[1.2] TweakableEverything 1.16-beta - For all your part tweaking needs

[BudgetHedgehog]

• Thrust increase would need to be very limited. Maybe up to 10%?
  
• There would probably need to be some penalty for "overdriving" the motors. Maybe increase heat generation?
  
• I feel like this might need a cost impact as well.

I'd go for the first or second - unless told by TE, players won't know or notice that their Isp is going down/weight is increasing, possibly resulting in confusion. I'd make it a very limited change though, possibly 15% to increase usability. The second one would be ok as well, increased heat generation makes sense, but that said, I guess once it gets to the stage of launch where the heat generated is becoming too much, you're way past the need for full throttle anyway.

[Skalou]

[...] players won't know or notice that their Isp is going down/weight is increasing, possibly resulting in confusion.

We can see this changes in the stage Dv (mass or isp).

[BudgetHedgehog]

We can see this changes in the stage Dv (mass or isp).

Which is provided by a different and discrete mod. Stock KSP lacks such a feature, as does TE right now. I don't think the solution to player confusion is to 'download this entirely different mod'. Granted, a large portion of the userbase has KER/MJ/VOID etc installed, but there'll always be outliers. If this route were chosen, a simple 'added cost/weight/Isp penalty' field in the context menu would be enough for people to see the side effects. Having KER etc installed would provide more in depth info, but it wouldn't be required.

[Skalou]

Players without a TWR/Dv reader mod can choose their engines the same way they do it now (moaar boosters?).

Display the modified parameters in the stock right click menu of the hangars is a good idea.

Edited September 15, 2015 by Skalou

[toadicus]

I agree with Obsessed that tweaking Isp when stock telegraphs such changes and their impact so poorly is outside the scope of this mod.

If KerboKatz' Afterburner already does what is being requested, maybe the right answer is for the requestor to write a patch to apply Afterburner to his rocket parts as desired. SpaceTiger already provides instructions for such in his thread.

[Skalou]

the link to the afterburner:

KerboKatz-Afterburner

[smjjames]

Hey Toadicus, I'm having a problem with TE and the VTOL engine from RoverDudes Karibou Rover pack. The thing is that the engine is unique that the nozzles on either side have their own separate independent gimbal. But somehow TE is removing the gimbal limiter slider for one of them.

How it's supposed to be:

With Tweakable Everything:

Output log: http://sta.sh/01wdgznnmlv

Edit: It's the same in-editor.

Edited September 17, 2015 by smjjames

[jwest]

Hello! I have a problem that I can reliably reproduce when I have Tweakable Everything 1.12 installed along with the Engine and Fairing staging toggles. If I uninstall them, I can no longer reproduce it. If I go to the VAB with the mods installed and right-click a MK1 Command Pod the right-click menu doesn't pop up like normal. Instead, everything gets slow for a while. The speed returns after a bit, but the menus don't. I won't be able to right-click and get them back afterward.

Curiously enough, a Stayputnik doesn't trigger the condition. Once the condition is triggered, though, right-clicking a Stayputnik still fails.

Here's the full log of a session where I had trouble: KSP.log

I'm happy to provide whatever other information I can, and I can't be certain that it's really Tweakable Everything that's causing the trouble, but any guidance you can give me will be greatly appreciated.

Thanks for all the hard work!

[toadicus]

smjjames, TE disables Squad's gimbal limiter in favor of our own gimbal tweak, but it isn't designed to work with multiple modules on the same part. I'll have to look in to how that works on Squad's end and accommodate.

jwest, I'm sorry to say I can't reproduce that in my test bed, so it's probably interference from another mod. The issue as reported in your log is a stack overflow; one of the tweakables on the Mk I pod (and probably many other parts) appears to be suffering from infinite recursion, but nothing I know about the code that controls it (in KSPAPIExtensions) says that should be very possible. You've got some other mods that are misbehaving; you should probably back up your save and try to isolate the minimum set of mods necessary to duplicate. Sorry I can't be more help!

- - - Updated - - -

Update: Let's think about gimbal tweaks for a bit. There's no "easy" way that is also necessarily right to accommodate gimbals (at least not that's as obvious as for engine fairings).

I can't easily apply multiple sliders during execution, because adding tweakables after part compilation is a huge nuisance. This means I can't generate tweaks on the fly based on how many gimbal modules I see. To do that, I'd need to communicate the number of gimbals to the part somehow, which AFAIK ModuleManager does not support, so patches would need to be done by hand for parts with multiple gimbals.

I could pretty easily just make one set of tweaks and apply them to all gimbals on the part. Since parts with multiple gimbals... probably... have balanced engines with balanced gimbals, that's... probably... safe. But it might not be, and since I don't have any mods with multi-gimballed parts, I don't really know.

I could also do a hybrid sort of solution where I steal Squad's sliders and use them for our gimbal range tweak, then apply the "Reversed" toggle to all of the above.

In general I'd hope the second option can work, because having multiple sliders with the same name is confusing and usually unhelpful. What do you guys think?

[jwest]

jwest, I'm sorry to say I can't reproduce that in my test bed, so it's probably interference from another mod. The issue as reported in your log is a stack overflow; one of the tweakables on the Mk I pod (and probably many other parts) appears to be suffering from infinite recursion, but nothing I know about the code that controls it (in KSPAPIExtensions) says that should be very possible. You've got some other mods that are misbehaving; you should probably back up your save and try to isolate the minimum set of mods necessary to duplicate. Sorry I can't be more help!

