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[0.23.5] Realism Overhaul: ROv5.2 + Modlist for RSS 6/30/14

NathanKell

By NathanKell
in KSP1 Mod Releases

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AbeS

AbeS

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@SFJackBauer

1- Nathan made LiquidFuel the stock one in MFS, and added Kerosene as a new fuel. That breaks one of your cfg!

Here is the modified cfg if anyone wants it (it only adds Kerosene where LiquidFuel is)

2- With stock MFS there are no overheating problems, but with RealEngines some engines are exploding and there's no way to prevent it because you can't throttle them.

3- Not sure if this problem is from your mod but all engines show a min-thrust of 0 which can be confusing, because you don't know which engines are throttleable and which aren't.

Edited by AbeS
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Zander

Zander

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@SFJackBauer

1- Nathan made LiquidFuel the stock one in MFS, and added Kerosene as a new fuel. That breaks one of your cfg!

Here is the modified cfg if anyone wants it (it only adds Kerosene where LiquidFuel is)

2- With stock MFS there are no overheating problems, but with RealEngines some engines are exploding and there's no way to prevent it because you can't throttle them.

3- Not sure if this problem is from your mod but all engines show a min-thrust of 0 which can be confusing, because you don't know which engines are throttleable and which aren't.

I have found that the solution for exploding engines is to not attach them directly to a fuel tank. add an adapter in between the engine and the tank and it stops the overheating.

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jrandom

jrandom

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Did the solar panel fix get removed? I build a service module that tested fine on the ground as far as power requirements go (decoupled from the launch clamps so it was running on 100% solar power), but once in geosync orbit I'm short by almost 2 kW.

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jrandom

jrandom

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There's always a chance I missed something in the arithmetic. If it's fine, that just means I need to double-check my numbers. The satellites I just deployed look okay, so the problem is probably between my ears.

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SFJackBauer

SFJackBauer

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SFJackBauer, make sure your @PARTs are :Final, and also include a !MODULE[ModuleEngineConfigs] {} for each @PART before you do your MODULE {}, to account for the eventuality that there's an existing config. That should make a good safeguard.

Great to see the next version of RE out--can't wait to try it.

Done!

@SFJackBauer

1- Nathan made LiquidFuel the stock one in MFS, and added Kerosene as a new fuel. That breaks one of your cfg!

Here is the modified cfg if anyone wants it (it only adds Kerosene where LiquidFuel is)

Duh... fixed! Thanks!

2- With stock MFS there are no overheating problems, but with RealEngines some engines are exploding and there's no way to prevent it because you can't throttle them.

I assume its because of the increased thrust some engines have, although I have no idea what is the exact formula KSP uses to handle engine heating. Anyways next version should have sane values for all engines.

3- Not sure if this problem is from your mod but all engines show a min-thrust of 0 which can be confusing, because you don't know which engines are throttleable and which aren't.

I see, for now you should look at the MinThr (Min. Throttle) label on the VAB tooltips, under Engine Configs. The Min. Thrust refers to the stock way of setting min. thrust for the engines. Since the minimum throttle is tied to tech level, I guess MFS should handle it, or we just ignore the Min. Thrust label.

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jrandom

jrandom

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jrandom: no, it didn't. Darnit, panels are becoming my bane. I'll check in geostationary and see if I get the issue too.

I've just tried a new probe and I think there's something wrong with the big solar panels that generate 1.3 kW. I have two and that should give me 5x what I actually need to run the thing, but I'm still losing electric charge at around 1kW.

Edit: WAIT NO SCRATCH THAT -- I forgot to disable the active-cooling fins I had to add to an engine to keep it from overheating. After ejecting that stage, power generation more than keeps up with power consumption. I think on my previous vessel I didn't account correctly account for the BigG's generator -- it doesn't generate as much power as is listed in the VAB, methinks.

