Wobbly rockets - Now 1.09 - 2 metre parts, verniers, payload fairings, MUCH more

[Sunday Punch]

:probe: New version of my parts pack! :probe:

And it's a major overhaul too. I've now got 2 metre parts as an intermediate size in between the existing 1 and 3 metre sizes (should be compatible with the other third party 2 metre parts), decoupler shrouds and adapters to make all the different sizes work together, two new 3 metre multi-adapters, a nose cone with a parachute slot, vernier rockets, a light decoupler, an aerodynamic radial stack decoupler, a new 3 metre tank, a modular 2 metre payload shroud system and probably some others I forgot about.

Here's some example rockets using the new parts:

Change list for 0.9 - 23 new parts!

New part - 1, 2 and 3 metre adapter frustums - 6 parts

New part - 2 metre decoupler shrouds - 2 parts

New part - Modular 2 metre payload fairing - panel segment and nosecone segment

New part - 2 metre fuel tank

New part - 2 metre to 2X1 metre adapter

New part - 3 metre to 2 metre narrowing adapter

New part - 2 metre to 1 metre narrowing adapter

New part - 3 metre decoupler shroud

New part - 3 metre to 5X1 metre adapter (fits within 3 metre footprint)

New part - 3 metre to 7X1 metre adapter (fits within 3 metre footprint)

New part - Aero decoupler, radial decoupler with 1 metre stack attach point

New part - Long 3 metre fuel tank

New part - Light decoupler

New part - 1 metre to parachute adpater

New part - Vernier radial SAS unit

New part - Delta planform fin

Reworked configs for fuel tanks

Reworked masses of many parts

Greatly increased strength of 3 metre parts (40X)

Switched couplers and adapters to 'Strut' module

Sunday Punch's parts package v 1.09 contents

*1, 2 and 3 metre adapter frustums - 6 parts

*2 metre decoupler shrouds - 2 parts

*Modular 2 metre payload fairing - panel segment and nosecone segment

*2 metre fuel tank

*2 metre to 2X1 metre adapter

*3 metre to 2 metre narrowing adapter

*2 metre to 1 metre narrowing adapter

*3 metre decoupler shroud

*3 metre to 5X1 metre adapter (fits within 3 metre footprint)

*3 metre to 7X1 metre adapter (fits within 3 metre footprint)

*Aero decoupler, radial decoupler with 1 metre stack attach point

*Long 3 metre fuel tank

*Light decoupler

*1 metre to parachute adpater

*Vernier radial SAS unit

*Delta planform fin

*1 metre to 3 metre adapter

*3 metre to 1 metre adapter

*Aerodynamic nosecone

*3 metre decoupler

*1X3 metre to 5X1 metre coupler

*3 metre engine cluster

*Dual coupler, 2 versions

*Quad coupler

*Escape tower

*3 metre fuel tank

*Lateral coupler, 2 versions

*Medium liquid engine

*Medium solid motor

*NERVA engine

*RCS module

*Retrorocket module

*Small fuel tank

*Small solid motor

*small liquid engine

*Decoupler shroud, 3 lengths

*Decoupler matching decoupler shrouds appearance

*long 1 metre fuel tank

*high thrust liquid engine

*lateral tricoupler, 2 versions

*3 metre decoupler shroud for 4X liquid cluster

Get Sunday Punch's KSP parts v1.09 here!

[HarvesteR]

What version of the game are you using? In 0.7.3 there was a big stability problem with side-mounted parts. This was corrected in version 0.8.

If you're on version 0.8, I suspect it might be related to the mass of the new part (might be too much), or maybe the position of the part's center of mass (version 0.8.1 addresses this, and sets the center of mass of all parts to their origin, as defined in the 3D model).

Hope this helps,

Cheers

[Sunday Punch]

Thanks for the reply. I'm using 0.8, reducing the mass of the part doesn't seem to help unfortunately. Here's an image of what's going on:

The radially connected boosters seem to be OK, but the one in the centre of the stack is way off centre of the SAS module above it. You can't see it in a still image but it's wobbling all over the place, which obviously is bad for keeping the rocket flying straight! Sometimes it goes so far out of whack, everything on top of the motor falls completely off the side, it's hard to get a screenshot of though because everythign explodes a fraction of a second later when that happens.

Thanks for your help!

[molo]

Care to share that part? If for no other reason than I want more variety in my launch disasters.