Actually, that was quite a bit of help. Thank you!

I narrowed it down to some oddball incompatibility between TweakableEverything and Orbital Decay. If I have both installed, the problem manifests. Without one of the two, or both, everything works just as I'd expect. I can leave anything either of these depend on in place and it's still just fine.

Here's a log of me reproducing it with the much abbreviated mod list: KSP.log

I'll take this to Whitecat106 if this falls outside of TweakableEverything's purview. I suspect that will be the case, since Orbital Decay is throwing another error.

Thanks again for your help!

[BudgetHedgehog]

Toady, what would cause

MissingMethodException: Method not found: 'ToadicusTools.Tools.GetSceneRootPart'

to be spammed in the log? I'm getting a lot of it all the time, want to know what to fix.

[Drew Kerman]

fixed last month in a dev build. There's a more recent one but I haven't used it

[BudgetHedgehog]

Huh, could have sworn I updated.. Mind you, with all the dev builds of AR, TE and TT, it's getting a bit out of hand - need full releases!

[TK421d]

is there any reason that you have a config for docking ports adding to the staging tree? as far as i can tell all this does is add clutter, as they dont actually perform any action when staged, and it is impossible to turn them off, or remove them from the tree either before or after staging them.

yes i know there is a toggle switch, but it does nt work. currently i've had to delete the module from the config to get rid of it (been working on stations lately, and lots of ports = LOTS of staging clutter)

[toadicus]

ObsessedWithKSP, I might get to that this weekend. First week in a couple of months that I'm not expecting to be working all 7 days.

BobsYerUncle, docking ports should decouple when staged, and the staging list toggle should either add or remove them from the staging list. I just tested it on my end and everything worked fine. Have you tried duplicating the issue with no other mods installed? If so, please provide a log (Windows: \path\to\KSP_win\KSP_Data\output_log.txt; Linux: ~/.config/unity3d/Squad/Kerbal\ Space\ Program/Player.log; Mac: ~/Library/Logs/Unity/Player.log). If not, please do, and let me know the minimum set of mods you need to cause the problem. Thanks!

[TK421d]

i did not actually try staging them outside of the VAB w/o other mods installed, only tried the toggle button during construction. at the time the only other mods installed were your adaptive node mod, Kips universal ports, tweakscale, and MM.

there were too many parts dependant on parts mods to load the station parts to test, i'll build something stock tomorrow and see if they still wont disconnect on the launchpad.

[toadicus]

TweakableEverything has been updated to version 1.13! This update adds the new TweakableControlSurfaces module, and fixes the names of fuel pump action group items.

CHANGELOG:

v.1.13 [2015-10-02]
* New module!  TweakableControlSurfaces lets you limit stock control surfaces.
* TweakableFuelPumps: Pump actions should no longer be named "True Pump", but should correctly get their resource's name.
* Updated for ToadicusTools refactor.

[YauS]

I cannot able to close cargo bay after update!

[Space_nico]

I cannot able to close cargo bay after update!

Same problem.

[BudgetHedgehog]

Just a heads up, todays 1.0.5 announcement features the following bugfixes/tweaks as:

- Make crossfeed toggling on docking ports persistent and also available in the editor (and as actions).

- Fixed ladder extend/retract failing after a load in the editor.

Looks like AntennaRange is not the only mod that stock are appropriating

[Skalou]

Thank's for the update Toadicus.

really welcome features.

I cannot able to close cargo bay after update!

strange, everythink works fine on my side (in flight or VAB or after revert).

[toadicus]

Skalou, glad you're enjoying it!

All, I noticed the cargo bay issue myself during play a couple of days ago; I've got it fixed internally and will release an update soon.

[Skalou]

great,

Unfortunatelly i think i have detected a bug with the new TweakableControlSurfaces:

it doesn't work anymore with all my modded control surfaces (worked fine with the previous version of TE),

for example:

theOPT spaceplane one's or the Procedural Dynamics - Procedural Wing control surfaces (named PControlsurface in game).

The "control surface" descriptions doesn't appear anymor in the right click menu nor the selectable axis (yaw, pitch,...)

Am i alone with it?

If you need more info (log or whatever you need) or tests, you can ask me.

Edit:

I tried with a new KSP instal, just TE and OPT via CKan (and their dependancies: ModuleManager, firespiter, Toadicus tool...), and it works fines, i will investigate more...

Edit2:

I have found the problem, i uninstalled FAR a few month ago (with CKAN!) but it let me the FAR folder in the GameData with only 3 useless .cfg inside (no .dll or other stuff), once removed everything becomed fine again!

Strangely it worked fine with the old TE version...

Sorry for the inconvenience.

A remark too, i use also the stockbug fix mod, it also have this feature too (called authority in game when the plus option is enabled) but in a different manner (see the ModuleControlSurfaceFix for more info),

However it seems it doesn't conflict, the stock bug fix module seems to just override the TE tweak (as it wasn't here).

So it's OK.

Edited October 7, 2015 by Skalou

[toadicus]

I should rewrite the controlsurfaces patch to disable that module when FAR is installed, because FAR has its own stuff. Might disable when Claw's mod is around, too. Thanks for the report.

[LostOblivion]

Is The bug fixed where engine fairings simply disappear when staging?