Edited by jrandom
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jrandom

jrandom

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Just discovered a big operational issue re: RealEngines and RemoteTech: there's no way to automatically execute maneuver nodes via the flight computer since the engines (at least the one's I've seen and am using) have a non-zero minimum thrust. RT won't be able to stop at the end of a burn. When there's signal delay involved, it makes it astoundingly difficult to execute the maneuver by hand, so... I'm going to have to disable signal delay for the time-being until a workaround can be found. :(

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SFJackBauer

SFJackBauer

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SFJackBauer, is the fixed RealEngines config up (eg. v3.1?) or is it still a work in progress? (The download I have doesn't have a version numbers so I don't know if I have the latest.)

That download link is always the latest, and yes the latest is 3.1. The fixes I mentioned above will be for 3.2.

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AbeS

AbeS

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I think I know how to fix the min Thrust shown on the VAB intstead of:


CONFIG
        {
            name = LiquidH2+LiquidOxygen
            maxThrust = 1033
            PROPELLANT
            {
                name = LiquidH2
                ratio = 0.745
                DrawGauge = true
            }
            PROPELLANT
            {
                name = LiquidOxygen
                ratio = 0.255
            }
            IspSL = 0.907407407407407
            IspV = 1.55925925925926
            throttle = 0.8
        }

removing throttle = 0.8 and adding minThrust = 0.8*maxThrust (with the numbers of course, minThrust = 826.4 in this case)

But I think that would break the MFS tech level modifications. But I thought the tech level wasn't really correct right now so it wouldn't be a problem yet :P

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NathanKell

NathanKell

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jrandom: uh, crap. Good point. Well, if you know your burn time and have an action group set to deactivate your engine, can't you set the flight computer to trip the AG at the specified time? Or does it only stage?

AbeS: I thought latest MFS fixed so configs are applied before GetInfo() is called for the partlist. I'll check.

ZacAttack42: Note, in the OP, where it says Realism Overhaul at present contains a set of engine configs from my Reaching for the Stars universe. Thus engines are repurposed as necessary. That said, the actual Shuttle OME only has a hair over twice the thrust (26.7kN). If you want real engines, use SFJackBauer's RealEngines (which, in the next RO, will replace RftSEngines as the default).

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jrandom

jrandom

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jrandom: uh, crap. Good point. Well, if you know your burn time and have an action group set to deactivate your engine, can't you set the flight computer to trip the AG at the specified time? Or does it only stage?

No idea, actually. I've been trying to set up a RemoteTech universe for months, but have been stymied at every turn by KSP updates, waiting for the mod to catch up, taking a break from KSP, lather, rise, repeat. :) Tonight is the first time I've had a fully-functional RT network set up since I started playing KSP. I'll futz around with the flight computer and see what's possible.

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chandawg

chandawg

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Do I have to disable any other configs besides RealFules/Engines.cfg and RealismOverhaul/RtfsEngines.cfg? I'm getting lockup during loading with RealEngines.
did you find out what was causing your loading issues, everytime I try realengines, I get a lock up, I tried deleting other engine configs, that might be conflicting, but still no-go.
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jrandom

jrandom

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did you find out what was causing your loading issues, everytime I try realengines, I get a lock up, I tried deleting other engine configs, that might be conflicting, but still no-go.

There've been so many lockups that I forget what the root cause was in this particular instance. Mostly likely it was an engine duplicated somewhere else in some other config.

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camlost

camlost

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RealShuttle v0.1

Okay, a week ago or more I said I'd share the shuttle I was working on, but then 0.23 struck and... well everything stopped working. Now that the hurricane is almost gone, I can share it. Its the result of much head-bashing and hours and hours of frustration. Its 2300 tons of pure sweat and blood.

For this it would be needed:

- B9 Aerospace

- latest FAR

- latest ExsurgentEngineering

- Hakari SSRB with HoneyFox EngineController plugin

- ComponentSpaceShuttle ExternalTank, SRB Decoupler and SRB Separatrons

- KW Rocketry for the super strut and nosecones

- pWings 0.6 (have to rename the procedural B9 control surface to pWings_B9_Aero_Wing_ControlSurface_SH_4m, otherwise it conflicts with B9)

- One engine from NovaPunch (its the NP_LFE_2_5m_BearcatSingle)

- RLA Stockalike alternative engine models

- DummyWeights - I refused to artificially increase the B9 parts masses, so to get closer to the real thing dry mass I had to use 10t of these ballasts)

- The usual suspects - RSS, MFS, StretchyTanks, RO and my RealEngines configs

>> Download <<

The two things that took absolutely the most of my time were the SRB separation and the re-entry. The SRB separation must be done wings level and with the vehicle at a stable attitude, or they WILL hit the wings. The re-entry I have done only from a 300km circular orbit - burn exactly at the longitude 125º 40' E (yes, the minutes of longitude are important). Burn until periapsis is at -40km, then turn around and hold 45º pitch until Mach 4, then take control and land.