[Sunday Punch]

Sure, you can get them and the other parts I've made here:

http://filesmelt.com/dl/Sunday_Punchs_KSP_parts.zip

edit: Thought I'd add descriptions and some images of my new parts.

-Aerodynamic nosecone. Doesn't do much but I thought flat topped SRBs looked dumb so you can stick this on top of your external boosters.

-A medium sized SRB. It's a little wobbly!

-3 metre diameter fuel tank, stackable.

-3 metre diameter liquid engine cluster.

-Adapters for normal 1 metre to my 3 metre modules, going both ways. Fuel flows through them.

-A 3 metre to 5X1 metre coupler.

[guerilla_gearhead]

Sunday Punch,

I'm having trouble getting your 3 metre decoupler to work. I want to use it to separate the 3m parts you've included (i.e. 3m fuel tank and 4-engine cluster) but it doesn't want to cooperate as far as attaching anything to the bottom of it. Is there a trick to this or am I plain doing it wrong?

Edit: I also can't get the 5x1 middle engine mount to work. I tried lowering the node in the config and still no luck, it just refuses to attach. Any ideas?

Oh, and I'm using v 1.02 of your parts pack.

E2: Ok, so I managed to fix both problems by allowing collisions for the involved parts. If this is the only way to get them working so far, would you be able to enable this by default for future parts that have this issue?

[Sunday Punch]

Yeah I've started allowing collisions for most of the new parts I've made as it makes things easier like that. I don't know why the centre node of the 5x1 adapter is so finicky, it's no different from the outside nodes but it won't allow attachments unless you attach something to one of the other nodes first, then drag it onto the centre node. Using that workaround lets you put stuff on there but it's still a pain.

Which 3 metre decoupler do you mean? I did make one of those but didn't include it in the pack because I couldn't get it to allow any attachments to the bottom node without putting the node 2 metres beneath the the collision mesh, which looked silly.

Here's the 1.02 version of my parts for others that don't have them.

http://filesmelt.com/dl/Sunday_Punchs_KSP_parts_v1_02.zip

edit: Hahaha oh I see, I accidentally included the 3m decoupler in the new version. Whoops! I didn't mean to do that because it's pretty broken.

[guerilla_gearhead]

Here's the one I put on my Saturn V mock up - thanks for making these parts by the way, these seem to have already doubled the possibilities from the stock parts

She flew perfectly like this, if not slowly and lopsided, separation even looked kinda like the real thing (wish it were possible for the shroud to cover the engines, too!).

Although there wasn't anything I could see to do with the coupler, all I had to do was enable collision for the part I wanted to connect beneath (in this case, the fuel tank). Playing with collision does seem to open alot of doors, if not for the flame broiled death setbacks it occasionally can cause

[Sunday Punch]

Yeah disabling collisions lets it work. I'm going to make a smaller liquid engine, that should make a good stand in for the J2s on your Saturn V replica's second stage!

And I definitely agree with you about the decouplers shrouding the engines, that would look great. It would be possible but the engines would all have to be a known, standard height.

[Sunday Punch]

New parts collection! The changes for version 1.03 are

-Dual and quad couplers now flow fuel

-3 metre decoupler works now

-Added 2 lateral couplers

-Remade medium solid motor and nosecone because I was unhappy with their quality

The new solids are less wobbly, but there's still some residual instability. I suspect it might be inherent in long, thin motors.

Complete parts list includes:

*Medium solid rocket booster

*Aerodynamic nosecone

*3m fuel tank

*1m to 3m, 3m to 1m adapters

*3m to 5X1m adapter

*3m decoupler

*3m liquid 4 engine cluster

*Quad coupler

*Dual coupler, 2 rotations

*Escape tower

*Lateral coupler, 2 rotations

Sunday_Punchs_KSP_parts_v_1_03.zip

[Rick]

And I definitely agree with you about the decouplers shrouding the engines, that would look great. It would be possible but the engines would all have to be a known, standard height.

What if you made a special decoupler that has no collision that acts as a shroud?

(ie, it would have a top node inside the mesh where you would place the engine on)

[Sunday Punch]

What if you made a special decoupler that has no collision that acts as a shroud?

(ie, it would have a top node inside the mesh where you would place the engine on)

That's how I would build it, but you would have the problem of either the shroud being too short and leaving a gap (for long engines), or overlapping the engine mesh and causing ugly z-fighting (for short engines).

[Rick]

No way around that with how parts are currently done, may as well just have them made to order for specific engines for the time being.

