0% transmission value

[Roytronix]

Hey forum,

0.23 is great, but I'm running into what I hope is a mistake on my part. I've got a small probe with a SC-9001 experiment on it over Minmus. I can record the data fine, but when I go to transmit, the dialog tells me that the transmission will have no science value. It's not a glitch. If I transmit, I receive no science back at KSC.

Note the 0% transmission value.

Note the log: "+0.0 science added".

There's a Communotron 16 (antenna) and a DTS-M1 (first dish on the tech tree) onboard.

Any idea what I'm doing wrong?

[MrUberGr]

I believe that each time you transmit the same "experiment" it's value lessens. So, if you transmit the same things more than a few times then it has no value.

It would be like inventing the wheel again. Sure, it's something, but it doesn't have any actual value nowadays.

[DeMatt]

When v0.23 was released, it introduced a hard limit on (most) experiments' ability to transmit their data. I think (being as I have yet to not return experiments) it's the same amount as the first transmission.

You'll have to return the experiment, with the data onboard, to receive the rest of the science.

[Roytronix]

I believe that each time you transmit the same "experiment" it's value lessens. So, if you transmit the same things more than a few times then it has no value.

It would be like inventing the wheel again. Sure, it's something, but it doesn't have any actual value nowadays.

I'm aware of this feature, but this specific experiment (i.e. SC-9001 in Space Above Minmus) has only been performed by this probe. While I've used the SC-9001 before on the Mun, I don't see why it would affect an experiment over Minmus.

When v0.23 was released, it introduced a hard limit on (most) experiments' ability to transmit their data. I think (being as I have yet to not return experiments) it's the same amount as the first transmission.

You'll have to return the experiment, with the data onboard, to receive the rest of the science.

So what's the point of having any transmission devices on my probe at all? If I can't get any science from, say, a Duna probe without returning it, why have probes at all? I don't mean to sound like I'm angry at you (I'm not), but that certainly doesn't sound like what SQUAD wants KSP to be like.

Either way, this feature bug result of my own incompetence zero transmission value thing really tickles my jimmies.

[Superfluous J]

NOTE: I edited this post heavily for content about 2 hours after I made it. I made a mistake in my analysis of the picture but my basic point still stands: This is the 2nd time this experiment was done and transmitted, at least as far as the game is concerned.

I can see very clearly that you've gotten science from that experiment in that place before, and it looks like you transmitted it. In the first picture, the green upper bar has a bit of dark green to the right of it, and a bit of grey to the right of that. That bit of gray is there because you've already gotten partial credit for this experiment at this location. It's small, so I figure the only way you'd get that small a credit is from transmitting. It even looks to be about 20% which is what you get normally for transmitting from the materials bay.

So either one of two things happened:

1) You did this experiment and transmitted before, and forgot.

2) There is something that is making the game think - incorrectly - that you did this experiment before

The bug (if there is one) is NOT that transmission is worth 0%.

Edited January 2, 2014 by 5thHorseman

[DeMatt]

So what's the point of having any transmission devices on my probe at all? If I can't get any science from, say, a Duna probe without returning it, why have probes at all? I don't mean to sound like I'm angry at you (I'm not), but that certainly doesn't sound like what SQUAD wants KSP to be like.

Either way, this feature bug result of my own incompetence zero transmission value thing really tickles my jimmies.

The limit was introduced, among other changes, to reduce the "transmission spam" that characterized science gain in v0.22. I think this is the point where I suggest to you to untickle your jimmies with the concept that the game, the science system as a whole, and the transmission feature in particular, is still being balanced.

And then start flying fewer one-way probes, particularly within the Kerbin system, and start flying more round-trip manned missions.

[Roytronix]

I can see very clearly that you've gotten science from that experiment in that place before, and it looks like you transmitted it. In the first picture, the green upper bar has a bit of dark green to the right of it, and a bit of grey to the right of that. That bit of gray is there because you've already gotten partial credit for this experiment at this location. It's small, so I figure the only way you'd get that small a credit is from transmitting. It even looks to be about 20% which is what you get normally for transmitting from the materials bay.

Ohhh, that's what the grey area is. I was under the impression that the Lab Module would fill it up. I checked my Science Archives, and - lo and behold - there was a record for a previously transmitted experiment from a SC-9001 over Minmus. I'm a little confused, though: what does the dark green area mean?

