acknowledge the progress and technology that they bought us in the 400 years of occupation. our school books are filled with the achievements of both the East India Company and our freedom movement. great men like Robert Clive, Warren Hastings, Lord Rippon and Mountbatten all have statues, streets and buildings named after them.

[aeTIos]

'Mangalyaan' is something the press came up with the mission was announced (by analogy with the 'Chandrayaan' moon mission); ISRO refers to it solely as 'mars orbiter mission'. They seem to have something of a liking for extremely literal names; they actually called their first satellite launch vehicle 'satellite launch vehicle'.

I do totally understand them; I also have trouble naming my missions/launch vehicles.

Am I the only one who thinks they should not be spending money on sending stuff into space when foreign aid is paying to feed their people?

India's got 1.2 billion inhabitants. This mission costs $75 million; less than $1 per inhabitant. For less than $1, you can't even feed the whole population for a day; IMO it's better to spend the money on boosting science.

[Savage117]

Am I the only one who thinks they should not be spending money on sending stuff into space when foreign aid is paying to feed their people?

I have to agree with this guys question, I don't understand how a Mars mission can help a poverty stricken nation, in any way. How does studying Martian rocks and puttering around an alien red globe help anyone here on the ground other than furthering our knowledge of the universe. I'm not an economist and I still have no idea how a countries economy works but this sounds silly to me. If it works for India and somehow helps brings them out of poverty then that’s awesome, good for you India, but I can't see how.

I don't understand the people saying 75mil is chump change so there would be no point in spending it to help the country out of poverty. Yeah its not a lot on a country wide scale but it seems counterproductive to spend it on something that has no monetary gain. That’s kinda like saying I have twenty dollars so im gonna use that to go get some college classes instead of eating for a week. And it should be that simple, us Humans we complicate stuff way too much, me included.

Im not trying to insult India, I think its cool that at least someone is still taking an interest in our solar system despite any issues they are having, I just hope it isn't at the expense of their populace. And BTW the American space program did not start while the country was in a state of poverty so its probably not the best comparison. I don't know the whole story on India's situation so please consider that when reading my comments.

[Kryten]

Do you support shutting down NASA? America has got around half a million homeless people; surely having a space program with that level of extreme poverty isn't at all helpful?

What do you think brings people out of poverty? Jobs and education, not handouts. How many reasonable-paying jobs is a country going to have if the entire government agenda is growing and distributing subsidised food?

[Nibb31]

Paying for a space program funds highly-qualified domestic jobs. Those people then spend their money and pay taxes locally. It also provides a purpose for the education and science sectors, which also creates a lot of work and generates revenue.

Without a domestic space program, those engineers and scientists would have to find work overseas, where they would spend and pay taxes. Their contribution to India's economy would be minimal and India would stagnate technologically.