[Sunday Punch]

I suppose I could do one just for the liquid engine, since that's the only one that looks really goofy at the moment with no fairing around it.

[HarvesteR]

Hi,

First of all congrats on the parts! they're awesome!

I want to tell you all about what I'm planning to once and for all control the wobbliness of parts, in the best way possible.

My plan is to create a new type of part, called Strut Connector.

This part is different from the others so far, because it is a compound part. That is, once you place it (it will attach to the surface), you immediately get a second part to attach. That is Connector B.

So, once connectors A and B are in place, a truss will be created between them, allowing you to essentially strap any loose parts of your rocket.

This part also will detect any controlled separations, and jettison the truss when that happens. If the stage breaks off in an uncontrolled manner, they won't separate.

This could be in as soon as the update after this one.

Also, Fairings are planned as an official feature as well. They're a special set of parts, with a new set of attachment options, that will enable pacing them onto exposed parts like liquid engines. They can even be activated to break apart when it's time to expose whatever's inside it.

Cheers

[Sunday Punch]

That all sounds fantastic HarvesteR, I'll be hanging out for the new version now .

I heard that you might be including community-made parts in the new version? You're more than welcome to include any or all of the parts I've made if that's the case.

[HarvesteR]

I didn't say I was going to include them, but I've downloaded the parts pack to make sure the new features are compatible with them.

But if I have your permission, we might just add them. (your name will still be in the Author field)

BTW, while the cfg overview is still lacking from the wiki, I must tell you that there will be a new parameter for the cfg in version 0.8.1

This parameter is called stackSymmetry, and it's used to enfore a specific symmetry mode when stacking parts onto an existing one.

So, if, for example, your 1-to-2 coupler has the bottom nodes equally spaced, you can use 2-sided symmetry to build both sides at the same time.

Needless to say, this would only work with 2 sided symmetry, so I set up this stackSymmetry parameter to enforce n-sided symmetry on a per-part basis.

This only applies to stacked parts, and if omitted or set to 0, it will enforce no symmetry when stacking.

I tell you because I tested with the 1-to-3 couplers from the first parts pack, and they need this parameter now to be able to stack parts symmetrically under it.

Cheers

[Psyckosama]

For some reason I can't link parts to a number of your parts, such as the duel, Quad, and five point engine couplers.

[Sunday Punch]

I didn't say I was going to include them, but I've downloaded the parts pack to make sure the new features are compatible with them.

But if I have your permission, we might just add them. (your name will still be in the Author field)

I think it would be great for as many people as possible to have as many parts of possible, since having lots of parts that can all work together greatly increases the variety of possible rocket designs. I'd be delighted if you included the parts I've made in newer versions of KSP. Feel free to make any necessary modifications to them also.

For some reason I can't link parts to a number of your parts, such as the duel, Quad, and five point engine couplers.

Really? Is that with any part at all, or only with certain parts? If all else fails, turn off collisions on the part you're trying to attach (set allowcollisons to 1 in the part.cfg).

The 5X1m coupler has an issue with the centre node, attach your part to one of the side nodes then move it to the centre one as a workaround (by the way if one of the devs could tell me how to fix this I'd be very grateful).

[Red]

Could someone mirror it to a different website? Filesmelt isn't working for me.

[Sunday Punch]

Try this mirror

http://mod.gib.me/kerbal/mods/Sunday%20Punch/Sunday_Punchs_KSP_parts_v_1_03.zip

[Red]

That worked. Much appreciated.

[HarvesteR]

Yeah, those nodes can be a problem to get right sometimes...

What I did on most cases was to use a collider mesh that's slightly smaller than the visual mesh itself, so there is some clipthrough between connecting parts, and the node is still outside enough to allow good connections.

As an alternative to disabling the collision detection, you can tweak the 2nd parameter of the offending attachment node. That's the Y position of the node, and you can tweak it to bring the node up or down.

Cheers

[Fusek]

I want to thank you for your great modules Sunday Punch! But I must say that the more toys I can play with, the harder this game gets! I can ahrdly get a rocket into orbit anymore Great stuff.

[guerilla_gearhead]

I'm going to make a smaller liquid engine, that should make a good stand in for the J2s on your Saturn V replica's second stage!

That would be awesome! The current liquid engines look close enough to the F1's I think (any bigger wouldn't look right with your tanks). At some point I'd like to try and skin the fuel tanks and play with the engine thrusts to get it as close to the real thing as we can for now. Probably won't be for a while but with Harvester possibly adding the fairings in the next update I wanna wait anyways.