EXTREME ION'ing - because it's not covalent, or very punny.

[Monty_Droppings]

THE EXTREME ION CHALLENGE

Ions are like that smart nerdy kid at the back of the class, they are incredibly efficient at what they do, but no one seems to appreciate it. This challenge is like graduation day, where that nerdy kid comes to the front of the class.

Scenario: The price of liquid fuel has skyrocketed across kerbin as the KOLFEP (Kerban Organization of Liquid Fuel Exporting Places) has called for a constraint on use of liquid fuel in the KSP, citing it as a waste. Jebadiah Kerman sets out on a simple quest, to step foot on other worlds and plant a probe (Flag) to see if there is any fuel in said bodies. KSP fully supports this mission fully, however they inform Jeb that there is just barely enough liquid fuel left to execute one more launch into orbit. It is clear to Jeb, he must FIRE TEH IONS... very slowly... out of the back of his spacecraft.

Rules:

-No guidance mods can be actively used to help you fly, however, mechjeb or similar plugins can be used to calculate delta -v's and such.

-No use of the debug hacks (part clipping, etc)

-Liquid fuel may be used to get into a 100 km orbit around kerbin, but cannot be used otherwise, see the exception further down. No alternate forms of propulsion may be used, this includes SRB's and decoupler boosting, nor may Jeb get out and land for himself, Exception is made for pushing with an EVA jetpack, assuming you only have the 30 units of fuel.

-No part packs may be used in the craft, except, for the sake of part count, the various Xenon tanks and Ion engine included in KSPX (They are simply upscaled, with weight and power/xenon consumption proportional to the original) However, parts that detract from you flight performance are allowed, if you wanna take this opportunity to go kethane probing or mapping, more power to you.

-A MK-1 Pod containing JEBADIAH KERMAN MUST BE USED in the lander design, No seats, No cockpits.

The Ionic- 4:

These are your bread and butter, the easy ones, you know, relative the rest of the kerbol system. It is not horrifically hard to design an ion craft to land on all of these and lift off.

Minimus - 500 points

Gilly-900 points

Bop-1750 points

Pol- 1200 points

The Bonus Bodies

Basically, these act as a multiplier on your end result, as these are practically nearly impossible to land and lift off from with ION power. You are therefore granted to carry 3000 delta-V worth of liquid fuel with you(3000 is enough to land and take off from anything on this list), HOWEVER, the catch is, you can ONLY use the LV-1/LV-1R (The "ant" engines) AND you may only use said engines for landing and taking off from THESE bodies. (Flag must be planted)

Multiplier Value (based on my experience with my ion probe design)

Laythe-2.7x (good luck landing on land without mechjeb) *snicker*

Moho- 2x (~2800DV to land +take off perfectly)

Duna-1.8X (Requires more TWT, has an atmosphere.)

Eeloo- 1.7x (Difficult encounter, low solar panel efficiency at such distance)

Vall- 1.5x (Your run of the mill bonus body)

Dres-1.25x

Ike- 1.1x

Mun- 1.05x

In the event you hit more than 1 multiplier, they are multiplied together and then applied the final score.

Leaderboard:

Mike the Mechanic-12919.5 points Laythe, Pol, Bop, Gilly, Minmus, Ike <--- Laythe ON ANT ENGINES, NUFF SAID.

Donfede - 6525 points Minimus-Vall-Pol-Bop-Gilly-Kerbin <-- MUST SEE. (Kerbal Al Clock used.)

Monty_Droppings - 4312.5 points. Dres-Pol-Bop-Minimus-Kerbin. (MJ was used for nodes)

Jasonden-1400 points Minimus-Gilly-Kerbin ( MJ for nodes)

Modded Leaderboard

NOTE: I WILL CONTINUE TO ACCEPT ENTRIES AND UPDATE THE LEADER BOARDS UNTIL OTHERWISE NOTED.

Edited February 8, 2014 by Monty_Droppings
Updated leaderboard

[TheGeoninja]

Going for Minmus right now it is going to take forever.

[maccollo]

This challenge appears incredibly simple because:

-Liquid fuel may be used to get into a 100 km orbit around kerbin, but cannot be used otherwise, see the exception further down.

The rules do not forbid the use of decouple boosting or solid boosters beyond 100 km orbits. If that isn't intentional you might want to amend that.

Edited December 24, 2013 by maccollo

[lump]

Ok i got a prototype going to eve, its funny i've been wanting to use ion engines more and this challenge gave me the push.

