More core functionality, less about the mods

[TexRob]

I am not saying hinder mods, but I personally would love to see more core functionality in the LONG RUN. I understand the mod community represents an obscene amount of resources cumulatively, that you all can't compete with. That said, I'd hate to end up with a game that is just OK out of the box once it's released, and great with mods. I think a good example is a lot of MMORPGs. There have been mods for a lot of these that are all but required to play. When a mod becomes that popular, it should be incorporated into the core game IMHO.

Just some thoughts. Has this been discussed by Squad much?

[JumpsterG]

I think it's better than "just ok" out of the box right now, but that's just opinion.

Some mods lend themselves better than others to being stock implementation, either because they are in line with what Squad has said they want to do anyway or because they add to the game without fundamentally changing HOW it is played:

-FAR brings aerodynamics up to a more realistic implementation

-Deadly Reentry implements reentry effects

-KMP allows multiplayer

-Crew Manifest allows Kerbals to transfer easily between docked vessels without EVA.

Other mods add tools or requirements which can make the game experience very different. These cause the game to be more/less challenging and potentially involve features that players will not universally use:

-Kerbal Engineer and other stat-displaying mods.

-MechJeb and autopilots

-KOS programming

-RemoteTech

There's a LOT of grey area, and any individual mod could be discussed heavily on it's merits/drawbacks of becoming a stock feature.

In one of the recent interviews, Harvester said that he has not spent much time playing with mods. Still, I wouldn't put it past them to get inspiration from good ideas. The majority of the KSPX parts pack did get added to the stock parts list, for example, and I've heard that the spaceplane hanger itself only came about after C7 put together the existing spaceplane parts and the devs made spaceplanes a part of KSP (after not including them in the scope of the game, originally).

Out of curiosity, what makes you think Squad might not be adding more core functionality? They are in the midst of making career mode and will very likely be including new objectives, parts, and interesting things to do as a part of it.

[MisterFister]

What of your opinion on Kethane / KAS?

And speaking of Kethane, I remember months ago the talk about as-yet-unseen career mode being based on resource gathering instead of science gathering. Harvesting radioisotopes from Eve's oceans, jet fuel from Jool's upper stratosphere, etc. The lastest devblogs explicitly renounce this idea. i don't question their right to renounce anything, I'm just disappointed that maybe we couldn't "eventually" get both.

Perhaps a planned expansion down the road? KSP 2.0?

[Skyler4856]

What of your opinion on Kethane / KAS?

And speaking of Kethane, I remember months ago the talk about as-yet-unseen career mode being based on resource gathering instead of science gathering. Harvesting radioisotopes from Eve's oceans, jet fuel from Jool's upper stratosphere, etc. The lastest devblogs explicitly renounce this idea. i don't question their right to renounce anything, I'm just disappointed that maybe we couldn't "eventually" get both.

Perhaps a planned expansion down the road? KSP 2.0?

Ugh DLC....

[Seret]

Has this been discussed by Squad much?

Well, it's their job to make the core game as good as possible, so I'm going to say: yes.

If I understand your point correctly you're kind of saying that if there's a mod that almost everyone is using then it should be considered for merging with the stock game?

[Bobnova]

I would like to point at the stock airplane/spaceplane bits right now, which were, as I understand it, initially a mod someone made.

[JumpsterG]

What of your opinion on Kethane / KAS?

Kethane, to me, is a grey area. If implemented as-is (a way to refuel in-situation) as a stock feature, It wouldn't change the game fundamentally, only adding to existing features (good); but on the flipside, I feel it's a feature that would not be universally used by all players (not as good). Why: It's frankly a pain in the neck to set up Kethane supply lines when you have the alternative of just bringing more fuel (either on the same ship or via refuelers). Interestingly, this may change completely when career mode involves budgets... Free fuel just sitting around on Minmus becomes very attractive when you're paying a premium to fuel your rocket.

KAS is a little better. It doesn't change what a player will be doing, but gives new, attractive options for how to do them. It's only downside, in my opinion, is its complexity: Containers for parts, EVA grabbing and placing parts, winches with multiple attachments, connectors, EVA place-able pipes and struts. Essentially, KAS would need to be broken down into separate features and those individual features weighed for their "stock-fitness". Though I admit, even as-is, I wouldn't mind it being stock and made bug-free.

Ugh DLC....

I was about to go way off topic talking about predatory DLC vs fair DLC, the increasing cost of making games contrasting the decreasing prices offered to consumers, and the complication of companies and consumers doing business in the wake of an economic recession... Instead, I'll just say, do your research, follow your conscience, only pay when you know it's a good deal, and when you do really like something, pay for it, even if it's in the form of DLC. It's not always the devil.

[Stargate525]

I guess my biggest fear is how much the argument against a given feature is 'but there's a mod for it already so there's no point for Squad to waste their time.' That's... a really terrible argument.

[Capt Snuggler]

I guess my biggest fear is how much the argument against a given feature is 'but there's a mod for it already so there's no point for Squad to waste their time.' That's... a really terrible argument.

Hear, hear!

[TexRob]

Basically, sounds like most of us are all on the same page. Things like FAR are definitely the best examples. I think Kerbal Space Engineer is probably a good one too, as a science unlock. Deadly reentry would be a simple addition as a checkbox "Realistic re-entry physics" or something.

I think my main concern is avoiding the last two comments, the dreaded, "We don't need to do that, there is a mod for that". A lot of people don't like mods. I'm one of them. I prefer to play the game as the devs intended, but I want them to add this stuff to what they intend In the end, I'll add some if I feel I really need it. Like, I'm probably going to add KSE tonight because it's just proving a pain without that data to do more advanced things, but I'd prefer not to have to mod.