...this is the point where I suggest to you to untickle your jimmies with the concept that the game, the science system as a whole, and the transmission feature in particular, is still being balanced.

And then start flying fewer one-way probes, particularly within the Kerbin system, and start flying more round-trip manned missions.

Jimmies are untickled, now that I understand what's going on. I don't like it when I don't understand something (hence, I avoid quantum mechanics). More manned missions coming right up!!

My expectations for 0.23 were different than what I got. I expected 0.23 to emphasize sending a probe before a manned mission, but the reason that's done in the real world is to evaluate the feasibility of a landing site - something that really doesn't need to be done...yet.

[KittyProgram]

This is hax

[Superfluous J]

Ohhh, that's what the grey area is. I was under the impression that the Lab Module would fill it up. I checked my Science Archives, and - lo and behold - there was a record for a previously transmitted experiment from a SC-9001 over Minmus. I'm a little confused, though: what does the dark green area mean?

All the green together is how much science is left. Light green is how much you'll get when you bring that container back and recover it. Dark green is what will be left. I'm not 100% sure but I think you'll get all of it when you do one more test there. It could though just be a fraction. I know they're trying to minimize the need to do lots of the same experiments in the same places, so my gut is telling me one more would get it. I personally wouldn't bother though, that same experiment will be worth a lot more in a fresh area.

[Roytronix]

All the green together is how much science is left. Light green is how much you'll get when you bring that container back and recover it. Dark green is what will be left. I'm not 100% sure but I think you'll get all of it when you do one more test there. It could though just be a fraction. I know they're trying to minimize the need to do lots of the same experiments in the same places, so my gut is telling me one more would get it. I personally wouldn't bother though, that same experiment will be worth a lot more in a fresh area.

Okay, got it. Thank you so much!

This is hax

No u r hax

[tomorrownight]

Ive had exactly this issue - Ive got into "deep space" near the sun for example and all of my experiments have a potential of large amounts (like 228 for example), but transmission is 0.0, but ive never been anywhere near here before. What can i do?

[tomorrownight]

Ive had exactly this same problem - Ive gone to somewhere ive never gone before (for example "deep" space around the sun) and i have experiments that would return up to 228 science but transmission would return 0.0. Ive never been here before, so how come i cannot use probes as a way of collecting science?

[Claw]

Ive had exactly this same problem - Ive gone to somewhere ive never gone before (for example "deep" space around the sun) and i have experiments that would return up to 228 science but transmission would return 0.0. Ive never been here before, so how come i cannot use probes as a way of collecting science?

Are you using any mods? Or have you had any installed before?

You can also check your science archives in the R&D facility to see if this experiment is marked as done.

[Superfluous J]

Ive had exactly this same problem - Ive gone to somewhere ive never gone before (for example "deep" space around the sun) and i have experiments that would return up to 228 science but transmission would return 0.0. Ive never been here before, so how come i cannot use probes as a way of collecting science?

"Deep" space around the sun is the same "biome" as "space around the sun but near the orbits of any of the planets."

You got the data near Kerbin (or wherever) and now it's not available to transmit. Not a bug in the game, just a misunderstanding of how "biomes" work.

[Claw]

"Deep" space around the sun is the same "biome" as "space around the sun but near the orbits of any of the planets."

You got the data near Kerbin (or wherever) and now it's not available to transmit. Not a bug in the game, just a misunderstanding of how "biomes" work.

Yeah, I didn't think of explaining it that way. If you are more than 1 Gm away from the Sun, then you're in "High Orbit" So if you've ever been just outside of Kerbin's SOI and did a solar experiment, then any further science in the Solar SOI above 1 Gm will yield the same results, even if you're almost out to Eeloo.

[cantab]

The first thing to do is to go to the science archives and see if you have the expected figure, more or less, from the experiment in the situation in question.

[tomorrownight]

But the science is huge, its the transmission that is the problem. Ive never transmitted before, but would loose all of that data because my transmission amount is 0.0

[Claw]

But the science is huge, its the transmission that is the problem. Ive never transmitted before, but would loose all of that data because my transmission amount is 0.0

The amount of science points is irrelevant to the % lost during transmission.

Double check your science archive. If you did science in "high orbit around the Sun," then check for a matching experiment in your science archive. You can click on the sun's picture to narrow down the list of science displayed.