As you can see i'm using mechjeb to go to eve right now but this is the prototype, the official mk I will have mechjeb only for readouts and a nuclear generator to allow more dark side functions as well, and probably a docking port as well, it has 8000 or so m/s, Im going to call it the pOINeer :

Edit: ok orbiting eve now, gilly here i come

Edit Edit: i love ION engines, they are amazing, gilly intercept achieved

Ok landed on gilly

Time to create the official Ion craft

Edited December 24, 2013 by lump

[JumpsterG]

I'm currently working on the apocalypse challenge, but this one reminds me that I should give ions another go. Like many, I found the long burn times obnoxious, but I realize I probably was not thinking small enough.

[Monty_Droppings]

I'm currently working on the apocalypse challenge, but this one reminds me that I should give ions another go. Like many, I found the long burn times obnoxious, but I realize I probably was not thinking small enough.

A decent rule of thumb is 1 ion ~ 1 ton, 1 large ion (from KSPX) ~ 5 tons this rule keeps burns within an acceptable rate for me, be aware that de orbiting burns can be ~40 minutes, 10 mins with 4x warp.

I love the challenge of ions, the micromanaging panels+ long burns is kinda neat for me.

Ok i got a prototype going to eve, its funny i've been wanting to use ion engines more and this challenge gave me the push.

As you can see i'm using mechjeb to go to eve right now but this is the prototype, the official mk I will have mechjeb only for readouts and a nuclear generator to allow more dark side functions as well

Time to create the official Ion craft

I'm just saying, it more try limiting yourself to a PB-NUK or 2, it makes it much more intense as you have just enough EC to make slight course corrections, and it is intense knowing you know to land on the light side of the object, and then at the last minute retracting your solar panels.

Edited December 24, 2013 by Monty_Droppings

[lump]

oh yeah I've only got the one to prevent total blackouts, solar still powers the whole thing. I found that indeed the 40 minute burns were not at all a problem, most of them were in fact around 30 max which isn't that long at 4x, and after a whole mission you are wholly used to it, it comes naturally, i do love ion engines.

[Monty_Droppings]

oh yeah I've only got the one to prevent total blackouts, solar still powers the whole thing. I found that indeed the 40 minute burns were not at all a problem, most of them were in fact around 30 max which isn't that long at 4x, and after a whole mission you are wholly used to it, it comes naturally, i do love ion engines.

My Mission is going well, i just used my liquid stage to land on dres, dropped the radial stuff, landed on pol, I have 7.4k DV left, But after i land on Bop, gilly and minimus should be a piece of cake.

[Monty_Droppings]

Reserved for my mission pics.

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My current mission plan

Dres-Pol-Bop-Gilly-Minimus

Currently at Bop.

Didnt have the fuel to get to gilly, went straight for minimus.

Edited December 25, 2013 by Monty_Droppings

[pigletx2]

This challenge appears incredibly simple because:

The rules do not forbid the use of decouple boosting or solid boosters beyond 100 km orbits. If that isn't intentional you might want to amend that.

And Jeb can get out and land on some of the moons himself.

[Monty_Droppings]

This challenge appears incredibly simple because:

The rules do not forbid the use of decouple boosting or solid boosters beyond 100 km orbits. If that isn't intentional you might want to amend that.

Fixed, thanks for the catch.

[Monty_Droppings]

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That was rough.

Ended up doing Dres-Pol-Bop-Minimus-Kerbin.

Didnt have enough fuel to do gilly. Well that was 16 hours of my life well spent.

3450 x 1.25= 4312.5

[donfede]

Interesting challenge. Ion is one of my favorite elements of the game, encouraging pushing design limits.

Some questions:

a) Must all celestial bodies be visited in a single mission, or may multiple ion/ant missions be deployed?

If multiple missions may be deployed, can a "subset" craft be used for simpler bodies (no need to bring LF to The Ionic-4).

c) There is no specific mention of RCS. Could RCS be used for orbital docking operations? [expect not, but good to be clear]

d) How far must Jeb be returned to Kerbin: KLO , landed , $X ?

thanks again for the challenge,

donfede

Edited January 20, 2014 by donfede
typo fix

[Monty_Droppings]

Interesting challenge. Ion is one of my favorite elements of the game, encouraging pushing design limits.

Some questions:

a) Must all celestial bodies be visited in a single mission, or may multiple ion/ant missions be deployed?

If multiple missions may be deployed, can a "subset" craft be used for simpler bodies (no need to bring LF to The Iconic-4).

c) There is no specific mention of RCS. Could RCS be used for orbital docking operations? [expect not, but good to be clear]

d) How far must Jeb be returned to Kerbin: KLO , landed , $X ?

thanks again for the challenge,

donfede

a)It has to be a single "Mission" per say, as in the challenge really starts once you leave the 100km orbit. You may use multiple launches to get all the parts into orbit. However all your parts need to be docked together before you leave the 100k mark.