I DO want to write a thorough guide, but for now I'm too mentally tired to do it. I have put up two videos with the ascent and re-entry, hopefully this will be useful.

Although this is very impressive, I think the Component Space Shuttle mod has a deficiency. In the real-life external tank, the LOx is on the top and LH2 is in the bottom. This configuration allows the overall CoM to be closer to the head, thus reducing the requirement for SSME gimbal range.

I think this mod is much better for our RO users. It contains external fuel tank parts and a few engines.

http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/55985-0-23-24-Dec-Space-Shuttle-Engines-V0-9-New-code-linear-aerospike-tweakables

I will upload a cfg for RO of this mod later, basically rescaling the tank and tweak some engines.

These are some pics from my shuttle flight weeks ago. I built the Orbiter first and found out it's about 1/3 the weight of the real thing, so I went on to rescale everything else to 1/3 reality.

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Edited by camlost
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AbeS

AbeS

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did you find out what was causing your loading issues, everytime I try realengines, I get a lock up, I tried deleting other engine configs, that might be conflicting, but still no-go.

You just need to remove the other engine configs and make sure you have Module Manager 1_5_6. The first time I installed RealEngines it didn't work because of that.

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chandawg

chandawg

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You just need to remove the other engine configs and make sure you have Module Manager 1_5_6. The first time I installed RealEngines it didn't work because of that.
Yep I think that was this issue, engines are working, THANK YOU now lol......is there something that I need to do about the alignment of the fuel tanks (stretchy tanks) there seems to be a small gap?
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SFJackBauer

SFJackBauer

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Although this is very impressive, I think the Component Space Shuttle mod has a deficiency. In the real-life external tank, the LOx is on the top and LH2 is in the bottom. This configuration allows the overall CoM to be closer to the head, thus reducing the requirement for SSME gimbal range.

I don't know if you checked in the VAB, but my rescale of the CSS external tank included a shift in the center of mass to account for this.

Yep I think that was this issue, engines are working, THANK YOU now lol......is there something that I need to do about the alignment of the fuel tanks (stretchy tanks) there seems to be a small gap?

Can you elaborate - it is a gap between the engine and the tank? Did you loaded a pre-built craft or this is while building a new one? If its the former, you may need to re-attach the engines because of the rescale.

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SFJackBauer

SFJackBauer

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I think I know how to fix the min Thrust shown on the VAB intstead of:


CONFIG
        {
            name = LiquidH2+LiquidOxygen
            maxThrust = 1033
            PROPELLANT
            {
                name = LiquidH2
                ratio = 0.745
                DrawGauge = true
            }
            PROPELLANT
            {
                name = LiquidOxygen
                ratio = 0.255
            }
            IspSL = 0.907407407407407
            IspV = 1.55925925925926
            throttle = 0.8
        }

removing throttle = 0.8 and adding minThrust = 0.8*maxThrust (with the numbers of course, minThrust = 826.4 in this case)

But I think that would break the MFS tech level modifications. But I thought the tech level wasn't really correct right now so it wouldn't be a problem yet :P

OK but with MFS or RealFuels, the engine thrust is variable from sea level to vacuum. Thus for example, the J-2 as you exemplified, at sea level the thrust is 361, and the min. thrust would be 288. I don't know the consequences of setting this way in the configs. That's why the throttle is the correct way of setting it.

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AbeS

AbeS

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I didn't really know if what I was saying was correct, you know more than me about this stuff anyways. I love the mod even if the min Thrust shows an incorrect value in the VAB!

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