It has to be a single main vehicle, but you can do this Apollo style where the "lander" docks with a "main ship" kind of deal, and you could have several kinds of "landers" that get released after they have been used.

c) RCS cannot be used as a means of propulsion, however i will allow it to be used for docking fo the sole reason that monopropellent is inefficient and weighs an absolute ton.

d) Jeb needs to be returned, in his capsule in living form to the surface in kerbin.

I see you have the curious george tag, feel free to PM me or add me on steam if you have more questions and dont want to wait for a mod to approve your post.

I look forward to seeing your design if you deside to do some sort of an apollo style landers, especially considering ions only give half a kilonewton of thrust.

Edited December 25, 2013 by Monty_Droppings

[LostElement]

I've done every planet and back with an ION mother ship. unfortunately I do not have the craft file nor the picture... I guess you can take my word that I built it and went to every planet and back.... took me 2-3 days to complete.

[Monty_Droppings]

I've done every planet and back with an ION mother ship. unfortunately I do not have the craft file nor the picture... I guess you can take my word that I built it and went to every planet and back.... took me 2-3 days to complete.

How large was it weight wise? And were your lander ION too? And how much Delta V was the whole thing?I am seeing if i can go the other route and overengineer vs my bare bones philosophy.

[Jasonden]

Here's an entry hitting Minmus and Gilly. MechJeb used for navigational purposes only, never for flight. Basically I used the node editor and aerobrake nodes. I kind of liked landing by hand on these guys -- the gravity is so low that there's never any panic, and always time to recover from whatever predicament you've got yourself in. Okay, unless it's the extremely low TWR at Minmus (1.08 for me). Not sure how you could do the Jool moons with so little sunlight, but it must be possible. Oh, and I didn't use Jebediah -- this was on my Career game, and he is presently off on a Tylo sample return gig and was unavailable.

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[SpenSpaceCorp]

lol, one million points for landing on EVE and returning to Kerbin with only ion engines!

[kola2DONO]

Am i allowed to make a "mothership"?

[Monty_Droppings]

Here's an entry hitting Minmus and Gilly. MechJeb used for navigational purposes only, never for flight. Basically I used the node editor and aerobrake nodes. I kind of liked landing by hand on these guys -- the gravity is so low that there's never any panic, and always time to recover from whatever predicament you've got yourself in. Okay, unless it's the extremely low TWR at Minmus (1.08 for me). Not sure how you could do the Jool moons with so little sunlight, but it must be possible. Oh, and I didn't use Jebediah -- this was on my Career game, and he is presently off on a Tylo sample return gig and was unavailable.

http://imgur.com/a/9ATBj

3 quick tips for you:

1) Use the 1x6 or 2x3's instead of the Gigantor, they give more electricity per mass. Gigantor gives ~51.42 EC/Ton, While the 1x6's or 2x3's give you 114EC/Ton.

2) The key to landing on the joolian moons is to make sure you save them for last, saving just enough fuel to land at both and return, as you need to have your xenon tanks at minimum weight (IE like half empty), you can also just xenon "drop tanks" like in my design, and transfer fuel to the main tank before landing on a body where you need more T/W.

3) Try messing around with the micro landing struts instead of the LT1's. I used micro's to further save weight if it comes down to it.

Edited December 30, 2013 by Monty_Droppings

[Monty_Droppings]

Am i allowed to make a "mothership"?

See above post where i referred to this.

Or TLDR:

All parts must be docked together before leaving 100km kerbin orbit, mothership must still use ION power, each lander docked to the mothership must contain a MK1 capsule and Jeb needs to be EVA'd between each one if you plan to use multiple landers.

[metaphor]

these are mathematically impossible to land and lift off from with ION power

Oh really?

Edited December 31, 2013 by metaphor

[Guest Brody_Peffley]

Oh really?

but he couldn't get to orbit...

[metaphor]

but he couldn't get to orbit...

How about Ike then?

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Enough delta-v left over to land on Ike again, so it could land and take-off.

Working on a crewed one, but the part count is getting insane.

[Monty_Droppings]

How about Ike then?

http://imgur.com/a/Yfh2h

Enough delta-v left over to land on Ike again, so it could land and take-off.

Working on a crewed one, but the part count is getting insane.

Why did you hyperedit it into the ground if you could land it? landing with 1.02 T/W means incredibly long burns to kill velocity, and you only have 1300 DV in that thing, so that would be an incredible feat of flying, and you would need to lift nearly an extra 50% to carry the capsule, and you would still have only enough to take off and land on one moon, which means the part count would be absurd as you would need a mother ship to get there.

That was still the most impressive thing ive seen in a while, when i was thinking about it i was assuming 1 fuel tank for every ion engine.

Edited December 31, 2013 by Monty_Droppings